re: So did jj kick the dude in the head?

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But if they testified to the same actions, then all charges should have been dropped?

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The grand jury decided that the evidence and testimony they received was not sufficient to move ahead with the prosecution of a second degree battery charge. They however did find that there was enough there to at least move forward with a simple battery charge.

I would venture the real issue is that there are witnesses on both sides conflicting each other. The Grand Jury struggled with who to believe and did exactly what the police and DA did- they kicked it to the next level

I said in the beginning I did not think this would go to trial and I still do not think it will see a court room

These are just my opinions, I just know that in the past LSU football players have always gotten the benefit of the doubt. Just look at how long it took to arrest him The average guy would have been arrested the next morning. For JJ to be suspended from the team and arrested means to me there must have been something pretty solid there. I hate that these kids got involved in this mess. Hopefully they have learned a life lesson that will benefit them somewhere else down the road. When you are the starting QB at LSU hopefully you are smart enough not to even be close to a situation like this, he screwed up and has paid a huge price for it. He has problably lost any chance of ever playing another game at LSU in his senior year and that is a shame. Hopefully he will realize his new role and take his new role like a man and be a positive influence the rest of the year.

Agg Battery in Louisiana requires that a dangerous weapon be used to commit the battery. 2nd degree battery is a battery that causes serious bodily injury. From the statute: "serious bodily injury means bodily injury which involves unconsciousness, extreme physical pain or protracted and obvious disfigurement, or protracted loss or impairment of the function of a bodily member, organ, or mental faculty, or a substantial risk of death"

Louisiana also has agg. 2nd degree battery in which the "serious bodily injury" is caused by a dangerous weapon. 2nd degree is not more than 5yrs, agg. 2nd degree is not more than 15yrs, both 2nd degree and agg second degree set that the jail time can be with or without hard labor.

Simple battery is any battery committed without the consent of the victim (for example, you spit on me without my consent and that is a battery in Louisiana). Simple battery is not more than 6 months, and what's important is there is no "hard labor" available for someone sentenced for simple battery. Simple battery is a misdemeanor because the offender can not be sentenced to hard labor.

Many states use the possible jail time to differentiate between a felony and a misdemeanor (anything over 1yr is a felony, under 1yr is a misdemeanor)...in Louisiana it's whether or not the punishment for the crime either includes the option to confine the offender at hard labor, or requires (like 2nd degree murder) the offender to be confined at hard labor. Interestingly enough there are a few misdemeanors in Louisiana that call for the offender to be sentenced for not more than 1 year (these would be considered felonies in many states).

The difference between felonies and misdemeanors as far as trial options are very different than many other states. In Louisiana, for a misdemeanor you DO NOT have a right to a jury trial, it is a bench trial decided by a judge. For felonies you have a right to a jury trial, but this varies depending on the offense.

Felonies that require the offender to be sentenced "at hard labor" will use a 12 member jury trial (unless waived by the defendant). Ten of the twelve members must agree in order for a verdict to be reached (a little different than most other states that require a unanimous decision).

Felonies that the offender can be sentenced with or without hard labor are entitled to a 6 person jury trial (again, that can be waived by the defendant), which must reach a unanimous decision.

Sorry for the long-winded post, but I keep seeing some incorrect explanations for the different crimes/charging options (these are probably because Louisiana's criminal code is kinda odd to most that don't live there and many that do, but it's different from the 49 other states for a reason...(thankfully, I know)I won't get into that).

I also want to make it clear that I'm not responding to any one post in particular, just wanted to provide a little information.

As far as what the GJ thought, or didn't think happened...who knows? From the very little (and I mean very little) I have heard from former co-workers, the bulk of the case centered around the actual kick(s) as the battery that was committed. Because of this (and this is just a educated guess/opinion based on nothing but prior experience), I would say the GJ did base it's indictment on the fact that it believes the victim was kicked (a crime was committed) and it believes that enough evidence exists that a battery was committed by one of the defendants (Jordan Jefferson) for this to be bound for trial for the indicated crime. On top of that they believe evidence submitted should warrant a charge of simple battery instead of the original charge (they obviously felt the evidence of serious bodily injury wasn't enough to warrant that charge at trial). Not wanting to defend, or rail against BRPD, I will say it's rather common for charges to be lowered and/or changed in the GJ and/or by the DA's Office. Whether we like or not every DA that I have ever worked with has always made it clear that they want the arresting authority to charge a offender with the highest possible statute that probable cause exists (and if multiple statutes apply, then he should be charged with all of the relevant statutes). The reason they prefer this is because it gives them more options when they get the case.

Many people will disagree with this tactic, but that's just the way it is and it's not just in Baton Rouge or in Louisiana...everywhere I have dealt with the criminal justice system this is the SOP.

wow this was long...sorry. And I apologize in advance as I did not proof this.

so what happened regarding the guy who had spinal fractures? Seems like the crime against him would be second degree battery?

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Explain the verdict to me.

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Dear God, are people really this dense?

It wasn't a verdict.

It wasn't a trial.

The grand jury gave their blessing to proceed to trial, but on a misdemeanor charge and not a felony charge.

JJ has been indicted per the grand jury.

That is all.

Trial won't be until next year as I believe was reported yesterday.

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Explain the verdict to me

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1. There was no "verdict". This was not a trial.
2. The Grand Jury hears only the evidence that the prosecutor decides to give them. The defendant is not entitled to be present, either personally or through an attorney, or present any defense. The Grand Jury's only responsibility is to decide whether that evidence presented supports (presents "probable cause" for)an indictment on a criminal charge.
3. If an indictment is issued (in this case, for simple battery)the accused then gets a full trial.
4. Without being present to hear what evidence the Grand Jury heard (or did not hear)or what the prosecutor told them, it is impossible to know how they based their decision to indict on simple battery vs. 2nd degree battery.
5. The old adage is that any decent prosecutor could get a Grand Jury to indict a ham sandwich.

The bottom line: The prosecutor is in position to control the Grand Jury and get them to do whatever he wants, based on what evidence he chooses to present to them or hold back. Garbage In-Garbage Out. That's why prosecutors like to use the Grand Jury in highly charged public and political cases. They can do what they want and use the Grand Jury for cover.

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Just look at how long it took to arrest him The average guy would have been arrested the next morning

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No they wouldn't. JJ and Johns were the only 2 they recognized. If they didn't recognize anyone how do you arrest a random person you can't ID?