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re: LSU-Arkansas-Alabama: 3-way tie discussion/breakdown
Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:06 am to Jon Ham
Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:06 am to Jon Ham
I actually respect your opinion, because of everyone you at least listen and acknowledge the possibility that LSU will stay in the Top2.
I don't necessarily agree with you, but I do respect your opinion.
I don't necessarily agree with you, but I do respect your opinion.
This post was edited on 11/21/11 at 10:07 am
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Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:10 am to Jon Ham
quote:
In your facts and conclusions, you leave out some compelling stats/arguments. Don't blame you b/c you're an LSU fan and want to present LSU's best argument
Fair enough....but it is a tad funny to me that "LSU's argument" is the schedules and results of the 2011 season. That's a pretty factual/rational argument IMO.
Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:20 am to Jon Ham
quote:
Therefore, if Arkansas beats #1 LSU on the road on the last game of the season, and Arky, Bama, and LSU all finish 11-1, Arkansas deserves to jump LSU and LSU does not deserve to fall below Bama, so final order should be: 1. Arkansas, 2. LSU, 3. Bama. Arkansas goes to SECCG, and if Arkansas wins then it's a Ark-LSU rematch for BCSNC, and if Arkansas loses SECCG then LSU-Bama rematch in BCSNC.
I must admit, a part of me tends to agree with this. However, realistically I don't think that's how it plays out.
Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:36 am to JPLSU1981
quote:
Arkansas deserves to jump LSU and LSU does not deserve to fall below Bama, so final order should be: 1. Arkansas, 2. LSU, 3. Bama.
That doesn't make much sense to me. I don't know how many voters put Arky over a Bama team that beat them by 24. I would think that Bama gets the majority of 1st place votes with Arkansas and LSU splitting the #2 votes. Even if Arky got 90% of those #2 votes, LSU might be okay
Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:42 am to lsumatt
The network sponsors would have a heart attack with an ARKY/ LSU rematch of the BCSNC...
Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:44 am to lsumatt
No question....although he makes a semi-rational argument, there's no way realistically that it ends up 1. Arky 2. LSU 3. Alabama
This post was edited on 11/21/11 at 10:49 am
Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:48 am to lsumatt
matt...take it FWIW, because I heard this 3rd hand, and not directly, but a friend called and told me Brad Edwards was on Mike and Mike this morning and basically changed his stance from last night, supposedly now saying that after reviewing the computers, it appears likely that LSU will not fall out of the Top2 with a loss to Arkansas.
Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:50 am to JPLSU1981
quote:
Brad Edwards was on Mike and Mike this morning and basically changed his stance from last night,
Glad ESPN pays him good money to take a hard, unwavering line on this stuff.
Posted on 11/21/11 at 10:52 am to JPLSU1981
quote:This has the statistical chance of....
1. Arky 2. LSU 3. Alabama
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:01 am to TigerWoody
Answer me this: Why in the hell does Bama not even get consideration for the #3 spot by most people when discussing the hypothetical Arkansas win over LSU?
LSU deserves to be ranked ahead of Bama even with a loss to Arkansas. LSU's head to head win over Bama and LSU's resume as a whole dictate this.
Arkansas, as the number 3 team ending the season winning @ #1, would surely deserve to jump at least one spot in the rankings. Arkansas would be on an 8 game winning streak, and had to face the same SEC West teams Bama did except Arkansas had a harder slate of SEC East games. Bama had both LSU and Arkansas at home and went 1-1, if Arkansas goes 1-1 with both games on the road, ending the season with a win @ #1, then it's clear Arkansas is deserving of top 2.
So why does everyone completely pass over the thought of Bama potentially being the #3 team as if that would be some huge injustice, when in fact it would be a bigger injustice to leave Arkansas or LSU out of the top two if Arkansas ends up beating LSU?
LSU deserves to be ranked ahead of Bama even with a loss to Arkansas. LSU's head to head win over Bama and LSU's resume as a whole dictate this.
Arkansas, as the number 3 team ending the season winning @ #1, would surely deserve to jump at least one spot in the rankings. Arkansas would be on an 8 game winning streak, and had to face the same SEC West teams Bama did except Arkansas had a harder slate of SEC East games. Bama had both LSU and Arkansas at home and went 1-1, if Arkansas goes 1-1 with both games on the road, ending the season with a win @ #1, then it's clear Arkansas is deserving of top 2.
So why does everyone completely pass over the thought of Bama potentially being the #3 team as if that would be some huge injustice, when in fact it would be a bigger injustice to leave Arkansas or LSU out of the top two if Arkansas ends up beating LSU?
This post was edited on 11/21/11 at 11:01 am
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:04 am to Jon Ham
quote:
LSU deserves to be ranked ahead of Bama even with a loss to Arkansas.
Doesn't Bama deserve to be ahead of Arkansas by DESTROYING them by 24?
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:08 am to Jon Ham
I realize that a win is a win, but IMO the reason you don't see more people putting Bama 3 in this scenario is because (whether justified or not), Alabama has certainly been more "dominant" this season than Arkansas has, and arguably against a tougher schedule.
