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re: American League Gold Gloves

Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:02 pm to
Posted by Lester Earl
3rd Ward
Member since Nov 2003
288881 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:02 pm to
quote:

well you're such an avid baseball watcher that surely you had to have noticed it right?

I mean player after player from team after team raved to us about him all year long.


i did notice, he was extremely good most of the time.

at times erratic, and im sure a lot of the props came the Rangers way considering his age.

Doesnt mean he is head and shoulders the best SS in the AL. Given his age and flashiness, im sure it could come across that way when paying a compliment.
Posted by Lester Earl
3rd Ward
Member since Nov 2003
288881 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:06 pm to
quote:

He did however revolutionize the game


strong words to say he revolutionized the game.

he may have opened some eyes...revolutionized, i wouldnt say.

quote:

Boston has taken a lot of these theories and plugged them into a much larger budget. Result? World Series and playoff appearances almost every year. It's not hard to figure out.


its pretty easy to field a winning team when money doesn't matter, regardless.

shall we start a list of all the Red Sox's frick ups financially??? pretty long list over the last few years...

money doesnt matter, they move on and just spend more. Billy Beane's theory doesnt mean shite when u can spend top 5 in the league.

shite the Yankees just bought a championship this year.
Posted by Ninja Looter
Member since Sep 2008
1848 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:10 pm to
frickKKKKKKKKK. DEREK JETER IS ONE OF THE WORST DEFENSIVE PLAYERS IN BASEBALL.
Posted by DEANintheYAY
LEFT COAST
Member since Jan 2008
31975 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:11 pm to
Can we all agree that Aybar deserved the GG this year and put this arguing to rest?
Posted by lsu31always
Team 31™
Member since Jan 2008
108110 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:11 pm to
No.
Posted by Lester Earl
3rd Ward
Member since Nov 2003
288881 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:12 pm to
quote:

it doesn't invalidate that they look at these metrics in their evaluation of how to spend their money


it definitely cheapens it

quote:

In fact, payroll size has nothing to do with evaluation tools.


ehh, it does come into play.

you dont think the Sox can take a more risky player than the A's because they can afford a mishap???

if they fail, they move on and find someone else who can do the job.

If the A's fail, they are pretty much fricked. They dont have that luxury.

quote:

Any evidence I present is automatically discredited on the grounds that all stats are bad, yet you cling to errors which, ironically, is a stat.


No, again, you only pick and choose what you read.


I never said all stats are bad.

my point, again, is that most of the SS in the AL you claim to be better, were in fact, error machines. And SS simply just dont win Gold Gloves when they make 20+ errors, which automatically puts Jeter in the top 2-3 choices for the award in the American league.

Im not sure how that is hard to follow.

throw away all the putouts and assist mistakes that I made arguing earlier, and my main point still stands.

whether he is the best or not, by process of elimination, he is one of the top choices
Posted by Lester Earl
3rd Ward
Member since Nov 2003
288881 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:14 pm to
quote:

Can we all agree that Aybar deserved the GG this year and put this arguing to rest?



no

you thought Howie Kendrick was the next Joe Morgan, and the next year he was in the minors. You are a huge freaking homer, just move on or add something to the discussion. Every Angel would have won the GG if it were up to you.



same with zephyr bat boy
Posted by Baloo
Formerly MDGeaux
Member since Sep 2003
49645 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:19 pm to
quote:

Can we all agree that Aybar deserved the GG this year and put this arguing to rest?

I'd argue Andrus, but I could live with Aybar.

Adrus had 50 more outs, but played roughly 50 more innings. Aybar turned more DP's and had half the number of errors. I'm a big proponent of making outs above all else, so I back Andrus, but Aybar is certainly a defensible choice. If nothing else, the error zealots would be happy.

In 70 less innings than Jeter, Aybar made 62 more outs, turned 27 more DP's, and committed 3 more errors, almost entirely a function of his far superior range.

Aybar and Andrus are neck and neck, depending on what you value.
Posted by DEANintheYAY
LEFT COAST
Member since Jan 2008
31975 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:20 pm to
quote:

quote:
Can we all agree that Aybar deserved the GG this year and put this arguing to rest?

no

you thought Howie Kendrick was the next Joe Morgan, and the next year he was in the minors. You are a huge freaking homer, just move on or add something to the discussion. Every Angel would have won the GG if it were up to you.

same with zephyr bat boy


I already said that Hunter probably shouldn't have won the GG, so how is that a homer?? Explain to my why Aybar isn't MORE deserving than Jeter??

Kendrick had a set back next year, but his 2nd half was pretty good and finished the season batting .291 with a SLG of .441. He had 4 errors in 431 Total Chances.
Posted by Baloo
Formerly MDGeaux
Member since Sep 2003
49645 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:22 pm to
quote:

my point, again, is that most of the SS in the AL you claim to be better, were in fact, error machines. And SS simply just dont win Gold Gloves when they make 20+ errors, which automatically puts Jeter in the top 2-3 choices for the award in the American league.

Im not sure how that is hard to follow.

And my basic point, which you continually ignore, is that 122 more outs is vastly more important than 14 errors. Jeter has no range and does not get people out. And, as you argued before I explained what Range Factor meant, the whole point is getting people out.

But if you refuse to vote for Andrus on the basis of errors, which is a stat you're clinging to as you use it to exclude the field, I don't see how you could argue Jeter over Aybar.
This post was edited on 11/11/09 at 5:23 pm
Posted by GynoSandberg
Bay St Louis, MS
Member since Jan 2006
74005 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 5:46 pm to
BALOOM!
Posted by Lester Earl
3rd Ward
Member since Nov 2003
288881 posts
Posted on 11/11/09 at 6:18 pm to
quote:

I don't see how you could argue Jeter over Aybar.


i wouldnt
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