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Rock n Roll and heroin
Posted on 4/14/12 at 10:57 pm
Posted on 4/14/12 at 10:57 pm
Can anyone give me some perspective here.I always wondered what it was about the stuff that seemed to turn gifted musicians into amazing artists.Looking back at the history of rock,its a who's who of heroin junkies.
I know cocaine and other drugs are as common but it seems to me that a ridiculous percentage of the greats did there most mind blowing work when they were supposedly out of their minds strung out on dope.
The Stones,Clapton,Morrison,Sublime,Tim Buckley,Nirvana,Sex pistols,Janes Addiction,Jimi Hendrix,Janis Joplin,Shannon Hoon,Pantera,Lou Reed,Scott Weiland,Aerosmith..the list goes on and on.All did their most amazing work while strung out.And the drop off if they're lucky enough to kick is always drastic as hell afterwards.
ill hang up and listen
I know cocaine and other drugs are as common but it seems to me that a ridiculous percentage of the greats did there most mind blowing work when they were supposedly out of their minds strung out on dope.
The Stones,Clapton,Morrison,Sublime,Tim Buckley,Nirvana,Sex pistols,Janes Addiction,Jimi Hendrix,Janis Joplin,Shannon Hoon,Pantera,Lou Reed,Scott Weiland,Aerosmith..the list goes on and on.All did their most amazing work while strung out.And the drop off if they're lucky enough to kick is always drastic as hell afterwards.
ill hang up and listen
3
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:01 pm to Chef Leppard
quote:
the list goes on and on.All did their most amazing work while strung out.
Actually according to most of their biographies, they made their best music in the random moments when they were sober. It seems there is a drop off because they do the bulk of their recording when they are young and most involved with their music and their band. Also, this is when they tend to do the most drugs. The older they get the more responsibility they have and the less they tend to use drugs an the more other stuff they have to worry about that isnt music. If anything, rampant drug use impeded their ability as musicians. Just my opinion.
This post was edited on 4/14/12 at 11:02 pm
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:03 pm to Breesus
quote:
Breesus
:kige:
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:04 pm to Breesus
Most of those performers gave shitty live performances strung out. I suppose like alcohol, depression from heroin leads to great angst and emotion, which translates to decent rock songs. I doubt Rock would ever be where it is today without alcohol, heroin and cocaine.
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:05 pm to Chef Leppard
Can't quote all he had to say, but Keef Richards put into perspective in his autobiography. What I got out of it was, on junk, they worked and worked til they got it right. Not so much for inspiration, but the drive to get the sound perfect.
I do know my favorite music would not exist if heroin didn't exist. Also, add Duane Allman to your list.
Keef Richards book also adds remarkable insight on trying to clean up for tour. Great read, if you into that sort of thing - Life, by Keith Richards.
I do know my favorite music would not exist if heroin didn't exist. Also, add Duane Allman to your list.
Keef Richards book also adds remarkable insight on trying to clean up for tour. Great read, if you into that sort of thing - Life, by Keith Richards.
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:06 pm to RogerTheShrubber
Can I add LSD? Sorry just a Beatles fan here is all.
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:08 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Most of those performers gave shitty live performances strung out
I disagree. Re: Allman Brothers - live at Filmore East.
Then again, you said most. There is always an exception.
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:13 pm to jose canseco
quote:
Life, by Keith Richards.
Ive read it. Awesome book. He does say that being constantly high on heroin didnt make him any better of a musician. The true greats are born with an insane amount of talent. Yes heroin seems to be a common factor in alot of awesome rock and roll, but dont forget the guys who made that music were already extremely unique and talented individuals.
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:19 pm to jose canseco
quote:
I disagree. Re: Allman Brothers - live at Filmore East.
Then again, you said most. There is always an exception.
Yeah, there are always exceptions but in the 70's and 80's, the long term affects of hard drug use began to show up in performances. Not the casual user, the stung out user.
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:25 pm to Breesus
quote:
Breesus
I agree with your entire post. In reference to "Life" and your post, I really enjoyed how he gave the perspective of himself on junk at the time, and did give the drug credit for some of his riffs, but as he aged he realized the truth - basically what you said.
I enjoyed how he was able to write about what he felt at that moment in his life, whether wrong, right, indifferent. Especially his relationship with Mick. How he did that with so many lost memories is a mystery to me.
