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Message
re: Best shotgun for home protection?
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:14 am to NYCAuburn
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:14 am to NYCAuburn
You should have a round chambered already. Don't give up your position by rackin the slide.
You have to aim to hit anything with it. At close range buckshot has almost no spread. The purpose of using buckshot is because its good at fricking people up, not because you have to aim less with it.
It was a poor post.
You have to aim to hit anything with it. At close range buckshot has almost no spread. The purpose of using buckshot is because its good at fricking people up, not because you have to aim less with it.
It was a poor post.
0
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:22 am to Darth_Vader
Well first off, there is a reason pumps are the preferred action for home defense shot guns, but it is not for the "sound they make." They are preferred because they are less likely to malfunction, and a home defense situation is the worst time to have a malfunction.
Secondly, why would you not have a shell chambered already for a home defense gun? I'm sure as hell not going to chamber a round after I hear someone come into my house for multiple reasons. You assume the intruder is only there to steal something and not legitimately there to kill you or your family. Racking a shell will only indicate which room you are in and which corner you will be coming around.
Third, why would you load anything but buckshot for every round. I understand with a higher shot the spread will be larger, but you need to stop the intruder on the first shot, not rely on him not shooting you until you can get the second round off.
And finally, most home defense situations would involve you waiting in a room behind a door for an intruder to enter. This is on average about a 10-20 foot distance. While your pattern will expand some, you are still likely looking at only about a 1.5-2 spread at the most. This is far from just point in the general direction and let them fly.
Secondly, why would you not have a shell chambered already for a home defense gun? I'm sure as hell not going to chamber a round after I hear someone come into my house for multiple reasons. You assume the intruder is only there to steal something and not legitimately there to kill you or your family. Racking a shell will only indicate which room you are in and which corner you will be coming around.
Third, why would you load anything but buckshot for every round. I understand with a higher shot the spread will be larger, but you need to stop the intruder on the first shot, not rely on him not shooting you until you can get the second round off.
And finally, most home defense situations would involve you waiting in a room behind a door for an intruder to enter. This is on average about a 10-20 foot distance. While your pattern will expand some, you are still likely looking at only about a 1.5-2 spread at the most. This is far from just point in the general direction and let them fly.
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:22 am to DownshiftAndFloorIt
quote:
You should have a round chambered already. Don't give up your position by rackin the slide. You have to aim to hit anything with it. At close range buckshot has almost no spread. The purpose of using buckshot is because its good at fricking people up, not because you have to aim less with it. It was a poor post
Yes, you do have to aim, but there is a much greater probability of hitting them with a shotgun blast than from a pistol or rifle. As far as spread goes, once the shot has traveled 5 yards it has expanded to about a hand sized pattern with most 00 buckshot loads. That's only 15' or less than the average distance from one side of a typical room to the other.
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:36 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
The only thing I'd recommend is a shorter barrel to make the weapon less unwieldy in confined spaces.
its been done. and its all black now, which is the main thing. ya know, assault style
i dont keep a shell chambered, mainly because we are upstairs. all of our doors bolt lock with a key from the inside. this would make it very hard for someone to get in. they'd surely have to come in through a window. and the dog sleeps downstairs. i would be woken well before an intruder made it to the stairs. i'd wager the sound of racking the pump would scare them out of the house.
i have yet to confirm my intruder plan though. i have the shotgun and a .40 pistol w/ a crimsontrace.
i think racking the pump and handing the shotgun to my s/o, then leaving the bedroom w/ the pistol (& laser) would be the best bet.
put yourself in the intruder's shoes. you hear a shotgun. then you see a laser dot at the bottom of the stairs
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:36 am to UpToPar
quote:
Well first off, there is a reason pumps are the preferred action for home defense shot guns, but it is not for the "sound they make." They are preferred because they are less likely to malfunction, and a home defense situation is the worst time to have a malfunction. Secondly, why would you not have a shell chambered already for a home defense gun? I'm sure as hell not going to chamber a round after I hear someone come into my house for multiple reasons. You assume the intruder is only there to steal something and not legitimately there to kill you or your family. Racking a shell will only indicate which room you are in and which corner you will be coming around.
The reason they would not already have a round chambers is for safety, especially if there are children in the house. I personally keep my firearms in a locked safe so this is not an issue. But if you are going to keep a firearm out where you can quickly reach it in an emergency, this means more than likely you will not have it locked away. The most common place shotguns are kept for home defense purposes is typically under a bed where a child can easily find it.
quote:
Third, why would you load anything but buckshot for every round. I understand with a higher shot the spread will be larger, but you need to stop the intruder on the first shot, not rely on him not shooting you until you can get the second round off.
