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re: Alleva confirms investigation of possible violations

Posted on 12/1/09 at 7:11 pm to
Posted by NBamaAlum
Soul Patrolville
Member since Jan 2009
27604 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 7:11 pm to
quote:

1) If nothing comes from it, you don't want to lose time. You assume innocence.
This isn't a court of law. The presumption of innocence isn't afforded to one working in a contractual situation like this. If it was serious enough to warrant an investigation, you protect the program.


quote:

2) DJ didn't know that they were on to him.


Huh? What does him being aware have to do with them removing him from recruiting to protect the program? You make him aware..but even then his awareness is irrelevent to the investigation.


quote:

3) Monitoring him to see if he tried anything else.


Wow. If your head coach is "giving him enough rope to hang himself", rather than pulling him aside and putting a stop to it..this program is headed for trouble.
Posted by Roaad
White Privilege Broker
Member since Aug 2006
81679 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 7:15 pm to
I said that it was all speculation.

I assume they had reasons. Alleva is no idiot.
Posted by NBamaAlum
Soul Patrolville
Member since Jan 2009
27604 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 7:30 pm to
The things that are not in speculation are that

1) The WR coach was allowed to recruit
2) Miles and the AD were made aware that there was an issue.


Now, what is speculative is the time line for 2 above. If Miles and the AD were informed at the start of the season that there was an issue, and didn't allow the player to play..an issue arises. If Miles and the AD made the informed decision to not play the kid, why was the coach responsible for the issue allowed to recruit? At best, Miles and the AD were not aware of the situation (which doesn't make sense considering the kid didn't play this year) and at worst they allowed the coach at the center of the situation to continue to go out on the road.

This doesn't look like a secondary issue at all. And if anyone knows a clusterfrick in the making with the SEC/NCAA, its an Alabama fan.
Posted by MCSquared16
Member since Jan 2009
3411 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 7:31 pm to
I know it hasn't been confirmed that it was Hicks, but according to ESPN, he logged game time in the State game and wracked up a whopping 1 tackle for the season. Is that right?
Posted by whodemlsu
South of I-10, North of the Gulf
Member since May 2008
531 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 7:32 pm to
quote:

I'm not sure I've ever seen a stickied thread with such a high percentage of crap in it before


Define "Crap".
Posted by JPLSU1981
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2005
28200 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 8:21 pm to
I'm just speculating, but they were probably made aware either right before or some time during the season. They certainly probably put a stop to it, which probably included having a serious discussion with McCarthy.

But my guess is the timing of it all led one or all of them to the conclusion that they would:
1. put a stop to it immediately and...
2. let the season finish out and part ways with McCarthy as it would have been a huge distraction prior to or during the season, not to mention difficult to find a suitable replacement at the current time. Also, if they put a stop to the violations, I see no problem with him continuing to recruit for LSU.


*Also, keep in mind ... if the violations are what we are assuming (lodging for Hicks when he was not yet qualified and on scholarship), then technically there was nothing really to "put a stop to" as the violations were already over and done with. They weren't some kind of "ongoing" violations.
This post was edited on 12/1/09 at 8:26 pm
Posted by mikeytig
NE of Tiger Stadium
Member since Nov 2007
7720 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 8:23 pm to
(no message)
This post was edited on 12/1/09 at 8:25 pm
Posted by JPLSU1981
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2005
28200 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 8:31 pm to
I am obviously bias as I am an LSU fan, and don't take this to mean that I am "ok" with any type of NCAA violations, but from everything I see thus far, this isn't going to amount to much in terms of penalties.

I don't know if the correct term is "secondary violation" or what the correct term would be, but it is certainly not a situation that warrants any major penalties IMO, if any.

This post was edited on 12/1/09 at 8:32 pm
Posted by memphisplaya
Member since Jan 2009
87005 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 8:54 pm to
quote:

I know it hasn't been confirmed that it was Hicks, but according to ESPN, he logged game time in the State game and wracked up a whopping 1 tackle for the season. Is that right?


No he never saw the field or even dressed for a game.
Posted by lsutothetop
TigerDroppings Elite
Member since Jul 2008
11323 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:07 pm to
Think about it for a minute, though. (I haven't read all of this thread, admittedly, so I hope this hasn't been debunked...)

If DeAngelo Benton is the recruit that was at the center of attention, then Miles withheld no one from playing! After all, Benton is now at Auburn, so Miles can't have withheld anyone!

Therefore, it is possible that Miles and Alleva were NOT aware of the issue and so allowed McCarthy to continue recruiting.
Posted by Tigergreg
Metairie
Member since Feb 2005
24423 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:10 pm to
(no message)
This post was edited on 12/1/09 at 9:14 pm
Posted by JPLSU1981
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2005
28200 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:13 pm to
Don't think it centers on Benton, FWIW.
This post was edited on 12/1/09 at 9:15 pm
Posted by RogerTheShrubber
Juneau, AK
Member since Jan 2009
293903 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:15 pm to
quote:

The things that are not in speculation are that

1) The WR coach was allowed to recruit
2) Miles and the AD were made aware that there was an issue.



