re: Obtuse's guide to entry level Swiss watches under $2000

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Oceaneva Rolex Homage

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I have only seen them mentioned a couple of times on the watch forums and I don't remember anyone owning one, it is hard to get a bunch of watch geeks excited about the million and first Rolex dive watch homage. That said it does have a Sellita SW200-1 which is more or less identical to the ETA 2824 (Sellita used to make a lot of the ETA movements prior to ETA being swallowed by Swatch Group) so it has a solid Swiss workhorse movement. Likely every other component is Chinese and cased in China but that is the case for a large number of micro-brands and some are darn good watches for the price.

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What do yall think about the countycomm maratac watches?

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For the price they are a solid watch with a good following. Most of them use Seiko NH-35 movements which will run forever.

I have the JSAR auto and you could put nails in a fence with it....lol

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If I saw a diver I liked with Christopher Ward in house movent I might do it

I like knowing movement and think it is cool they made their own.

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Chris Ward the major of micros. I like a LOT of things they do. Their movement guy Johannes Jahnke has come up with some innovative modules for ETA movements (The JJxx calbres) and designed the SH21. While I don't think the SH21 is very elegant looking the modular design opens up the possibilities of a ton of interesting and unique modules. Synergies Horlogeres has a lot of great movement experience. That said these in-house movements put a serious premium on the watches they are in but they are still "cheap" for what you get.

I do like the new C60 Trident Ombre COSC as it is very different. $1025 on the matching leather strap isn't a bad price for a COSC movement.

That is a damn fine watch but I want a deployment clasp at that price range. I have always liked the distressed leather bands and really like the face scratched up to match.

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4-5 of Seiko Sports 5

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There are so many cool Seiko 5s but it seems Seiko quits making all the coolest ones.

Have you ever looked at all the varieties on Seiko 5 finder? It is amazing how many they have released over the years.

Seiko 5 finder

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I swear you have ask me that before.

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Oh damn I didn't even remember. Well, a man knows what he wants

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64 watches-do you wear them all?That would give me a headache,trying to figure out which one to wear.
Are they reasonably good investment?

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I do wear them all, I change watches just about every evening. I wear them in the order they are in my watch boxes by column so there is never any thought unless I am doing something the next day they require a specific kind of watch and in that case I will skip to the next one that meets the requirements and continue from there.

As for investment most of my watches I have now are modern and while the Pateks, Rolex and to a lesser degree the Audemars Piguets and Panerais hold value or see a moderate increase they aren't anything like a good investment.

The good investments have been vintage Pateks (the special ones) and vintage Rolex. When I started buying watches I loved the Rolex Daytona but at the time I could not afford one, it was during the first episode of Rolex using manufactured scarcity. So I bought vintage manual wind ones and just started collecting them since I loved them. I nor anyone else realized they would appreciate 20-40 or even 100 times what I paid for them over 20 years. Selling them off is a big part of the money I used to buy my current accumulation.

Vintage Rolex watches still look like a good investment now but who knows when the bubble may burst. The general rule is don't buy watches as an investment unless you can go back to the late 80s and buy every pre-1970 Rolex you can find then come back and sell them now. I remember holding certain watches in the early 90s that were priced from 3000-5000 dollars that are worth 150-250k now. This won't happen with current watches though, modern watches are more like sports cards in the 90s some will hold or appreciate for a while but will tank in the long run. Does anyone want to buy a few hundred Shaq rookie cards?

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what are your thoughts on Panerai quality?

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Well I am somewhat of a Paneristi so I may be biased. Without looking back at the picture I think I had 12 or 13 when that picture was taken. 14 now. They range from common ETA based movements to in-house movements to very limited watches like my PAM 518 which was a 2014 SIHH release, they made only 50 and they are powered by a vintage NOS Minerva chronograph movement. The quality varies roughly by retail but I will admit they are overpriced based purely on quality across most of the range. They do hold value reasonably well. Panerai in my eyes is like almost every other watch if you like it and can afford it buy it. In general, the quality of the movement is excellent they just may lack some level of finissage in the movement (most are rather industrial) but outside of homages there really isn't anything like them which produces the almost universal love or hate, not much middle ground with Panerai. Just like Rolex the vintage pieces are worth a fortune.

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Wait, do you have a Daytona?

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I don't have a modern one, I have two vintage Daytonas left. A 6263 Panda and a 6265 Spirit of Japan which is let's say extremely rare. Both of them live in a safe deposit box. There is a lot of controversy around the SoJ and I know of 3 others that own one and like me we are all waiting for someone else to set the market, the last one auctioned was in 2003 and the next one will face extreme scrutiny and none of us wants to be the one that gets their head cut off.