You must have misunderstood my post. I've not suggested loading anything other than buck hot. In fact, in my post you quoted, I disagreed with others who suggested loading a slug.
quote:
And finally, most home defense situations would involve you waiting in a room behind a door for an intruder to enter. This is on average about a 10-20 foot distance. While your pattern will expand some, you are still likely looking at only about a 1.5-2 spread at the most. This is far from just point in the general direction and let them fly.
The actual spread of 00 buckshot is greater than what you think.
At only 7 yards you get a spread of about 7" - 8"
At 15 yards the spread actually goes up to 14"
At 25 yards the spread reaches 18"
And like I said before, by 5 yard 00 buck will spread to about the size of your hand.
LINK
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:40 am to GonzoLeslie
quote:
its been done. and its all black now, which is the main thing. ya know, assault style i dont keep a shell chambered, mainly because we are upstairs. all of our doors bolt lock with a key from the inside. this would make it very hard for someone to get in. they'd surely have to come in through a window. and the dog sleeps downstairs. i would be woken well before an intruder made it to the stairs. i'd wager the sound of racking the pump would scare them out of the house. i have yet to confirm my intruder plan though. i have the shotgun and a .40 pistol w/ a crimsontrace. i think racking the pump and handing the shotgun to my s/o, then leaving the bedroom w/ the pistol (& laser) would be the best bet. put yourself in the intruder's shoes. you hear a shotgun. then you see a laser dot at the bottom of the stairs
Actually, not a bad plan for home defense. Just the fact you have a plan for it is a step in the right direction.
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:40 am to GonzoLeslie
quote:
its been done. and its all black now, which is the main thing. ya know, assault style
Dude you are so Assault Life
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:44 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
The reason they would not already have a round chambers is for safety, especially if there are children in the house. I personally keep my firearms in a locked safe so this is not an issue. But if you are going to keep a firearm out where you can quickly reach it in an emergency, this means more than likely you will not have it locked away. The most common place shotguns are kept for home defense purposes is typically under a bed where a child can easily find it.
Fair enough. I don't have kids so this is not a problem for me, but when that time comes, I will probably get a safe that is in my closet/ next to my bed that will allow easy access.
My point still stands in regards to giving up your position and the reliability of pumps vs. autos.
quote:
You must have misunderstood my post. I've not suggested loading anything other than buck hot. In fact, in my post you quoted, I disagreed with others who suggested loading a slug.
My apologies. I confused you with another post that suggested loading 6 shot first then buckshot.
quote:
The actual spread of 00 buckshot is greater than what you think.
At only 7 yards you get a spread of about 7" - 8"
At 15 yards the spread actually goes up to 14"
At 25 yards the spread reaches 18"
7 yards is probably about a typical distance you would shoot in a home defense situation. That means the spread is less than a foot. You'd be surprised how peoples motor functions go to shite in a situation like this. I understand your point, but to indicate that just pointing in the general direction will be sufficient is misleading. Anyone that wants to be prepared for a situation needs to practice a ton with whatever they are using and be proficient because when adrenaline kicks in you will not shoot as well as you do on a range.
This post was edited on 1/23/13 at 10:48 am
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:49 am to UpToPar
and right now i have it loaded w/either #3 or #4 buckshot (cant remember right now).
would yall suggest changing this? pros and cons
except the last two shells. those are slugs, ya know, for the double tap
would yall suggest changing this? pros and cons
except the last two shells. those are slugs, ya know, for the double tap
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:51 am to UpToPar
quote:
7 yards is probably about a typical distance you would shoot in a home defense situation. That means the spread is less than a foot. You'd be surprised how peoples motor functions go to shite in a situation like this. I understand your point, but to indicate that just pointing in the general direction will be sufficient is misleading. Anyone that wants to be prepared for a situation needs to practice a ton with whatever they are using and be proficient because when adrenaline kicks in you will not shoot as well as you do on a range.
Exactly right and I pointed that out a few posts ago. As for my statement of pointing in the general direction, that was a relative term that compared the aiming of a shotgun compared to a rifle of pistol.
As for training, that is a must for any and all gun owners and should begin even before purchasing any weapon. The focus should begin with safety, maintenance, and finally use. And it should be an ongoing process in that a firearm owner should take whatever weapon or weapons they own to a range at least on a monthly basis. For me, we (myself, my wife and my 11 yr old son) go to the range almost weekly. My son loves it and it's a good father son activity. I like that it gives me the opportunity to train my son properly in the three aspects of firearms I just mentioned (safety, maintenance, and use). Once my little girl (she's 4 now)I will likewise begin to train her in these areas as well. For now, when we go to the range, she goes to MeMe's for some spoiling.
