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Started By
Message
1
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:09 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
we do still live in a place where you have to be proven guilty. And until JP is (and how deeply involved he was), I'll withhold judgment on him. I think that's fair
Nobody is saying JOE PA should go to jail at this point (unless additional info should arise),but this is more than a legal issue, its a moral one and one by all accounts (including you and Lester in this thread)shows that he should have done way more than he did. Saying he was negligent is being exteremely kind to the old man. I want him fired or at least if he has any dignity at all he will resign.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:10 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
Because the original point was that "JP did the same thing as Sandusky." And that's bullshite.
of course it is
quote:
I feel like a lot of the villification of JP is because of what Sandusky did, not what JP didn't do (not all, but some).
not for people who have a logical brain in their head and can separate the two issues. \
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:11 pm to WDE24
quote:
That is debatable.
It's not. He has a boss. The AD can fire Joe Paterno if he has reason to.
quote:
This was a criminal matter and not just any criminal matter, but one that involved the sexual abuse of a child. His responsibility is greater than that and it is not debatable.
According to you, but not according to the law or the DA? You tell me it's "not debatable" when it actually is.
quote:
Enough is known from his own admission at this point.
Again, his admission that he heard an allegation and turned it over to his superiors.
quote:
It can only get worse as more information comes out.
I don't necessarily disagree with you on that. But until that information comes out, we don't know.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:11 pm to LfcSU3520
I'm going to take it on a purely business standpoint. Joepa is the leader of the Penn State football brand, he owns it and is the figurehead. Why would be allow a man who was twice accused of sexual behavior with children in his own locker room to have continued access to the locker room and team, much less run a kid's camp affiliated with the Penn State program.
How in the hell could he possibly think that that was a good decision? Why not just boot the guy, cut all ties and insulate your program from any past or future allegations of abuse? Instead, he's allowed his legacy and his program to be tarnished. I just really don't understand it.
How in the hell could he possibly think that that was a good decision? Why not just boot the guy, cut all ties and insulate your program from any past or future allegations of abuse? Instead, he's allowed his legacy and his program to be tarnished. I just really don't understand it.
This post was edited on 11/7/11 at 4:13 pm
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:12 pm to LfcSU3520
quote:
I fully believe that details will come out in this that will warrant him not being celebrated by the university once his career is over.
I won't disagree with you. This could definitely tarnish his career and legacy, if it hasn't somewhat already (and I'm not talking about right now, in the heat of it...I'm talking about te, 20 years from now).
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:13 pm to TreyAnastasio
quote:
Here's Dan Wetzel's take
LINK
if Wetzel was posting in this thread, good chance you'd be arguing against him too. His thoughts towards Joe Pa aren't nearly as reactionary as yours or anyone else posting in this thread.
quote:
And then there is the conduct of Paterno, the 84-year-old legend. He is beloved for being the winningest coach in college football history and for running a program for more than five decades that never ran afoul of NCAA statutes.
While he may have committed no crime, he must fully explain the actions he took after hearing such an unspeakable allegation.
Did he really listen to this story and think merely telling the AD was enough? Why did he wait a day to summon Curley to his home? Wouldn’t a charge like this take precedent over pretty much everything? Why didn’t he personally look into it further? This is something that allegedly happened in his locker room, by a man he both coached and employed as a trusted assistant for a combined 33 years?
Technically Paterno may have done the right thing, reporting the allegation to his superior, but he isn’t just some middle manager. Tim Curley worked for Joe Paterno more than Joe Paterno worked for Tim Curley. He could’ve called in the police himself.
Paterno was 75 at the time and his advancing age and the limits of his participation in the program are well known. That simply can’t be used as an excuse. Positions of authority come with great responsibility and advancing age does not excuse someone of merely accepting the plaudits of success while avoiding the more difficult duties of the position.
Paterno may very well have appropriate answers to all of the above questions and more. He needs to give them. Four-hundred-plus victories shouldn’t absolve anyone from being accountable in a case such as this
I agree with most of this.
