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Message
re: Massad Ayoob makes a case for carrying with safety...
Posted on 4/24/23 at 11:26 am to TideHater
Posted on 4/24/23 at 11:26 am to TideHater
quote:
I carry one with the hammer back and thumb safety on. All I have to do is drop the safety. I feel more confident than when I carry a Glock chambered with no safety. Only takes a nanosecond to flip the 1911 safety off.
Nobody arguing any of that
As long as you practice and can operate it without thinking in a high stress scenario, there is nothing wrong with a safety IMO. The issue is that *most* people dont put in the work to be proficient.
And I think the issue with carrying a 1911 that they were referring to is the size and weight of a full size versus a compact CC
1
Posted on 4/24/23 at 12:06 pm to Jack Ruby
quote:
I'm not taking advice from a guy who carries a 1911 as his concealed option on purpose.
At least you're consistent in only taking bad advice.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 12:20 pm to Jack Ruby
quote:
I'm not taking advice from a guy who carries a 1911 as his concealed option on purpose.
Raises hand.
I will sometimes carry my commander sized 1911 if my clothes allow it.
Can't imagine why you would not want to carry what is probably the best handgun design ever made with more history than any other semi-auto.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 12:24 pm to RATeamWannabe
quote:
And I think the issue with carrying a 1911 that they were referring to is the size and weight of a full size versus a compact CC
I was thinking along the lines that if I did get shot with my own gun....I want to only get shot once....and by a manly gun....not a pocket sized feminine 9mm....
Posted on 4/24/23 at 12:38 pm to TideHater
quote:
I dont get this. I carry one with the hammer back and thumb safety on. All I have to do is drop the safety. I feel more confident than when I carry a Glock chambered with no safety. Only takes a nanosecond to flip the 1911 safety off.
I have no idea of your proficiency so this is not a shot a you but if you have a high stress encounter like a gunfight having that extra action to make the gun go bang can be an issue. That is why I say training with your gun is important.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 12:39 pm to Jack Ruby
quote:
Don't know much about this guy, but these old police types with 1980s skillsets have really gotten swallowed up by all the GWOT/special operations guys who are flooding the market now with extremely high level knowledge and mounds of real-world experience.
Massad Ayoob isn’t getting “swallowed up” by anybody.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 12:41 pm to Jack Ruby
quote:
I'm not taking advice from a guy who carries a 1911 as his concealed option on purpose.
Massad Ayoob knows more about self defense and use of force than everyone on this board combined.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 12:50 pm to lsufan1971
quote:
Massad Ayoob knows more about self defense and use of force than everyone on this board combined.
I am in total agreement on this. Man has hundreds of court cases as an expert consultant, books, experience, accolades, and a killer mustache.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 3:27 pm to TideHater
Posted on 4/24/23 at 3:33 pm to TideHater
quote:
I am in total agreement on this. Man has hundreds of court cases as an expert consultant, books, experience, accolades, and a killer mustache
He is very well qualified ; more so than many leo i knew. But i cannot possibly know who is on this board or their qualifications.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 3:44 pm to finchmeister08
quote:
you guys ever see him demonstrate the "shoot-me-first" vest?
I feel like I could make a similar video with my turkey vest
Posted on 4/24/23 at 3:52 pm to Jack Ruby
quote:
extremely high level knowledge and mounds of real-world experience
I guarantee you that your average police officer involved in a self defense situation with only a handgun has much more "real world" experience than a special ops guy that probably never had to use a handgun in self defense, as it is only a backup to their rifle in combat in some 3rd world country. Keep drinking their kool-aid, as they make money off of your lack of knowledge of the "real world" that we live in.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 4:00 pm to Buck_Rogers
quote:
I guarantee you that your average police officer i
Your "average" police officer barely qualifies with their weapon.
Most police rarely shoot and are not proficient with their pistol, just enough to get their qualifications.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 4:04 pm to bbvdd
Way to cut off the end of my quote to twist it around. Here's the rest:
"...involved in a self defense situation with only a handgun"
In other words, cops are more likely to be involved in a self defense situation with a handgun, than a navy seal. That is a fact. Go back to playing your Tom Clancy video games.
"...involved in a self defense situation with only a handgun"
In other words, cops are more likely to be involved in a self defense situation with a handgun, than a navy seal. That is a fact. Go back to playing your Tom Clancy video games.
This post was edited on 4/24/23 at 4:07 pm
Posted on 4/24/23 at 4:13 pm to Buck_Rogers
quote:
I guarantee you that your average police officer involved in a self defense situation with only a handgun has much more "real world" experience than a special ops guy that probably never had to use a handgun in self defense,
LOL Most SF guys shoot 10's of thousands of rounds through their weapons including handguns.
Posted on 4/24/23 at 4:27 pm to lsufan1971
And how many of these rounds were in a civilian self-defense situation and out of a handgun with no rifle near by?
Posted on 4/24/23 at 5:57 pm to Buck_Rogers
quote:
And how many of these rounds were in a civilian self-defense situation and out of a handgun with no rifle near by?
Your statement eluded to that cops are more proficient in self defense encounters with a handgun than Special forces operators. The average Navy Seal will shoot on average of 500-800 rounds a day while doing work up training. Your average cop won't shoot that in training in a 10 year career.
I know a DEVGRU, SEAL,RANGER gun qual 6 day class with 24 students shot almost 100K rounds.
I not knocking LEO but to think that they can handle a self defense situation better than people that train everyday and shoot everyday for a living is stupid.
This post was edited on 4/24/23 at 6:20 pm
Posted on 4/24/23 at 6:45 pm to lsufan1971
quote:
I know a DEVGRU, SEAL,RANGER gun qual 6 day class with 24 students shot almost 100K rounds.
Cool story. How many of the trainers were involved in a civilian related self defense situation where maybe 5 rounds at 5 feet are fired?
The point is that training to use your sidearm after your primary fails in a combat situation is not the same as deciding what type of handgun to use, how to use it and when to use it for a stateside civilian walking in plain clothes, whose senses are probably not locked in on being shot at at any moment while clearing rooms.
By no means am I saying most cops are better shots than special forces. What I am saying is that you will have better luck finding a cop that has been involved in a defense situation involving a handgun, and that includes the legal ramifications, which guys like Massad are far more knowledgeable in.
This post was edited on 4/24/23 at 6:48 pm
Posted on 4/24/23 at 7:48 pm to Buck_Rogers
I’d put a seasoned city officer up against a seal. The city officer has the street survival instinct, and the community ways knowledge.
Now i can provide an example that proves myself Wrong- but out of respect, i won’t do that. Not a seal, but a bad guy with a Tavor.
Now i can provide an example that proves myself Wrong- but out of respect, i won’t do that. Not a seal, but a bad guy with a Tavor.
This post was edited on 4/24/23 at 7:51 pm
Posted on 4/24/23 at 8:13 pm to EF Hutton
quote:
Police do Not train
There we go.
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