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:27 pm to jose canseco
quote:
Most of those performers gave shitty live performances strung out
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
I disagree
+1
I know everybody isn't a huge Sublime fan,but just as an example.I have a ton of live shows by them.It seems like some of the sets where it was known that Brad was damn near drooling he was so high you could hear it.It sounded like he was channeling ghosts or some shite.He was just in a zone.Crazy.
I guess I've always attributed a grimy,soulful side in a lot of these guys to dope.But that might just be my perception
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:35 pm to jose canseco
quote:
Allman Brothers
Used to be real good friends with someone who was really close to Twiggs at one time, She had some great stories.
This post was edited on 4/14/12 at 11:37 pm
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:39 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
close to Twiggs at one time, She had some great stories.
It would be cool to hear her talk them over a whiskey and Filmore East. From what I read, Twiggs had some good stories of his own!
Posted on 4/14/12 at 11:45 pm to jose canseco
quote:
It would be cool to hear her talk them over a whiskey and Filmore East. From what I read, Twiggs had some good stories of his own!
Last time I saw her was when I called the cops to do a "welfare check" on her, she was drinking herself to death. She wouldn't talk about the old days sober, but when she was ripped she would talk quite a bit.
Posted on 4/15/12 at 12:10 am to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
She wouldn't talk about the old days sober, but when she was ripped she would talk quite a bit.
I can understand that...how cool what it have been on the studio when DA & clapton recorded layla album?!?!?!
I would be in heaven with out the junk.
Posted on 4/15/12 at 3:37 am to Chef Leppard
You start doing downers as a reaction to the uppers. Heroin is the end of the line.
Posted on 4/15/12 at 4:23 am to jose canseco
quote:
layla album
Was slap in the middle of claptons smack hey day. I don't think that heroin has any positive effect on musical ability/creativity I think that the correlation comes in that most artists are naturally troubled people who are drawn to self medication. If you're self medicating there is not much out there that is gonna make you feel better than heroin.
There aren't many happy artists. Art very seldom comes from smiles and laughter especially the art you're describing
Posted on 4/15/12 at 5:39 am to CottonWasKing
quote:
Was slap in the middle of claptons smack hey day. I don't think that heroin has any positive effect on musical ability/creativity I think that the correlation comes in that most artists are naturally troubled people who are drawn to self medication. If you're self medicating there is not much out there that is gonna make you feel better than heroin.
There aren't many happy artists. Art very seldom comes from smiles and laughter especially the art you're describing
Well said.
Posted on 4/15/12 at 9:44 am to BROffshoreTigerFan
A) Life is a great book.
Heroin was a huge factor in the grunge scene and pretty much all 90s music. I just think damaged individuals are more likely to become great artists (well-adjusted people don’t tend to need the outlet – not a hard and fast rule of life, but a generalization). Damaged individuals are more likely to be drug addicts. The same creative impulses and disrespect for authority is also what leads people to become drug addicts. I don’t think the heroin helps, but a heroin user is a lot like a struggling musician.
I will point out that in most rock biopics, they gloss over the fact that once the rock star gets off the junk, his music starts to suck (SEE: Charles, Ray; Aerosmith)
Heroin was a huge factor in the grunge scene and pretty much all 90s music. I just think damaged individuals are more likely to become great artists (well-adjusted people don’t tend to need the outlet – not a hard and fast rule of life, but a generalization). Damaged individuals are more likely to be drug addicts. The same creative impulses and disrespect for authority is also what leads people to become drug addicts. I don’t think the heroin helps, but a heroin user is a lot like a struggling musician.
I will point out that in most rock biopics, they gloss over the fact that once the rock star gets off the junk, his music starts to suck (SEE: Charles, Ray; Aerosmith)
Posted on 4/15/12 at 12:20 pm to Baloo
quote:
that once the rock star gets off the junk, his music starts to suck
I feel like that is generally either because of A) they have worked out whatever problems that pushed them to be great artists in the first place or
B) Heroin or being fricked up in general was their comfort zone its how they got used to writing once they took one step out of their comfort zone they couldn't ever connect the dots in quite the same way.
getting clean was great for the human being but bad for the artist. Songwriters generally have the most trouble with this, you didn't really see a drop off in Dave Schools' bass playing after he got off the smack for instance
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