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Started By
Message
re: officer taking pistol from vehicle
Posted on 11/13/13 at 8:36 pm to Who Me
Posted on 11/13/13 at 8:36 pm to Who Me
Scotus has made clear in several cases that a weapon being present makes it a dangerous situation for the officer. It does not have to be a high crime area or a person with a record.
This post was edited on 11/13/13 at 8:39 pm
2
Posted on 11/13/13 at 8:38 pm to DanTiger
quote:
Sco
Okay you got me. What's that stand for?
Posted on 11/13/13 at 8:40 pm to Who Me
quote:
Okay you got me. What's that stand for?
Ha! Posted too fast from my phone.
Posted on 11/13/13 at 8:47 pm to DanTiger
quote:
Ha! Posted too fast from my phone.
Gotcha.
I was scratching my head thinking some kind of
P.O.P. charge?
Posted on 11/13/13 at 10:51 pm to DanTiger
quote:
Scotus has made clear in several cases that a weapon being present makes it a dangerous situation for the officer. It does not have to be a high crime area or a person with a record.
Why do you continue to post things like this without posting the cases. If you can't give me a case cite then don't post it as it is fact.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 6:52 am to Who Me
quote:
If a person lied about having a weapon in the vehicle and I found out there was a weapon through other means.
The person would be subject to a pat frisk
The vehicle would be checked for additional weapons.
The person would very likely be issued a traffic citation for the original purpose of the stop.
so nothing different really.... Ill just lie and keep my dignity.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 8:38 am to UpToPar
quote:
Why do you continue to post things like this without posting the cases. If you can't give me a case cite then don't post it as it is fact.
Because I was on my phone. I have given you cases to back up all of my statements so there is no need to behave like a dullard. Give me a few minutes and I will post them.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 8:50 am to diat150
quote:
Ill just lie and keep my dignity.
The irony.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 8:56 am to Five0
quote:
The irony.
yeah kind of like a cops job is to "protect and serve"
Posted on 11/14/13 at 9:05 am to UpToPar
quote:
Why do you continue to post things like this without posting the cases. If you can't give me a case cite then don't post it as it is fact.
I found this in a very brief search. I don't have time to look for more now but I assure you this is the stance the state and SCOTUS have taken on cases in regard to officer safety and whether a person is dangerous or not. All traffic stops are considered dangerous.
quote:
New York v. Quarles, 467 U.S. 649, 655-56 (1984) (footnote omitted). That one officer is braver (or more foolhardy) than another, and therefore not subjectively concerned for his or her safety, should not deprive that particular officer of a right to protect his or her safety. Even the brave officer should be allowed to minimize the ever-present risk of being attacked or killed. Given the dangers inherent in all traffic stops, we hold that the government's interest in officer safety outweighs a motorist's interest in not being asked about the presence of loaded weapons.(5) This balance tips in the government's favor even when the officer lacks particularized suspicion that the motorist possesses loaded weapons and regardless of whether the officer subjectively fears the motorist.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 9:36 am to DanTiger
Here's a question:
Suppose I do NOT have a CCW, but have a firearm in my pocket when pulled over for a traffic violation. When the officer asks me if I have a weapon on me, I tell him that I do. When he asks me to step out of the vehicle I cannot comply without breaking the law. I also cannot reach for my weapon to remove it from my pocket with the officer standing next to my car.
What do I do?
Suppose I do NOT have a CCW, but have a firearm in my pocket when pulled over for a traffic violation. When the officer asks me if I have a weapon on me, I tell him that I do. When he asks me to step out of the vehicle I cannot comply without breaking the law. I also cannot reach for my weapon to remove it from my pocket with the officer standing next to my car.
What do I do?
Posted on 11/14/13 at 9:38 am to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
Here's a question:
Suppose I do NOT have a CCW, but have a firearm in my pocket when pulled over for a traffic violation. When the officer asks me if I have a weapon on me, I tell him that I do. When he asks me to step out of the vehicle I cannot comply without breaking the law. I also cannot reach for my weapon to remove it from my pocket with the officer standing next to my car.
