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re: A light topic for the day...Do you believe in evolution?
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:39 am to LCA131
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:39 am to LCA131
quote:fact?
The earth is round-ish
quote:Eh. The earth rotates.
the axis is kind of made up.. it doesn't physically exist
quote:fact?
we orbit the Sun
quote:They aren't my people.
but hundreds of years ago, 'your people', thought otherwise.
0
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:43 am to Eli Goldfinger
I guess you could call me a Christian Evolutionist, but I will admit that I do not have a science background.
With that said, I think a distinction must be made between abiogenesis (the idea that life was created from non-living matter billions of years ago) and evolution (species evolve to adapt to environmental circumstances). So, in a nutshell, abiogenesis explores what happened before life was formed and evolution explores what has happened after the formation of life.
The Bible could possibly support the idea of abiogenesis. In the Book of Genesis, Chapter 2, Verse 7, "Then the Lord God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being." If dust is "non-living" and our modern-day concept of time is different then God's time; this could give us Christians a way to believe that abiogenesis does not conflict with biblical teachings.
The way I view evolution is to look at giraffes. Let us look at this hypothetical scenario: 100,000 years ago, one-hundred giraffes were living within 10 square miles on the plains of Africa. Day after day, the giraffes would eat from the leaves of the trees, but there are only a finite number of trees within this 10 square mile area. The giraffes would start at the lowest branch on the tree and work their way up the tree after all the leaves from the lower branches were consumed. After a while only giraffes with necks that were long enough to reach the lowest branches containing leaves could eat. The giraffes with shorter necks who couldn't reach the leaves would die from starvation. Because dead giraffes do not reproduce, their (shorter neck)genes are not passed on to further generations of giraffes. At the same time, the giraffes with longer necks are reproducing and having offspring who have the genes of their longer necked parents. The cycle then continues with only the giraffes having necks long enough to reach the lowest leaves survive and reproduce offspring with this genetically superior makeup.
Furthermore, in my mind, the reason this evolutionary process with giraffes has been as slow as it has been is because of the ability of giraffes to migrate to find other sources of food. This means that some of the shorter necked giraffes do survive and reproduce (but not with the same speed as their longer necked counterparts) which slows down the evolutionary process.
TL;DR: Must distinguish between Abiogenesis and Evolution. As a Christian, I can reconcile abiogenesis through scripture (Genesis 2:7), but I am still highly skeptical of its validity. Evolution shouldn't be a controversial topic and doesn't necessarily conflict with biblical teachings. The lengthening of a giraffe's neck over time is a good example of evolution as utility.
With that said, I think a distinction must be made between abiogenesis (the idea that life was created from non-living matter billions of years ago) and evolution (species evolve to adapt to environmental circumstances). So, in a nutshell, abiogenesis explores what happened before life was formed and evolution explores what has happened after the formation of life.
The Bible could possibly support the idea of abiogenesis. In the Book of Genesis, Chapter 2, Verse 7, "Then the Lord God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being." If dust is "non-living" and our modern-day concept of time is different then God's time; this could give us Christians a way to believe that abiogenesis does not conflict with biblical teachings.
The way I view evolution is to look at giraffes. Let us look at this hypothetical scenario: 100,000 years ago, one-hundred giraffes were living within 10 square miles on the plains of Africa. Day after day, the giraffes would eat from the leaves of the trees, but there are only a finite number of trees within this 10 square mile area. The giraffes would start at the lowest branch on the tree and work their way up the tree after all the leaves from the lower branches were consumed. After a while only giraffes with necks that were long enough to reach the lowest branches containing leaves could eat. The giraffes with shorter necks who couldn't reach the leaves would die from starvation. Because dead giraffes do not reproduce, their (shorter neck)genes are not passed on to further generations of giraffes. At the same time, the giraffes with longer necks are reproducing and having offspring who have the genes of their longer necked parents. The cycle then continues with only the giraffes having necks long enough to reach the lowest leaves survive and reproduce offspring with this genetically superior makeup.
Furthermore, in my mind, the reason this evolutionary process with giraffes has been as slow as it has been is because of the ability of giraffes to migrate to find other sources of food. This means that some of the shorter necked giraffes do survive and reproduce (but not with the same speed as their longer necked counterparts) which slows down the evolutionary process.