This post was edited on 11/7/11 at 4:14 pm
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:13 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
quote:
That is debatable.
It's not. He has a boss. The AD can fire Joe Paterno if he has reason to.
JoPa will step down, be fired or reassigned. My guess.
Just curious, why do you think your boss wants to be involved in some crime story? Do you know what I would tell an employee? Call the f'king police and then we can talk.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:13 pm to Tiger Ryno
quote:
Nobody is saying JOE PA should go to jail at this point
This. Joe Pa should be fired. End of discussion. No one wants the guy crucified - that goes to the primary offender.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:13 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:
According to you, but not according to the law or the DA? You tell me it's "not debatable" when it actually is.
Its not debatable. The law is the moral floor. He has a moral obligation to go above and beyond that.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:13 pm to CocomoLSU
quote:I live in a world where a person's responsibility goes beyond what is legally required. Especially in a case where a child is being sexually abused and a person in Paterno's position knows about it.
According to you, but not according to the law or the DA?
This post was edited on 11/7/11 at 4:15 pm
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:14 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
JoPa will step down, be fired or reassigned. My guess.
I don't think there's any way around it. One way or the other, he's going to be out. You don't preside over a regime where this kind of stuff occurs and come out unscathed.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:15 pm to Lester Earl
this, Lester?
Looks like he agrees with most of us, on this side of the aisle. Paterno has some responsibility. How much, we don't know. But he does bear some responsibility and may not have owned up to it. In fact, it looks like he didnt
quote:
Technically Paterno may have done the right thing, reporting the allegation to his superior, but he isn’t just some middle manager. Tim Curley worked for Joe Paterno more than Joe Paterno worked for Tim Curley. He could’ve called in the police himself.
Paterno was 75 at the time and his advancing age and the limits of his participation in the program are well known. That simply can’t be used as an excuse. Positions of authority come with great responsibility and advancing age does not excuse someone of merely accepting the plaudits of success while avoiding the more difficult duties of the position.
Paterno may very well have appropriate answers to all of the above questions and more. He needs to give them. Four-hundred-plus victories shouldn’t absolve anyone from being accountable in a case such as this.
Looks like he agrees with most of us, on this side of the aisle. Paterno has some responsibility. How much, we don't know. But he does bear some responsibility and may not have owned up to it. In fact, it looks like he didnt
This post was edited on 11/7/11 at 4:17 pm
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:16 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:That is what I was thinking.
Looks like he agrees with most of us, on this side of the aisle.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:16 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
JoPa will step down, be fired or reassigned. My guess.
from a pure PR standpoint you have to let him go.
him being the age he is makes it easier too.
i still wouldn't call it morally right, at least at this point.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:17 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
if Wetzel was posting in this thread, good chance you'd be arguing against him too. His thoughts towards Joe Pa aren't nearly as reactionary as yours or anyone else posting in this thread.
He shares the same opinion that I do. Joepa didn't do enough to stop it.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:18 pm to WDE24
quote:
I live in a world where a person's responsibility goes beyond what is legally required. Especially in a case where a child is being sexually abused and a person in Paterno's position knows about it.
perfectly said
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:18 pm to RogerTheShrubber
quote:
Looks like he agrees with most of us, on this side of the aisle.
on 2 occasions Wetzel notes that he thinks Patero technically did the right thing.
on another occasion he says Paterno has a lot of questions to answer. He isnt ready to totally condemn him the way you guys are.
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:19 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
i still wouldn't call it morally right, at least at this point.
What is morally right? Doing what you can to stop this guy from doing it again? Or passing the information to someone else? What is morally right?
Posted on 11/7/11 at 4:19 pm to Lester Earl
quote:
on 2 occasions Wetzel notes that he thinks Patero technically did the right thing.
Most of us do. Technically and morally are two separate things. Most of us don't live by technicalities.
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