What do I do?
That is an interesting question. You are required to exit the vehicle by law when ordered to do so and at that point you would be breaking the law as carrying concealed illegally. The best thing to do is not carry a pistol in your pocket without a CC permit.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 10:39 am to DanTiger
quote:
The best thing to do is not carry a pistol in your pocket without a CC permit.
Yet I am within my rights to do so.
The correct answer is to not commit a traffic violation while transporting firearms, but mistakes happen.
Your response is less than satisfactory.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 10:49 am to WildTchoupitoulas
quote:
Yet I am within my rights to do so.
The correct answer is to not commit a traffic violation while transporting firearms, but mistakes happen.
Your response is less than satisfactory.
If you need the pistol it will be very hard to retrieve it from your pocket quickly while seated in a vehicle. Mount a holster under your driver console or mount one next to where you fasten your seatbelt if you would like to have fast access. I am forced to practice drawing and shooting from a vehicle quite often and I can tell you getting a pistol out of your pocket in time would be a hell of a feat not to mention you run a good chance of shooting yourself.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 11:06 am to DanTiger
quote:
If you need the pistol it will be very hard to retrieve it from your pocket quickly while seated in a vehicle.
I'm not one of those people who thinks that just because they have a firearm they will need to fast-draw it. Sometimes I'm just transporting a firearm. I may just slip it into my pocket in the house, jump in the truck and drive over to the farm. In such cases it's generally not even loaded.
Now when I'm going down to NOLA, that's a different story. The location of the pistol and whether or not it's loaded depends on the situation. Driving through the hood at night is a different situation than cruising the Lakefront in the afternoon.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 11:13 am to DanTiger
New York v. quarrels was a case involving police officers asking a guy where a gun was after he had committed a violent crime for both officer safety and the safety of the public. That's quite a bit different than this situation.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 11:15 am to FelicianaTigerfan
quote:
I've for this before on traffic stops. All depends on the vibe I get or circumstances.
I text you in advance and tell you that me and Trigger are gonna be blowing thru Tombstone.. If you ever finish that donut in time and catch me, you gonna search me? Make sure your hands are warm!!
Posted on 11/14/13 at 11:18 am to UpToPar
quote:
New York v. quarrels was a case involving police officers asking a guy where a gun was after he had committed a violent crime for both officer safety and the safety of the public. That's quite a bit different than this situation.
The portion of the case I posted is still relevant. There are more cases this was just the quickest for me to find. All taffic stops are considered to be dangerous by SCOTUS and so be extension all drivers may be considered dangerous if they have a firearm in my opinion. The person must not have a record to be considered a threat.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 11:25 am to DanTiger
Even the part you posted is talking about ASKING the person about a loaded weapon. Nobody is arguing that the officer can't ask the driver is he is armed. Quarrels isn't even a 4th amendment case.
Posted on 11/14/13 at 11:29 am to UpToPar
quote:
Even the part you posted is talking about ASKING the person about a loaded weapon. Nobody is arguing that the officer can't ask the driver is he is armed. Quarrels isn't even a 4th amendment case.
You are not staying focused again.
This is what I wrote:
quote:
Scotus has made clear in several cases that a weapon being present makes it a dangerous situation for the officer. It does not have to be a high crime area or a person with a record.
This is how you responded:
quote:
Why do you continue to post things like this without posting the cases. If you can't give me a case cite then don't post it as it is fact.
What in the Wide World of Sports is going on here?
Here is the germane portion of the case:
Given the dangers inherent in all traffic stops, we hold that the government's interest in officer safety outweighs a motorist's interest in not being asked about the presence of loaded weapons.(5) This balance tips in the government's favor even when the officer lacks particularized suspicion that the motorist possesses loaded weapons and regardless of whether the officer subjectively fears the motorist.
This post was edited on 11/14/13 at 11:32 am
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