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Message
re: We really need to change coaches
Posted on 11/30/24 at 9:07 am to whatiknowsofar
Posted on 11/30/24 at 9:07 am to whatiknowsofar
Amen. Willie has no scheme.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 9:37 am to Safety Blitz
quote:
Willie has no scheme.
Thats false as well. If you think we dont run plays and sets i don't know what to tell you. If you think having 15 different starting lineups hasn't affected that I don't know what to tell you. If you think Erik Spoelstra or another "elite" coach would have this roster at 10 wins or more i don't know what to tell you.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 9:50 am to whatiknowsofar
I think a well coached team who runs a healthy system should be disciplined and able to execute. Backups should be able to keep it going, not necessarily win games, but at least be functional. Willie’s “Schemes” aren’t effective.
This team doesn’t do it. They haven’t done it for years. Typically our last second play call has been iso even with our starters.
This team doesn’t do it. They haven’t done it for years. Typically our last second play call has been iso even with our starters.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:04 am to Safety Blitz
quote:
Backups should be able to keep it going,
My guy, these aren't even backups. They're the backups backups. Teams are cheating and daring Boston and Green to take open 3s and we aren't making them. You didn't have a true pg for weeks until Murray got back, he's still rusty, and your best pg outside of that hasn't been in the league for 2 years.
I'd argue that our biggest issue that shouldn't be is Trey Murphy playing so poorly. He's gotten his open looks and he's bricking them.
This offense has generated open looks. The players taking the shots are not good enough to hit them.
And don't even get me started on "well why isn't the defense good" shite. With all these players shuffling around playing different roles you're expecting a level of communication and chemistry that isn't feasible. These guys don't get a camp. They get maybe one practice or two a week and then oops Ingram goes down or oops Jose went down or oops zion went down.
We have been in a constant state of adjusting to injury since the season began, and Phil fricking Jackson wouldn't have this team winning much more than what we are.
Willie has his faults, but the whole "we need an elite coach" isn't the fricking cure you guys think it is.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:07 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
If you can't see what we run and why it doesn't work there's no point in debating you.
You still haven’t answered the question. What is our offensive system and philosophy? Tell me what are we running besides ghosts screens, DJM pick/rolls, and isos?
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:21 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
I'd argue that our biggest issue that shouldn't be is Trey Murphy playing so poorly. He's gotten his open looks and he's bricking them.
They’re not getting him open looks. Most his looks are generated himself. Last night in the first quarter they didn’t generate one play to get him an open look.
quote:
And don't even get me started on "well why isn't the defense good" shite. With all these players shuffling around playing different roles you're expecting a level of communication and chemistry that isn't feasible. These guys don't get a camp. They get maybe one practice or two a week and then oops Ingram goes down or oops Jose went down or oops zion went down.
No one is expecting elite defense. But it would be a nice if a defensive coach can manage to tell his players to stop giving straight line dunks and layups every game. We allow paint scoring at a ridiculous rate.
quote:
We have been in a constant state of adjusting to injury since the season began, and Phil fricking Jackson wouldn't have this team winning much more than what we are.
Part of why this is so difficult we don’t have philosphies or systems in place. Yes we’ve had a ton of injuries but even as we get some guys back we don’t see much improvement. This excuse now is their rusty. Its always something. Eventually as a head coach you are required to win games.
quote:
Willie has his faults, but the whole "we need an elite coach" isn't the fricking cure you guys think it is.
No one is asking for Phil Jackson like your assuming. We just don’t want a shite coach like Willie. A decent coach who controls game flow, runs plays and occasionally outcoaches the opponent would be nice.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:21 am to Pels_Yaz
quote:
Tell me what are we running besides ghosts screens, DJM pick/rolls, and isos?
These are some of the plays used in the offensive system. You originally said we have no system at all.
The Pels have run horns since the SVG days, but it gets blown up with these guys due to the lack of respect you need and the lack of good screen setting we have.
Our offense is also based off of having players that can at will get to the rim to generate drive and kick outs to open 3 point shooters, but again, without health you are severely limited in what you can run and what works.
Willie isn't going to expect Brandon Boston to drive kick to an open Green/payton/scrub etc. Or drop off to the dunker spot. That's not his game and they aren't good enough shooters anyways.