I actually think there is some legitimacy to the argument that Arkansas MAY have faced a stronger or equal schedule than Bama and certainly has a marquee win better than any Bama win, but regardless that is very close IMO and Bama has certainly been more dominant along the way than Arkansas.
You know where I stand....It's clear to me that the rankings based on the entire season resumes if Arky beats LSU should be 1. LSU 2. Bama 3. Arkansas
But I'm with you in the sense that I am open to the argument that Arkansas has faced a stronger schedule than Bama (when you include a win @ #1 LSU which is better than any win on Bama's schedule). But at the end of the day, and reviewing the schedule, I must admit I would say Bama has faced the tougher schedule, but not by a wide margin over Arky. While Arkansas has the best win of the two teams, Bama also faced LSU, so that kinda washes out. And Bama played Penn State, which is certainly IMO superior to TexA&M.
And, again, while score doesn't matter, Arkansas will have the only games between the three teams where one team got crushed. So that plays into as well.
I actually think there is some legitimacy to the argument that Arkansas MAY have faced a stronger or equal schedule than Bama and certainly has a marquee win better than any Bama win, but regardless that is very close IMO and Bama has certainly been more dominant along the way than Arkansas.
You know where I stand....It's clear to me that the rankings based on the entire season resumes if Arky beats LSU should be 1. LSU 2. Bama 3. Arkansas
But I'm with you in the sense that I am open to the argument that Arkansas has faced a stronger schedule than Bama (when you include a win @ #1 LSU which is better than any win on Bama's schedule). But at the end of the day, and reviewing the schedule, I must admit I would say Bama has faced the tougher schedule, but not by a wide margin over Arky. While Arkansas has the best win of the two teams, Bama also faced LSU, so that kinda washes out. And Bama played Penn State, which is certainly IMO superior to TexA&M.
And, again, while score doesn't matter, Arkansas will have the only games between the three teams where one team got crushed. So that plays into as well.
This post was edited on 11/21/11 at 11:15 am
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:11 am to lsumatt
quote:
Doesn't Bama deserve to be ahead of Arkansas by DESTROYING them by 24?
You want to judge an entire season by one point differential from one game?
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:14 am to Jon Ham
quote:
You want to judge an entire season by one point differential from one game?
What do you want me to judge it by? Best resume for the entire season like the computers do? Fine - then it would be:
1. LSU
2. Bama
3. Arky
Happy?
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:18 am to lsumatt
quote:
What do you want me to judge it by? Best resume for the entire season like the computers do? Fine - then it would be:
1. LSU
2. Bama
3. Arky
Happy?
All 3 teams 11-1; only one had to play the other 2 on the road, only 1 had to play one of the only two good teams from the East this season, only one would end the season on an 8 game win streak and a win @ #1.
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:24 am to Jon Ham
quote:
only one had
1. an OOC schedule which best team was 6-5
2. almost lost to Vandy and Ole Miss
3. Lost by 24 to one of the other big 3
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:27 am to Jon Ham
You make some good arguments FOR Arkansas....but there are a few solid arguments AGAINST Arkansas (more arguments against Arky than against LSU and Bama).
IMO, there are very few arguments AGAINST LSU. Also, there are fewer arguments AGAINST Alabama than there are arguments against arkansas.
I know that's bungled, but does the above make sense? Basically, if we had to rank the teams in order of who has the least "negative" things on their resume, it would IMO be:
1. LSU
2. Alabama
3. Arkansas
IMO, there are very few arguments AGAINST LSU. Also, there are fewer arguments AGAINST Alabama than there are arguments against arkansas.
I know that's bungled, but does the above make sense? Basically, if we had to rank the teams in order of who has the least "negative" things on their resume, it would IMO be:
1. LSU
2. Alabama
3. Arkansas
This post was edited on 11/21/11 at 11:28 am
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:32 am to lsumatt
quote:
1. an OOC schedule which best team was 6-5
2. almost lost to Vandy and Ole Miss
3. Lost by 24 to one of the other big 3
1. Texas A&M is as good or better than PSU. PSU has lost to every ranked teams its faced and beat Temple by 4, Indiana by 6, Purdue by 5, and Illinois by 3. A&M has beat a ranked team (currently #18 Baylor), and all of their losses have come to top 20 teams. Penn State is not some awesome team worthy of giving Bama a non-conference edge over Arkansas' A&M game.
2. Is what "almost" happened really that important? Or is what actually happened more important? Bama ALMOST beat LSU! ALMOST!!!
3. The 24 point win by Bama over Arkansas is a big factor, I admit. But if Arkansas beats LSU, Arkansas' 1-1 record @ Bama and @ LSU would be more impressive than Bama's 1-1 record at home against Arky and LSU; especially considering the timing of the games.
This post was edited on 11/21/11 at 11:34 am
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:32 am to Jon Ham
I don't know why bama gets such a pass just because they're bama. A one loss arkansas team would have a better resume than bama and IMO will have a better computer score.
Posted on 11/21/11 at 11:33 am to beaverfever
quote:
A one loss arkansas team would have a better resume than bama
Based on what?
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