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Message
re: Video of Wisconsin-Arizona State finish
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:23 pm to ballscaster
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:23 pm to ballscaster
The umpire is over the ball at the 12 or 13 second mark and instructs the defensive player to get off the ball.
At the 9 second mark he grabs the player to instruct him to get up again.
At the 7 second mark he inexplicably stops trying to remove the player and get the ball to say something to the defensive player standing next to him.
At the 5 second mark he finally gets around to getting his hands on the ball.
At the 3 second mark he places the ball on the ground and stands over it, which would not have allowed a snap even if Wisconsin was set.
At the 1 second mark he finally moves.
And we are to believe this is not inordinate? You can't honestly say this would have been allowed to happen if it was after a completed pass, as an example, with the clock running under a minute.
At the 9 second mark he grabs the player to instruct him to get up again.
At the 7 second mark he inexplicably stops trying to remove the player and get the ball to say something to the defensive player standing next to him.
At the 5 second mark he finally gets around to getting his hands on the ball.
At the 3 second mark he places the ball on the ground and stands over it, which would not have allowed a snap even if Wisconsin was set.
At the 1 second mark he finally moves.
And we are to believe this is not inordinate? You can't honestly say this would have been allowed to happen if it was after a completed pass, as an example, with the clock running under a minute.
1
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:24 pm to ballscaster
I'm still amazed that Wisconsin isn't getting more heat...the refs didnt handle the situation perfectly, but Wisconsin totally botched that sequence...why weren't they more in a hurry to line up and spike the ball??? Even if the ref would have spotted it sooner, Wisconsin was just lost and seemingly unaware that the clock was running....zero sense of urgency to get lined up for a spike.
IMO, Wisconsin has no one to blame but themselves.
And lets not forget that the only reason it came down to that was Wisconsin's decision to run that play with no timeouts and k owing full well the clock would be running.
IMO, Wisconsin has no one to blame but themselves.
And lets not forget that the only reason it came down to that was Wisconsin's decision to run that play with no timeouts and k owing full well the clock would be running.
This post was edited on 9/15/13 at 2:31 pm
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:31 pm to JPLSU1981
quote:
but Wisconsin totally botched that sequence...why weren't they more in a hurry to line up and spike the ball??? Even if the ref would have spotted it sooner, Wisconsin was just lost and seemingly unaware that the clock was running.
They were completely aware it was running that's why they were complaining to the head ref about ASU wasting time and it taking so long to spot the ball.
Maybe they shouldn't have been arguing but it wouldn't have changed a thing. To think differently would be to believe the umpire was just taking his time because Wisconsin wasn't ready anyway, and that he would have somehow hurried the process along. They weren't "set" for a snap but they were at the line waiting for the ball to be placed so they could get set.
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:33 pm to MOT
quote:Wrong again. I posted the timeline, and it was accurate.
The umpire is over the ball at the 12 or 13 second mark and instructs the defensive player to get off the ball. At the 9 second mark he grabs the player to instruct him to get up again.
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:34 pm to MOT
quote:Bad time to complain. The clock was running. You're almost there....
They were completely aware it was running that's why they were complaining to the head ref about ASU wasting time and it taking so long to spot the ball.
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:37 pm to JPLSU1981
quote:
zero sense of urgency to get lined up for a spike.
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:39 pm to MOT
It was an odd sequence of events. I guess my only point is that WIsconsin created the situation. Not ASU, not the refs, not anyone else...Wisconsin chose to run a play with no timeouts that left the clock running...Wisconsin's QB did a very unusual/strange-looking "kneel" to kill the play (which caused the crowd, ASU players, and TV viewers thinking it might have been a fumble), and then Wisconsin for whatever reason never actually got lined up for the spike until it was too late.
Did they get screwed? Maybe...but it's tough for me to feel sorry for them when their own decisions/errors helped to create the whole cluster frick to begin with.
Did they get screwed? Maybe...but it's tough for me to feel sorry for them when their own decisions/errors helped to create the whole cluster frick to begin with.
This post was edited on 9/15/13 at 2:46 pm
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:42 pm to ballscaster
quote:
Wrong again. I posted the timeline, and it was accurate.
Is this the timeline? Because if so the only major difference is you don't think anything was communicated at the 12 or 13 mark, even though the umpire was standing there. And surely he was aware the play was dead, as you pointed out, why did he not stop the clock when he knew the ball was dead and he watched the ASU player dive on the ball, then not get off the ball?
Why did he stop to talk to the other player at the 7 mark?
It was also convenient of you to omit the fact that the umpire was standing over the ball at the 3 mark.
quote:
I'm going by this video to explain this timeline:
:16 Whistle blows play dead as QB's knee hits ground.
:12 ASU player falls on the ball, thinking it is a live fumble
:09 Official taps ASU player on the shoulder, instructing him to get off the ball
:06 ASU player is no longer touching the ball
:04 Ball is spotted
:03 Wisconsin QB makes first communication for offense to be set
:01 Wisconsin is set for the play
:00 end of game
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:44 pm to MOT
quote:Not unusual when both teams show no signs of being set. Let it go.
It was also convenient of you to omit the fact that the umpire was standing over the ball at the 3 mark.
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:46 pm to ballscaster
quote:
Also, that three second rule isn't in effect here. That's a rule for when the clock starts after a first down, which was not the case here.
This is hilarious. Perhaps you will cite this "3 second rule" for us. Rule....Section....Subsection is ???