It's just wild to me that yall don't see this. It's far, far more of a talent issue vs scheme.
This post was edited on 11/30/24 at 10:22 am
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:24 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
These are some of the plays used in the offensive system. You originally said we have no system at all.
This isn’t a system lol. This is straight pick up ball lol.
quote:
Our offense is also based off of having players that can at will get to the rim to generate drive and kick outs to open 3 point shooters, but again, without health you are severely limited in what you can run and what works.
Again not a system. They do this in rec games. Our “system” is drive to the rim and pass for threes??? This is basic basketball.
quote:
It's just wild to me that yall don't see this. It's far, far more of a talent issue vs scheme.
It can be both! Its wild you can’t see this.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:30 am to Pels_Yaz
quote:
They’re not getting him open looks.
bullshite. He's getting his looks. He was open several times in the 4th quarter and missing.
quote:
Last night in the first quarter they didn’t generate one play to get him an open look.
Teams will let everyone else get open besides Trey. It's on him to generate his own open looks too.
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But it would be a nice if a defensive coach can manage to tell his players to stop giving straight line dunks and layups every game. We allow paint scoring at a ridiculous rate.
Chemistry, communication. Lack of talent.
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Part of why this is so difficult we don’t have philosphies or systems in place.
We absolutely do. You don't see it.
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Yes we’ve had a ton of injuries but even as we get some guys back we don’t see much improvement.
We get guys back and lose other fricking guys! Ingram went down and soon as CJ came back. Hawk is in and out and playing hurt, Trey is in and out. fricking christ man we aren't getting guys back. We're just trading out lol.
quote:
This excuse now is their rusty. Its always something. Eventually as a head coach you are required to win games.
Murray and Trey look rough, but to act like anyone is using that as a primary excuse is bullshite.
quote:
We just don’t want a shite coach like Willie. A decent coach who controls game flow, runs plays and occasionally outcoaches the opponent would be nice.
Make chicken salad with chicken shite Willie! It's so easy.
It's hard and damn near impossible to outcoach a team when you are so severely talent deprived like the pels are. When you have scrubs on the court as much as we do the good teams will hug up and dare anyone but the good players to beat them, teams will switch accordingly.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:36 am to Pels_Yaz
quote:
Again not a system. They do this in rec games. Our “system” is drive to the rim and pass for threes??? This is basic basketball.
Do you realize all of the elite teams in the NBA have guys that get to the rim right? At will. The Celtics, last night with the Grizzlies, the Mavs, etc. Their offense works best when their elite players put pressure on the rim to generate open looks for their best 3pt shooters. So please tell me that Zion penetrating with Ingram CJ Trey and Murray all around the 3pt line wouldn't work. Because that is the plan we have never been able to execute DUE TO INJURY.
The Pels have Murray, Ingram, and Zion for rim running/driving. They have all been hurt. It's basic basketball that works. You just don't get it.
quote:
can be both! Its wild you can’t see this.
It is far more one than the other. Wild that you prefer to blame willie
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:38 am to whatiknowsofar
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Teams will let everyone else get open besides Trey. It's on him to generate his own open looks too.
So basically if Willie cant get you open looks. Its on the player- thats his philosophy?
quote:
Chemistry, communication. Lack of talent.
Giving up transition dunks and straight line layups doesn’t require much of this. As a defensive coach you need to stress this. Not sure if its being stressed or players are even listening.
quote:
We absolutely do. You don't see it.
Again you stated the system is players driving and then kicking out for open threes. This isn’t a system man. Thats basic basketball.
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Make chicken salad with chicken shite Willie! It's so easy.
You’ve used this for Willie several times and my answer is the same.
Willie couldn’t make chicken salad if it wss premade!!!!
quote:
It's hard and damn near impossible to outcoach a team when you are so severely talent deprived like the pels are. When you have scrubs on the court as much as we do the good teams will hug up and dare anyone but the good players to beat them, teams will switch accordingly.
He doesn’t outcoach teams when healthy. And part of a good coach is finding a way to win without your best players- Willie does not have this capability.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:41 am to Pels_Yaz
quote:
Again you stated the system is players driving and then kicking out for open threes. This isn’t a system man. Thats basic basketball.
