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Started By
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re: Part of the new Hard Rock Hotel collapses (NOLA) 3 dead, Cranes Down-ish
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:08 pm to fightin tigers
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:08 pm to fightin tigers
Not even considering the construction loads and shoring but no way that deck can span that far. 5.5" with 4x4 WWF... no way.
2
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:08 pm to TxWadingFool
quote:
That is what I was referring to in my earlier post about the city getting drug into this.
A city building inspector has the structural expertise to go on a jobsite and determine if the drawings and the actual building is built properly?
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:10 pm to fightin tigers
quote:it states to look at the stud schedule. It would have the spacing there. 18"for less than 20' span, 12" for greater.
The 3" typ looks like it is only calling out from the beam connection point though.
This post was edited on 10/14/19 at 7:14 pm
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:14 pm to BoostAddict
The permit drawings show 3" composite 16 gage deck with 5-1/2" slab.
I thought this might be a proprietary form deck but this does not work.
I thought this might be a proprietary form deck but this does not work.
This post was edited on 10/14/19 at 7:16 pm
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:16 pm to CarRamrod
quote:
it states to look at the stud schedule. It would have the spacing there
It's on the plan views 12-18". Those studs are for the deck diaphragm (lateral loads).
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:18 pm to meltingman
quote:
The permit drawings show 3" composite 16 gage deck with 5-1/2" slab.
I thought this might be a proprietary form deck but this does not work.
Yep. Works up to about 9ft or so for 50psf LL.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:21 pm to Dale Doubak
quote:
He may be in trouble
I'd be seeking legal representation and hoping I had huge professional liability policies and set up professional corporations to protect assets if I were him. I'd also have put a good criminal defense attorney on retainer as well, what with the dead people and all.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:23 pm to BoostAddict
There are for the deck but not necessarily lateral loads. The studs tie the beams to the slab to form a composite member.
This post was edited on 10/14/19 at 7:28 pm
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:32 pm to BoostAddict
quote:
Yep. Works up to about 9ft or so for 50psf LL.
3" 16 gage composite deck can support 100-psf live load up to 14-ft span (published SDI catalog value). If you run the numbers with the deck properties, you start having shoring, reinforcement, and load issues over 20-ft.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:32 pm to CarRamrod
quote:
There are for the deck but not necessarily lateral loads. The studs tie the beams to the slab to form a composite member.
Not in this case.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:34 pm to CarRamrod
Word is the construction contractor loaded one area down too much with building materials and caused a column failure. Not sure on the validity but he works in the city for a consulting firm.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:40 pm to AliBahBah54
Well the way the building collapsed with the 2 frames falling outward, this would point to something to that effect.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:40 pm to BoostAddict
Ok brah.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:41 pm to AliBahBah54
quote:
Word is the construction contractor loaded one area down too much with building materials and caused a column failure. Not sure on the validity but he works in the city for a consulting firm.
This was stated soon after on one of the earlier pages as well.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:42 pm to Picayuner
quote:
Don’t know how to link but articles about the WWII hotel were in newspapers recently. As each floor was poured, each sagged creating a need for more support throughout. Not staying there. Google it
Don’t know why this got down voted. This stuff is real. This was a potential collapsing situation where construction was haulted. There is an actual lawsuit against the engineering firm.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 7:43 pm to BoostAddict
I’m not an engineer but have done s few structural steel and a few cast in place mid rises.. one thing that jumps out In the pictures you are seeing a rebar Mat similar to a structural cast in place slab, but the details in the structural drawings are a typical slab on metal deck usually similar to a joist and deck job with concrete topping(hence the wire mesh on the detail
Almost looks like a hybrid between steel and CIP ..maybe reduce the beam/joist spacing by reinforcing the slab a little more to gain the bigger spans. Would definitely require more shoring during placement of slabs
Almost looks like a hybrid between steel and CIP ..maybe reduce the beam/joist spacing by reinforcing the slab a little more to gain the bigger spans. Would definitely require more shoring during placement of slabs
Posted on 10/14/19 at 8:04 pm to LSUisBetterthanU
quote:
Don’t know how to link but articles about the WWII hotel were in newspapers recently. As each floor was poured, each sagged creating a need for more support throughout. Not staying there. Google it
Don’t know why this got down voted. This stuff is real. This was a potential collapsing situation where construction was haulted. There is an actual lawsuit against the engineering firm.
Maybe it was downvoted due to the lack of accuracy in the post. Each level did not sag as they were poured. Yes, there were deficiencies discovered by the contractor in the superstructure, however as the article stated repairs were made. Also delays were not in the year range as post stated.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 8:08 pm to fightin tigers
Photos look like a two way composite slab with studs.
What was the f'c? Agree about the W6x20's thats not a big section.
What was the f'c? Agree about the W6x20's thats not a big section.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 8:09 pm to CarRamrod
quote:
Ok brah
You're right... it could be designed as composite beams based on seeing those additional pictures with all of that additional reinforcing. There are obviously additional concrete details not shown on those permit drawings.
Posted on 10/14/19 at 8:11 pm to meltingman
quote:
3" 16 gage composite deck can support 100-psf live load up to 14-ft span (published SDI catalog value). If you run the numbers with the deck properties, you start having shoring, reinforcement, and load issues over 20-ft.
My thoughts exactly. How did they get the deflection to work even assuming it was shored properly?
I have a feeling someone's stamped calcs are going to see a courtroom here.
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