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:50 pm to JPLSU1981
quote:
I guess my only point is that WIsconsin created the situation. Not ASU, not the refs, not anyone else...Wisconsin chose to run a play with no timeouts that left the clock running
So they shouldn't have assumed some level of competency from the officials? That would be the best argument I've seen against Wisconsin, the rest is BS. They had plenty of time to accomplish what they wanted to had it not been botched by the officials, specifically the umpire.
quote:
Wisconsin's QB did a very unusual/strange-looking "kneel" to kill the play
I have no idea why people keep saying this. He took a knee and the whistle was blown to kill the play. From there is where they were screwed. It wouldn't have mattered if he would have flopped on the ground, sat on his arse, etc.
quote:
Wisconsin for whatever reason never actually got lined up for the spike until it was too late.
The reason is because the ball wasn't spotted until it was too late. Believe it or not, they weren't prepared for the umpire to dick around until there was one second on the clock. Some believe that's Wisconsin's fault and stick their head in the sand when it comes to the umpire dicking around part.
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:51 pm to arrakis
quote:Sure.
This is hilarious. Perhaps you will cite this "3 second rule" for us. Rule....Section....Subsection is ???
quote:LINK
Rule 3, Section 2, Article 5, Paragraphs a and b say the following:
“a. If the game clock is stopped and will start on the referee’s signal with three or more seconds remaining in the quarter, the offense may reasonably expect to throw the ball directly to the ground (Rule 7-3-2-e) and have enough time for another play.
“b. With two seconds or one second on the game clock there is enough time for only one play. (A.R. 3-3-5-I)”
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:55 pm to ballscaster
quote:
Bad time to complain. The clock was running. You're almost there....
And you conveniently ignore the rest of the post which was:
quote:
Maybe they shouldn't have been arguing but it wouldn't have changed a thing. To think differently would be to believe the umpire was just taking his time because Wisconsin wasn't ready anyway, and that he would have somehow hurried the process along. They weren't "set" for a snap but they were at the line waiting for the ball to be placed so they could get set
Officials frick up sometimes. It's even okay to admit it from time to time. Obviously you aren't almost there.....
Posted on 9/15/13 at 2:59 pm to MOT
quote:Yes, I am ignoring you a bit now. Here's why:
And you conveniently ignore the rest of the post which was:
quote:I'm dealing with what actually happened. You're playing pretend. Thus, nothing that you're saying matters.
Maybe they shouldn't have been arguing but it wouldn't have changed a thing. To think differently would be to believe the umpire was just taking his time because Wisconsin wasn't ready anyway, and that he would have somehow hurried the process along. They weren't "set" for a snap but they were at the line waiting for the ball to be placed so they could get set
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted on 9/15/13 at 3:00 pm to ballscaster
Another fail....
You posted:
There is no "3 second rule" for when the clock starts after a 1st down.
Note Rule 3-2-5 says absolutely nothing about "1st down"
Like I said, making up facts to support your opinion is weak....
You posted:
quote:
Also, that three second rule isn't in effect here. That's a rule for when the clock starts after a first down,
There is no "3 second rule" for when the clock starts after a 1st down.
Note Rule 3-2-5 says absolutely nothing about "1st down"
Like I said, making up facts to support your opinion is weak....
Posted on 9/15/13 at 3:04 pm to arrakis
quote:
Another fail....
You posted:
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Also, that three second rule isn't in effect here. That's a rule for when the clock starts after a first down,
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There is no "3 second rule" for when the clock starts after a 1st down.
Note Rule 3-2-5 says absolutely nothing about "1st down"
Like I said, making up facts to support your opinion is weak....
Read carefully, and don't be a dope.
quote:...like when a team gets a first down, for example. Because in college football, the clock stops and then starts on the referee's signal. The three-second-rule was not in play here since the clock was already running.
If the game clock is stopped and will start on the referee’s signal
Posted on 9/15/13 at 3:13 pm to ballscaster
So when proven wrong you change your claim.
Here is what you posted:
You CLEARLY state there is a "3 second rule" for when the clock starts after a first down.
Keep going...your ignorance is entertaining
Here is what you posted:
quote:
Also, that three second rule isn't in effect here. That's a rule for when the clock starts after a first down,
You CLEARLY state there is a "3 second rule" for when the clock starts after a first down.
Keep going...your ignorance is entertaining
Posted on 9/15/13 at 3:17 pm to arrakis
quote:Uhh...yeah. Because the clock stops after a first down and then starts when the ref starts it.
You CLEARLY state there is a "3 second rule" for when the clock starts after a first down. The 3-sec rule was not in effect last night. I pointed that out in this thread because people were citing it for this situation.
quote:
So when proven wrong you change your claim.
quote:Uhh, ok.
Keep going...your ignorance is entertaining
This post was edited on 9/15/13 at 3:19 pm
Posted on 9/15/13 at 3:20 pm to ballscaster
quote:
I'm dealing with what actually happened. You're playing pretend. Thus, nothing that you're saying matters
No, I'm stating exactly what happened, see the timeline. You said Wisconsin wasn't ready, fine. I say the umpire took too much time to spot the ball, which also happened (and the part you are ignoring/omitting).
If Wisconsin is guilty of anything it is assuming the umpire was competent, because he obviously wasn't.
Posted on 9/15/13 at 3:24 pm to ballscaster
Your words Skippy...quoted twice.
This post was edited on 9/15/13 at 3:25 pm
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