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re: Special K (ketamine) as a treatment for depression

Posted on 12/10/14 at 11:21 pm to
Posted by Hopeful Doc
Member since Sep 2010
14965 posts
Posted on 12/10/14 at 11:21 pm to
quote:

I'm going to sound like an a-hole, but I find this hole depression thing bullshite.


You probably don't suffer from it or have anyone close to you who does. Depression isn't all "feeling down" or "sad." Many depressed people have kind of the opposite- they don't really feel happy/excited about anything, and it leads them to not enjoying things they once did. This isn't really the best forum to discuss it. And yes, what many people call depression is bullshite, but it's a very real disease that all-too-often leads to suicide, subpar work/school activities, mistreatment of others, and a host of other things. I encourage you to be a little more open-minded about mental health issues. Not being able to put yourself in your neighbor's shoes and seeing the world the way that they see it can be a dangerous thing at times.
Posted by Blue Velvet
Apple butter toast is nice
Member since Nov 2009
20112 posts
Posted on 12/10/14 at 11:26 pm to
quote:

I find this hole depression thing bullshite
Who gets depressed when inside a K-hole? That's not even possible.
Posted by Hopeful Doc
Member since Sep 2010
14965 posts
Posted on 12/10/14 at 11:27 pm to
quote:

Granted, I feel that psychiatrists WAAAAY over-prescribe patients pharmaceuticals. And a lot of anxiety/depression can be cured with therapy and behavioral changes, absolutely.


Unfortunately, cognitive behavioral therapy requires a trained therapist and patient willing to do it. It's difficult. It's a hell of a lot harder than taking a pill. And it's not easy to be told that you have to change the way you think- it's foreign territory and it requires (although in a positive, non-accusatory environment) embracing that you (you, the patient undergoing CBT. Not you, you) react in inappropriate and unhealthy ways to certain situations rather than the much more comfortable placing the blame somewhere else and not realizing that you are not necessarily able to control your emotions, but you are able to control how you react to situations and how you feel about your own emotions.


Mental health is wildly complicated.
Posted by jimithing11
Dillon, Texas
Member since Mar 2011
22473 posts
Posted on 12/10/14 at 11:28 pm to
And I give a frick because why?

Grats on the e-boner brah
Posted by efrad
Member since Nov 2007
18646 posts
Posted on 12/10/14 at 11:40 pm to
Yeah, I understand that for sure. I have never taken LSD, but I have read several books by the psychiatrists who researched it in the 40s-60s in LSD therapy. I think that is the real path to breakthroughs in therapy, but I don't see the law getting changed for psychiatrists to administer it to patients in my lifetime. I did take psilocybin once and that has definitely opened my eyes to my own mental/anxiety issues.
Posted by cwil177
Baton Rouge
Member since Jun 2011
28432 posts
Posted on 12/13/14 at 3:02 pm to
quote:

I did take psilocybin once and that has definitely opened my eyes to my own mental/anxiety issues.

Did it have a positive or negative effect on you, and was this felt during or after the trip?
Posted by mikelbr
Baton Rouge
Member since Apr 2008
47507 posts
Posted on 12/13/14 at 3:54 pm to
quote:


Usually it knocks you the frick out.

It depends on dose and induction method like anything else. Battlefield medics use it like you're talking about. It's a great alternative to morphine
Posted by efrad
Member since Nov 2007
18646 posts
Posted on 12/13/14 at 4:26 pm to
quote:

Did it have a positive or negative effect on you, and was this felt during or after the trip?



I only took a small amount but it was an overwhelmingly positive experience. I did not have visual hallucinations, but a great joyous change in my mental state. I was really nervous and afraid of losing control of myself, but during the session I realized that it's not about control and I really need to learn to let go. This led to feelings of selflessness. I regretted that as much as I have the ability to help others, I haven't done enough of it. But this regret was not a guilty type of regret, but more forward-looking, as in "I have an opportunity going forward to make an impact on others." Overall, it was one of the most spiritual experiences in my life.

Those are the feelings I felt during the session. Once the session was over and my normal mental state resumed, I still remembered everything from the session and I reflect back on it all the time. But I have to make a conscious effort to reflect back on it and calm myself down in times of anxiety. It helps, but I'm still anxious.

I have little doubt that psychedelics, when properly administered by a psychiatrist, would lead to breakthroughs in therapy. These substances open your mind so that you can remember things that you didn't before, you understand parts of yourself that you didn't before, you have realizations that you didn't before. For example, maybe there is something causing you great pain that you are keeping locked away, and what you really need is to think of it from a different perspective. Maybe you'll finally forgive someone who has caused you pain. Maybe you'll understand how to move past your own regrets in life.

But the industry is not interested in therapy, the industry is interested in making pills that simply make your anxiety go away for a temporary time until you are ready to pay for your next refill. These psychedelics require political risks to be taken to change the law to allow for more trials to go through for approval. The patents have run out and that makes them much less profitable. No one with power wants to take these risks for such little profitable gain. Such is the world we live in, unfortunately.
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