Hey if you don't know how modern nba basketball is played that's fine. All of the teams run some form of a pnr to switch and let their elite players a way to get to the rim to either finish or find an open 3pt shooter. A layup and open 3pt shot are the two best shots in basketball. EVERYTEAM wants to run some form of this.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:48 am to Pels_Yaz
Yeah Willie consistently fails to set up our shooters and just dumps them on the corners while letting the ball handlers cook. Guys like Trey would thrive on so many other teams.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:48 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
Do you realize all of the elite teams in the NBA have guys that get to the rim right? At will. The Celtics, last night with the Grizzlies, the Mavs, etc. Their offense works best when their elite players put pressure on the rim to generate open looks for their best 3pt shooters.
There is a lot more to their teams than this. You really think those teams run the same amount of plays we do? Come on man- you actually believe if this pels team was healthy are offense would be running like those teams??
quote:
The Pels have Murray, Ingram, and Zion for rim running/driving. They have all been hurt. It's basic basketball that works. You just don't get it.
We had Ingram and Zion early in the year and last year. We had several problems with our offense. The fact you ignore this and think when healthy we can have similar offense to the Mavs, and Celtics is just silly.
quote:
It is far more one than the other. Wild that you prefer to blame willie
Yeah you’re using injuries as an excuse and completely ignoring that these issues have existed before the injuries. Whether you like it or not, they probably will fire Willie- you have to admit this. Hes not getting a pass for this.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 10:52 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
Hey if you don't know how modern nba basketball is played that's fine. All of the teams run some form of a pnr to switch and let their elite players a way to get to the rim to either finish or find an open 3pt shooter. A layup and open 3pt shot are the two best shots in basketball. EVERYTEAM wants to run some form of this.
Lol lets go to its my fault of not understanding modern basketball. You’re dumbing down NBA basketball to make an excuse for Willie. Yes but its not as simple as you make it. Theres more to a NBA team- “then kick out and shoot 3s.” But hey if you don’t understand that, its fine.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 11:01 am to Pels_Yaz
quote:
You’re dumbing down NBA basketball to make an excuse for Willie. Yes but its not as simple as you make it.
This is why I didn't want to debate you. There's a lot of willful ignorance in your understanding of the game.
I'm good on this conversation.
This post was edited on 11/30/24 at 11:02 am
Posted on 11/30/24 at 11:02 am to whatiknowsofar
quote:
There's a lot of willful ignorance in your understanding of the game.
Ok sure buddy.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 12:10 pm to whatiknowsofar
It isn’t the cure…but it’s part of the cure.
These guys are done with Willie. They no longer trust him to build this team and it shows. Some of these “injuries” would not be voiced if the players felt like it was worth it to play.
These guys are done with Willie. They no longer trust him to build this team and it shows. Some of these “injuries” would not be voiced if the players felt like it was worth it to play.
Posted on 11/30/24 at 1:44 pm to Safety Blitz
So Borrego is an active member of this coaching staff (I thought he is charge of the offense). So why isn't he putting in new sets or offense or whatever he needs to to make it work.
He supposedly have good offers in the offseason to leave. So why did he stay and why isn't he playing a bigger role?
Green is not a tactician. He's a player relations type of coach. It why he is so meagerly paid and why he was give proven assistants. Why aren't those assistants performing? Is Green stopping them? Are they trying to sabotage him? Do you want to elevate guys that would intentionally do that to their boss?
He supposedly have good offers in the offseason to leave. So why did he stay and why isn't he playing a bigger role?
Green is not a tactician. He's a player relations type of coach. It why he is so meagerly paid and why he was give proven assistants. Why aren't those assistants performing? Is Green stopping them? Are they trying to sabotage him? Do you want to elevate guys that would intentionally do that to their boss?
Posted on 11/30/24 at 1:52 pm to brmark70816
quote:
So Borrego is an active member of this coaching staff (I thought he is charge of the offense). So why isn't he putting in new sets or offense or whatever he needs to to make it work. He supposedly have good offers in the offseason to leave. So why did he stay and why isn't he playing a bigger role? Green is not a tactician. He's a player relations type of coach. It why he is so meagerly paid and why he was give proven assistants. Why aren't those assistants performing? Is Green stopping them? Are they trying to sabotage him? Do you want to elevate guys that would intentionally do that to their boss?
These are questions for Willie Green. As a head coach he’s in charge of his staff.
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