If Miles and Alleva were aware of infractions, did not inform McCarthy and allowed him to continue to recruit they are the biggest idiots in the world. Not buying it for one bit.
Posted by lsutothetop
TigerDroppings Elite
Member since Jul 2008
11323 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:21 pm to
I couldn't substantiate Benton being the reason either, but if we assume for a moment that he is, the scenario I laid out at least *seems* plausible.

The only definitive action that's been presented to this point as evidence that Miles knew about the infractions is his supposed withholding of a McCarthy recruit from playing on suspicion of an infraction being committed during the recruiting process of aforesaid recruit. (Yeah, I'll admit, that's worded like that just to say aforesaid. =P)

But if the recruit didn't actually come to LSU, then obviously Miles withholding anyone is not proof that he knew about a violation.

Given this, does it at least seem safe to say that the recruit is a McCarthy recruit that never arrived at LSU?
Posted by DrEdgeLSU
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Dec 2006
8623 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:25 pm to
Guys, ever consider that DJ was recruiting these 2010 signees before this season started, before this shite hit the fan?

Do we have evidence of continued recruiting by DJ on these guys since August, or are the 2010 guys just linked to DJ from their Jr year?
Posted by lsutothetop
TigerDroppings Elite
Member since Jul 2008
11323 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:30 pm to
quote:

Do we have evidence of continued recruiting by DJ on these guys since August, or are the 2010 guys just linked to DJ from their Jr year?

I don't, but I would think I'd hear about one of the lead recruiting coordinators just up and not recruiting for three months...

...then again, you'd also think you'd hear about this kind of stuff before now, too.
Posted by JPLSU1981
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2005
28200 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:31 pm to
This is what I have pieced together from the facts available as well as bits and pieces from throughout this thread and trying my best to "connect the dots." Don't take it as "gospel", but from what I gather this is my summation of what I believe to be going down...

quote:

The player involved is defensive tackle Akeim Hicks, a 4-star JUCO transfer from Sacramento, California. Hicks was recruited by DJ McCarthy, and did not play at all in 2009, his first and likely only year with the LSU program.

McCarthy, who will no longer be a part of the LSU coaching staff beyond the 2009 season, was in some way involved in helping pay for Hicks’ apartment at some point in his recruitment, possibly before Hicks was even qualified and on scholarship. McCarthy was solely responsible for Hicks’ recruitment to LSU. There are also seperate allegations that McCarthy may have also arranged similar things and been involved in violations in the recruitment of Dexter Pratt and DeAngelo Benton, two recruits that eventually went to Oklahoma State and Auburn, respectively.

Upon learning of the Hicks’ situation earlier this year, Les Miles informed athletic director Joe Alleva. Alleva recommended that Miles fire McCarthy on the spot. However, Miles and Alleva decided to wait until the end of the season to let McCarthy go. As to not put LSU at further risk, LSU did not play Hicks at all in the 2009 season.

LSU is in the midst of an ongoing investigation into the matter and is working with the SEC and NCAA in resolving the issues and self-reporting of any violations.
This post was edited on 12/1/09 at 9:32 pm
Posted by lsutothetop
TigerDroppings Elite
Member since Jul 2008
11323 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:40 pm to
I know it got buried, but I believe I demonstrated pretty well that Hicks cannot be the player, on the basis that he played this year.

quote:

For what it's worth, Akiem Hicks DID play one game this year.

Exhibit A:
quote:

11-01-09, 10:42 AM

The time the injury was added to the injury report. This was the Sunday after the Tulane game, which was the seventh game of the year.

Now get Exhibit B:
quote:

Junior DT Akiem Hicks has missed four straight games and is out indefinitely.

Note that it says four straight... after the seventh game. If he hadn't played all year, why would they only mention 'four straight' games?

If that wasn't enough, Exhibit C is the most damning line:
quote:

Hicks was supposed to be a major contributor for the Tigers this season as a defensive lineman, but injuries and illness have sidelined him for much of the season (has only PLAYED IN ONE GAME IN 2009).

Read: If it's Hicks, this isn't as minor as originally thought.

Two conclusions:
(1) This is bigger than simply trouble involving the recruiting of a player who never played by a presumed-fired position coach.
(2) Akiem Hicks is not the player in question.


That is the only flaw I see in your summation, but it is indeed a large flaw if my conclusion here is correct.
Posted by beachdude
FL
Member since Nov 2008
6286 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:55 pm to
Scroll to the bottom of your link and click on LSU Injury Report Archive and that opens up the complete history back to the beginning of the season. Read each comment on Hicks and you will see that (apparently) each week he was out.
Posted by JPLSU1981
Baton Rouge
Member since Oct 2005
28200 posts
Posted on 12/1/09 at 9:58 pm to
On that site (which is not an official LSU site btw), it has Hicks on the injury report for every single week of the season.

Click on "additional LSU injury report archives"


Also, the fact that the nature of his injury was never disclosed the entire season is suspicious in itself.
This post was edited on 12/1/09 at 10:00 pm
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