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Started By
Message
1
Posted on 1/5/25 at 6:10 pm to dwr353
quote:
Shut deer pens down statewide. If you want to shoot a deer like that, go to Texas.
ain’t happing. Too much money involved
Posted on 1/5/25 at 6:45 pm to Turnblad85
quote:
if they were following the rules.
They don't. They smuggle them in just like any other product that's profitable but illegal.
This post was edited on 1/5/25 at 6:47 pm
Posted on 1/5/25 at 10:11 pm to bnb9433
quote:
Too much money involved
If there was that much money to be made, there would be an arse more of those operations.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 11:44 am to Turnblad85
quote:
That would seem give more credibility to the thought that it has been here for a good while.
It's been here since deer have been here.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 11:45 am to mtb010
quote:So why all the fricking hubbub?
It's been here since deer have been here.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 11:50 am to ultralite
quote:
These deer farms need to be shut down. At this point you cannot claim ignorance of CWD. I am surprised the lawyers have not gotten involved.
Most people that can afford the land and high fence operation are probably politically active as well. Thats a big hurdle to getting any sort of accountability.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 12:01 pm to Turnblad85
A high fence owner might even serve 15 years on the MDWFP commission. Agree, too many people with big influence own deer pens for them to go away. It they’ll sure fly airplanes to catch Billy Bob with a corn pile.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 12:04 pm to mtb010
CWD may have always been here, but it was first discovered in a game pen at Colorado State University.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 12:10 pm to mtb010
quote:
It's been here since deer have been here.
Show your work, please
Posted on 1/6/25 at 12:18 pm to White Bear
quote:
So why all the fricking hubbub?
CWD is a prion disease that occurs when proteins in the body misfold and cause illness. This is not something that has just started or occurred, it's been within the animal since the animals have been in existence. It was identified in the 60's in captive deer and then in the early 80's in wild deer.
The 'fricking' hubbub has to do with the means of transmission and whether or not feeding deer is exacerbating the problem. From my perspective, of course historical data would show a pattern of increased cases from when the disease was first diagnosed because no one knew what it was and testing has increased with time. What I look at is the overall herd numbers and health of states that do feed year over year. This gives you a more realistic representation of the health of the deer herd. For instance, I live in Texas, a state that feeds more corn and has more bulk feeding then any other state out there. Also a state that tested positive in the wild herd for CWD. Now if this disease has been in the wild herd since the early 80's and the method of feeding the deer throughout the state has not changed, then one would think that the health and herd numbers would have taken a decline and the exact opposite has happened.
If it is more prevalent in the wild herd and we are only testing animals that were alive we have no way of knowing if and or how many have just died of CWD. So, if it were as big a problem as it is being perpetuated to be then the overall deer herd would be taking a hit. In most states that have legal feeding the deer numbers are steady or going up.
I can tell you car collisions are kililng a lot more deer every year then CWD.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 1:16 pm to mtb010
quote:
I can tell you car collisions are kililng a lot more deer every year then CWD.
Maybe the most honest statement I have ever read on this site.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 1:26 pm to mtb010
Deer populations are increasing in many parts of the country, and here’s why:
1. Decline in hunters: The 1990s marked the peak of hunting participation, but since then, the number of hunters has steadily decreased. It's often too expensive for the common man. (It shouldnt be)
2. Selective Harvest: There’s been a shift towards growing trophy bucks and selling hunts, which often means fewer does are being harvested. Managing deer populations effectively requires harvesting at least one doe per 50 acres. For example, a 35,000-acre ranch in Texas would need to cull around 700 does annually. Without enough natural predators (which are often controlled or absent), that burden falls on land managers.
Now consider that a single doe can produce two fawns per year. With such rapid reproduction, no disease could naturally keep up with this kind of population growth.
We’re also providing better nutrition for deer, housing them in predator-controlled, high-fence environments, and focusing harvest efforts on bucks rather than does.
This setup raises concerns about Chronic Wasting Disease (CWD). High-fence operations, while beneficial for deer management in some ways, can create ideal conditions for disease transmission. CWD can easily spread to surrounding natural populations, and it’s not a problem that resolves itself. Strong regulation and proactive management are essential to curb the spread of CWD and protect both high-fence and natural deer populations.
