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re: Confederate Heroes: I know you right wingers hate participation trophies

Posted on 8/18/17 at 11:51 am to
Posted by RockyMtnTigerWDE
War Damn Eagle Dad!
Member since Oct 2010
108970 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 11:51 am to
quote:

Native Americans lost. Should we remove their statues and monuments?


Posted by Slevin7
Member since Sep 2015
2800 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 11:57 am to
quote:

why can 20 year olds fight for their country but not drink a beer??!1


Why do we drive on a parkway and park in the driveway.
Posted by TigrrrDad
Member since Oct 2016
8109 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:20 pm to
Having this debate right now on facebook. Guy is trying to say Conderate statues were put up to remind the blacks who is in charge. My response: "So statues of the guys who led the losers of the war that led to abolishing slavery will remind the blacks who is in charge...makes sense."
This post was edited on 8/18/17 at 12:21 pm
Posted by imjustafatkid
Alabama
Member since Dec 2011
65770 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:23 pm to
quote:

That's before we even take into account WHY these statues were erected, and when.


They were erected because these were great Americans.
Posted by TheLSUTiger
Member since Dec 2011
594 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:28 pm to
quote:

You have something against Vietnam memorials too?


Your comparison is not a good one. The Vietnam memorial is a list of the soldiers who died in the war. It does not depict the generals leading the war.
Posted by HeyHeyHogsAllTheWay
Member since Feb 2017
12458 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:28 pm to
quote:

We learn about it in war college when talking about other cultures...


Yes, you learned , as did I though not in the same setting, something that these idiots don't seem to get.


MOST people who fight in any war aren't fighting for whatever evil cause the leaders of wherever began their fight over. Probably 70% of southerners who died in the Civil War didn't even fricking own slaves, they fought because their home was attacked. Most of them no doubt would have gladly traded ending slavery for the Union Army leaving their states. But that decision wasn't theirs to make.

Posted by Wtodd
Tampa, FL
Member since Oct 2013
68544 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:29 pm to
quote:

so why do you want to have loser trophies?

Just to frick with you
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
299196 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:29 pm to
quote:

so why do you want to have loser trophies?


Dump the Vietnam memorial and the Alamo
Posted by texashorn
Member since May 2008
13122 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:42 pm to
Affirmative action = participation trophy
Posted by Zach
Gizmonic Institute
Member since May 2005
117562 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:46 pm to
quote:

so why do you want to have loser trophies?


For the same reason I love documentaries about Germany, Japan and Napoleon. I like learning about history.
Posted by Errerrerrwere
Member since Aug 2015
44412 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:48 pm to
quote:


so why do you want to have loser trophies?


What are you talking about? They have always been recognized as US veterans. They still are today. No matter how much you whine about it.
Posted by SlapahoeTribe
Tiger Nation
Member since Jul 2012
12666 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 12:59 pm to
quote:

why do you want to have loser trophies?

Would you call this a "loser trophy?"



Wallace Monument in Scotland
Posted by MastrShake
SoCal
Member since Nov 2008
7281 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 1:22 pm to
quote:

They were erected because these were great Americans.
Alexander Stephens was the vice president of the confederacy before, during, and after the civil war. he has one statue in the US Capitol building...



and another at his state park in georgia

heres part of the speech he gave to sell the new confederate constitution...

quote:

Those ideas (that 'all men are created equal'), were fundamentally wrong. They rested upon the assumption of the equality of races. This was an error.

Our new government is founded upon exactly the opposite idea; its foundations are laid, its cornerstone rests, upon the great truth that the negro is not equal to the white man; that slavery subordination to the superior race is his natural and normal condition.

This, our new government, is the first, in the history of the world, based upon this great physical, philosophical, and moral truth. This truth has been slow in the process of its development, like all other truths in the various departments of science. It has been so even amongst us. Many who hear me, perhaps, can recollect well, that this truth was not generally admitted, even within their day. The errors of the past generation still clung to many as late as twenty years ago. Those at the North, who still cling to these errors, with a zeal above knowledge, we justly denominate fanatics. All fanaticism springs from an aberration of the mind from a defect in reasoning. It is a species of insanity. One of the most striking characteristics of insanity, in many instances, is forming correct conclusions from fancied or erroneous premises; so with the anti-slavery fanatics. Their conclusions are right if their premises were.

They assume that the negro is equal, and hence conclude that he is entitled to equal privileges and rights with the white man. If their premises were correct, their conclusions would be logical and just but their premise being wrong, their whole argument fails.

I recollect once of having heard a gentleman from one of the northern States, of great power and ability, announce in the House of Representatives, with imposing effect, that we of the South would be compelled, ultimately, to yield upon this subject of slavery, that it was as impossible to war successfully against a principle in politics, as it was in physics or mechanics. That the principle would ultimately prevail. That we, in maintaining slavery as it exists with us, were warring against a principle, a principle founded in nature, the principle of the equality of men. The reply I made to him was, that upon his own grounds, we should, ultimately, succeed, and that he and his associates, in this crusade against our institutions, would ultimately fail. The truth announced, that it was as impossible to war successfully against a principle in politics as it was in physics and mechanics, I admitted; but told him that it was he, and those acting with him, who were warring against a principle.