This post was edited on 1/23/13 at 10:53 am
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:52 am to GonzoLeslie
Eh, it depends on your house set up. I would lose the slugs and load it will 00. If there are other people in the house especially with thin walls, I would not want to be shooting slugs.
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:54 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
As for training, that is a must for any and all gun owners and should begin even before purchasing any weapon. The focus should begin with safety, maintenance, and finally use. And it should be an ongoing process in that a firearm owner should take whatever weapon or weapons they own to a range at least on a monthly basis. For me, we (myself, my wife and my 11 yr old son) go to the range almost weekly. My son loves it and it's a good father son activity. I like that it gives me the opportunity to train my son properly in the three aspects of firearms I just mentioned (safety, maintenance, and use).
Relative to rifles and pistols, yes, a shotgun is point and shoot. I just didn't want people unfamiliar with shooting to think that it is something that does not need to be practice repeatedly.
Posted on 1/23/13 at 10:57 am to UpToPar
quote:
Eh, it depends on your house set up. I would lose the slugs and load it will 00. If there are other people in the house especially with thin walls, I would not want to be shooting slugs.
This is true. Also, if you have the last 2 rounds as slugs, that means you will have gone through about 4, 5 or even 6 rounds of buckshot before you got to the slugs. Unless you are totally blind, there won't be enough of the intruder left to waste a slug on at that point. You will have already turned them into a bloody pile of hamburger... not to mention totally wrecked whatever part of your house this carnage took place.
Posted on 1/23/13 at 11:01 am to GonzoLeslie
quote:
and right now i have it loaded w/either #3 or #4 buckshot (cant remember right now). would yall suggest changing this? pros and cons except the last two shells. those are slugs, ya know, for the double tap
Just dont load it to max capacity, you can damage your spring from being max compressed for an extended period of time. leave a shell out
This post was edited on 1/23/13 at 11:10 am
Posted on 1/23/13 at 11:02 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
Darth_Vader
you lost all credibility when you said that you should rack a shotgun to "scare off the intruder"
Yes, let's tell them exactly where you are so they are immediately on the offense.
Posted on 1/23/13 at 11:03 am to NYCAuburn
quote:
Just dont load it to max compacity, you can damage your spring from being max compressed for an extended period of time. leave a shell out
I've heard people say this, but have never had a problem.
Posted on 1/23/13 at 11:05 am to UpToPar
quote:
Relative to rifles and pistols, yes, a shotgun is point and shoot. I just didn't want people unfamiliar with shooting to think that it is something that does not need to be practice repeatedly.
I agree 100%. And I think one of the most important things is to start training your children as early as possible on firearms safety. Depending on the maturity level of the child, somewhere around 9 or so. The key is to teach them what a firearm really is and what it really can and cannot do. This helps remove the "mystery" and curiosity of a firearm and lessens the chance they will try to sneak around and get into your firearms. One good thing to teach them at a young age is two very important rules.
(1) They only handle a firearm when YOU (their father) hands it to them. This means that no matter who it is or where they are, unless you are handing them a firearm they do not touch it under any circumstances.
and
(2) They follow YOUR instructions exactly while handling a firearm. This means that while handling a firearm they focus on following your instructions and nothing noting else.
I like these two rules because they are all encompassing and easy for a child to remember and understand.
For my son, he's progressed in his training to the point that once we get home from the range, he actually field strips and cleans all our weapons, under my close supervision of course.
Posted on 1/23/13 at 11:08 am to bbvdd
quote:
you lost all credibility when you said that you should rack a shotgun to "scare off the intruder" Yes, let's tell them exactly where you are so they are immediately on the offense.
I suggested this because I've heard first hand accounts from more than one police officer of an intruder being scared off from the sound of a racking shotgun. Is this a 100% foolproof method of getting rid of an intruder? Of course not. But it does work.
This post was edited on 1/23/13 at 11:09 am
Posted on 1/23/13 at 11:09 am to UpToPar
quote:
I've heard people say this, but have never had a problem.
neither have I, but why risk it. just add a side saddle or stock saddle if you are going to anticipate the need for that many rounds. you can put shells in pretty quickly
Posted on 1/23/13 at 11:11 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
I suggested this because I've heard first hand accounts from more than one police officer of an intruder being scared off from the sound of a racking shotgun. Is this a 100% foolproof method of getting rid of an intruder? Of course not. But it does work.
It may work sometimes, but I would not suggest it. What if you go to rack it and there is a malfunction? Not to mention you have now identified that you have a gun, and what part of the house you are in and possibly coming from. This is the same reason you should not walk around with a flashlight in your house if you think someone is in there.
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