1. Decline in hunters: The 1990s marked the peak of hunting participation, but since then, the number of hunters has steadily decreased. It's often too expensive for the common man. (It shouldnt be)
2. Selective Harvest: There’s been a shift towards growing trophy bucks and selling hunts, which often means fewer does are being harvested. Managing deer populations effectively requires harvesting at least one doe per 50 acres. For example, a 35,000-acre ranch in Texas would need to cull around 700 does annually. Without enough natural predators (which are often controlled or absent), that burden falls on land managers.
Now consider that a single doe can produce two fawns per year. With such rapid reproduction, no disease could naturally keep up with this kind of population growth.
We’re also providing better nutrition for deer, housing them in predator-controlled, high-fence environments, and focusing harvest efforts on bucks rather than does.
This setup raises concerns about Chronic Wasting Disease (CWD). High-fence operations, while beneficial for deer management in some ways, can create ideal conditions for disease transmission. CWD can easily spread to surrounding natural populations, and it’s not a problem that resolves itself. Strong regulation and proactive management are essential to curb the spread of CWD and protect both high-fence and natural deer populations.
This post was edited on 1/6/25 at 1:27 pm
Posted on 1/6/25 at 1:36 pm to The Levee
quote:
1. Decline in hunters: The 1990s marked the peak of hunting participation, but since then, the number of hunters has steadily decreased. It's often too expensive for the common man. (It shouldnt be)
I hunt public most of the year. Some days the above quoted feels inaccurate. Mostly weekends that I’m able to hunt ha.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 1:38 pm to Honest Tune
quote:
I hunt public most of the year. Some days the above quoted feels inaccurate. Mostly weekends that I’m able to hunt ha.
I know it's hard to believe....but thats what the data says....it's been on several podcasts
Posted on 1/6/25 at 1:44 pm to The Levee
I definitely can see it from a cost perspective. Hunting in a camp setting is proving to be more expensive and time consuming than the average baw can break off.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 1:48 pm to The Levee
Maybe in the Midwest but no way there’s a hunter decline in the south.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 1:49 pm to The Levee
quote:
Deer populations are increasing in many parts of the country, and here’s why:
1. Decline in hunters: The 1990s marked the peak of hunting participation, but since then, the number of hunters has steadily decreased. It's often too expensive for the common man. (It shouldnt be)
2. Selective Harvest: There’s been a shift towards growing trophy bucks and selling hunts, which often means fewer does are being harvested. Managing deer populations effectively requires harvesting at least one doe per 50 acres. For example, a 35,000-acre ranch in Texas would need to cull around 700 does annually. Without enough natural predators (which are often controlled or absent), that burden falls on land managers.
Now consider that a single doe can produce two fawns per year. With such rapid reproduction, no disease could naturally keep up with this kind of population growth.
We’re also providing better nutrition for deer, housing them in predator-controlled, high-fence environments, and focusing harvest efforts on bucks rather than does.
This setup raises concerns about Chronic Wasting Disease (CWD). High-fence operations, while beneficial for deer management in some ways, can create ideal conditions for disease transmission. CWD can easily spread to surrounding natural populations, and it’s not a problem that resolves itself. Strong regulation and proactive management are essential to curb the spread of CWD and protect both high-fence and natural deer populations.
Both of your points are accurate. The data I am looking at is not pen raised or captive deer. And as you stated, with does having an average of 2 fawns natural disease would more than likely not be enough to take a hard hit on the overall population. This is yet another reason that I believe the reaction to CWD is somewhat overstated.
Also, I would go as far as to say without supplemental feeding states like Texas wouldn't have near the population of deer that it has due to years of drought. So, the feeding is in part allowing for a surplus of deer, not sure if that's necessarily a good thing or not.
I believe the reaction to CWD has been overblown, just like with any government run agency that wants funds thrown it's way.
Posted on 1/6/25 at 1:52 pm to WillFerrellisking
quote:
Maybe in the Midwest but no way there’s a hunter decline in the south.
MS, AL, and GA hold their numbers pretty regular...but as a whole, the country is down 2 million hunters since the 80's
as a result...most states are begging hunters to kill 1 and 2 more deer than they normally do.
I beg my hunters to kill doe's....we do a good job. We've killed 5 but only have a month to kill the remaining 7 we need.
This post was edited on 1/6/25 at 1:54 pm
Posted on 1/6/25 at 2:00 pm to The Levee
quote:
2. Selective Harvest: There’s been a shift towards growing trophy bucks and selling hunts, which often means fewer does are being harvested.
They didn't check with the "if its brown its down" coonasses in the club on my north property line!
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