TL;DR: Must distinguish between Abiogenesis and Evolution. As a Christian, I can reconcile abiogenesis through scripture (Genesis 2:7), but I am still highly skeptical of its validity. Evolution shouldn't be a controversial topic and doesn't necessarily conflict with biblical teachings. The lengthening of a giraffe's neck over time is a good example of evolution as utility.
This post was edited on 8/22/17 at 10:46 am
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:47 am to Eli Goldfinger
Evolution is fact. Evolution simply means change. Gene pools change over time, this is an observable fact.
What is up for debate is why (natural selection is one theory) and the extent of evolution (macro/common descent or just micro).
The evidence for macro evidence and common descent is overwhelming in my opinion. The biggest question is how life got started (abiogenesis).
What is up for debate is why (natural selection is one theory) and the extent of evolution (macro/common descent or just micro).
The evidence for macro evidence and common descent is overwhelming in my opinion. The biggest question is how life got started (abiogenesis).
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:51 am to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
What's your take on it?
Evolution is so fricking fascinating.
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:51 am to Spock's Eyebrow
quote:
Do you also believe organisms self-assemble from nothing by divine guidance, or is that a natural process?
I don't believe anyone is claiming self-assembly.
It's more like amino acids > proteins > etc...
You should look up the 'blind watchmaker theory'.
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:53 am to Collegedropout
quote:
Do I believe the biblical story of Adam and Eve.... yes.... pretty sure that answers your question.
The Tale of Dust Man and Rib Woman.
Fiction genre.
Cult following.
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:54 am to UPT
quote:
The Tale of Dust Man and Rib Woman.
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:55 am to ElPresidenteGrande
I don't understand how creationist explain dinosaurs. Noah built a ship so big it housed every species of animal on earth including a frickin T-Rex? Or did God murder them during the great flood?
This post was edited on 8/22/17 at 10:57 am
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:55 am to Eli Goldfinger
I find it difficult to submit to the idea of evolution as it presented in an absolute manner: Single cell organisms becoming human beings.
Name one other natural process that progresses toward construction v destruction. At it's very essence, evolution is contrary to every other law of the universe.
There's more too it than picking sides.
Name one other natural process that progresses toward construction v destruction. At it's very essence, evolution is contrary to every other law of the universe.
There's more too it than picking sides.
Posted on 8/22/17 at 10:58 am to ccomeaux
Survival is a hell of motivator.
Posted on 8/22/17 at 11:00 am to ccomeaux
quote:
Name one other natural process that progresses toward construction v destruction.
Gravity. Boom.
Posted on 8/22/17 at 11:02 am to Eli Goldfinger
Evolution within a species, sure. But i dont believe that this was all a huge accident and man evolved from a monkey and a fish and a single cell organism before that and it all started with some accidental big explosion in space.
Is it possible for a tornado to blow through a junkyard and leave behind a fully functioning F-16? Nope. And life/organisms are exponentially more complicated than that. Was not an accident.
I have a science background and the deeper you dig, the more you realize how things are made too perfect to be just coincidence.
Is it possible for a tornado to blow through a junkyard and leave behind a fully functioning F-16? Nope. And life/organisms are exponentially more complicated than that. Was not an accident.
I have a science background and the deeper you dig, the more you realize how things are made too perfect to be just coincidence.
This post was edited on 8/22/17 at 11:05 am
Posted on 8/22/17 at 11:04 am to Eli Goldfinger
quote:
quote:
Do you also believe organisms self-assemble from nothing by divine guidance, or is that a natural process?
I don't believe anyone is claiming self-assembly.
Really? It's an observable fact, and it's banal in its ubiquity and frequency.
Posted on 8/22/17 at 11:32 am to theunknownknight
I believe in both evolution and Creator-god.
God starts it up.
Puts a spin on it now and then. All life then has a life of its own within the constraints of natural laws created by Creator-god.
God starts it up.
Puts a spin on it now and then. All life then has a life of its own within the constraints of natural laws created by Creator-god.
This post was edited on 8/22/17 at 11:33 am
Posted on 8/22/17 at 11:37 am to Peazey
quote:
Gravity. Boom
Gravity is a force not a process
Posted on 8/22/17 at 11:41 am to ccomeaux
quote:
Name one other natural process that progresses toward construction v destruction.
Crystal formation
Posted on 8/22/17 at 1:48 pm to dbeck
quote:
Crystal formation
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