They were attempting to make things equal which the Creator had made unequal.

In the conflict thus far, success has been on our side, complete throughout the length and breadth of the Confederate States. It is upon this, as I have stated, our social fabric is firmly planted; and I cannot permit myself to doubt the ultimate success of a full recognition of this principle throughout the civilized and enlightened world.

As I have stated, the truth of this principle may be slow in development, as all truths are and ever have been, in the various branches of science. It was so with the principles announced by Galileo it was so with Adam Smith and his principles of political economy. It was so with Harvey, and his theory of the circulation of the blood. It is stated that not a single one of the medical profession, living at the time of the announcement of the truths made by him, admitted them. Now, they are universally acknowledged.

May we not, therefore, look with confidence to the ultimate universal acknowledgment of the truths upon which our system rests? It is the first government ever instituted upon the principles in strict conformity to nature, and the ordination of Providence, in furnishing the materials of human society.

Many governments have been founded upon the principle of the subordination and serfdom of certain classes of the same race; such were and are in violation of the laws of nature. Our system commits no such violation of nature’s laws. With us, all of the white race, however high or low, rich or poor, are equal in the eye of the law. Not so with the negro. Subordination is his place. He, by nature, or by the curse against Canaan, is fitted for that condition which he occupies in our system.

The architect, in the construction of buildings, lays the foundation with the proper material-the granite; then comes the brick or the marble. The substratum of our society is made of the material fitted by nature for it, and by experience we know that it is best, not only for the superior, but for the inferior race, that it should be so.

It is, indeed, in conformity with the ordinance of the Creator. It is not for us to inquire into the wisdom of His ordinances, or to question them. For His own purposes, He has made one race to differ from another, as He has made “one star to differ from another star in glory.”

The great objects of humanity are best attained when there is conformity to His laws and decrees, in the formation of governments as well as in all things else. Our confederacy is founded upon principles in strict conformity with these laws. This stone which was rejected by the first builders “is become the chief of the corner” the real “corner-stone” in our new edifice.


so what was the greatest part of this great Americans speech, in your opinion.
This post was edited on 8/18/17 at 4:16 pm
Posted by MastrShake
SoCal
Member since Nov 2008
7281 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 1:32 pm to
quote:

Native Americans lost. Should we remove their statues and monuments?
native americans didnt start a war with the US.
Posted by Zach
Gizmonic Institute
Member since May 2005
117562 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 2:06 pm to
quote:

native americans didnt start a war with the US.


Yes, they did.
Posted by bencoleman
RIP 7/19
Member since Feb 2009
37887 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 2:08 pm to
quote:

That's a weird way to look at a losing slaveholders' rebellion against the US


Take it up with the people that were alive when the monuments went up. Until then shut the frick up loser.
Posted by MastrShake
SoCal
Member since Nov 2008
7281 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 2:10 pm to
quote:

Yes, they did.
yeah they had the nerve to be on our land for thousands of years before we got here or even knew it existed.

those frickers had it coming.
Posted by JohnnyT
Central Texas
Member since Feb 2005
1843 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 2:30 pm to
quote:

Alexander Stephens was the vice president of the confederacy before, during, and after the civil war. he has one statue in the US Capitol building...
I wasn't aware this guy was a subject for any statues or memorials, nor his position on slavery or blacks. I suspect I'm with the majority in this respect.

Given that, and assuming you happen to be white, you are either on top of your Google game or have the most highly refined case of white guilt around. Most people couldn't have told you who Stephens was or who the VP of the Confederacy was even if there was considerable award involved, much less able to state his position vs. blacks.

We need to quit looking for reasons to be offended.

Posted by mizzoubuckeyeiowa
Member since Nov 2015
39415 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 2:33 pm to
quote:

so why do you want to have loser trophies?


It was a Civil War; ergo you need both sides to tell the whole story, lest we forget.
Posted by SlapahoeTribe
Tiger Nation
Member since Jul 2012
12666 posts
Posted on 8/18/17 at 3:08 pm to
quote:

wasn't aware this guy was a subject for any statues or memorials, nor his position on slavery or blacks. I suspect I'm with the majority in this respect.

He was a rabble rouser (note he was chosen to be the VP and not the P); as such he is one of the favorite "look what he said, they're all evil" men of the Confederacy. He's mostly known for his stump speaches and, while they did reflect the prevailing underlying sentiments of the day, his rhetoric was outlandish.

Remember, public speaking was a major form of entertainment for the day. So (just like the Avengers get more box office receipts than a documentary about concrete) overly dramatic speeches from pontificators known to be entertaining drew bigger crowds and got more press.

quote:

you are either on top of your Google game or have the most highly refined case of white guilt around
I imagine that he does this every night-
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