- My Forums
- Tiger Rant
- LSU Recruiting
- SEC Rant
- Saints Talk
- Pelicans Talk
- More Sports Board
- Fantasy Sports
- Golf Board
- Soccer Board
- O-T Lounge
- Tech Board
- Home/Garden Board
- Outdoor Board
- Health/Fitness Board
- Movie/TV Board
- Book Board
- Music Board
- Political Talk
- Money Talk
- Fark Board
- Gaming Board
- Travel Board
- Food/Drink Board
- Ticket Exchange
- TD Help Board
Customize My Forums- View All Forums
- Show Left Links
- Topic Sort Options
- Trending Topics
- Recent Topics
- Active Topics
Started By
Message
re: How many tons of AC for a home with spray foam insulation?
Posted on 3/26/19 at 9:18 am to Clint Torres
Posted on 3/26/19 at 9:18 am to Clint Torres
Orientation of the home, trees, windows, infiltration, duct leakage, etc. all factor in to HVAC sizing.
The only way to know for sure is to have a manual J and manual D done. This should have been done on your house when the HVAC was designed.
There are no "rules of thumb" for HVAC sizing. Every house is different despite materials used.
Undersized equipment will be more efficient and provide more comfort (especially humidity control during fall/spring) than oversized equipment. Anyone telling you that you need a larger system just because is not an energy expert and should be ignored.
The only way to know for sure is to have a manual J and manual D done. This should have been done on your house when the HVAC was designed.
There are no "rules of thumb" for HVAC sizing. Every house is different despite materials used.
Undersized equipment will be more efficient and provide more comfort (especially humidity control during fall/spring) than oversized equipment. Anyone telling you that you need a larger system just because is not an energy expert and should be ignored.
Posted on 3/26/19 at 9:20 am to Clint Torres
quote:
definitely don’t know any of that. Who can do this manual j? Pretty much any hvac contractor?
If you already live in the house you can figure this out yourself. Your system should be able to maintain 75F up to the 99% design temp for your area. This is typically 100-105F for the southern areas of the USA.
When your area hits the design temp, it should hold 75F while running 90-100% of the time. If your system has a duty cycle less than 90%, you are oversized. If your system is running 100% and the temp goes above 75F, you are undersized.
Posted on 3/26/19 at 9:51 am to Clint Torres
500 square feet = 1 ton
Posted on 3/26/19 at 9:59 am to Hamma1122
quote:
500 square feet = 1 ton
So that's what everyone is saying is kind of obsolete now depending on a ton of factors specific to the house.
Posted on 3/26/19 at 10:15 am to Clint Torres
quote:
So that's what everyone is saying is kind of obsolete now depending on a ton of factors specific to the house.
Yep. Ceiling height being a big one. That rule of thumb assumes standard heights.
Posted on 3/26/19 at 10:25 am to convertedtiger
quote:
Yep. Ceiling height being a big one. That rule of thumb assumes standard heights.
So my ceilings are 10 ft which is higher than standard but the place is supposed to be significantly more energy efficient than a standard home.
Posted on 3/26/19 at 1:22 pm to Clint Torres
quote:
So my ceilings are 10 ft which is higher than standard but the place is supposed to be significantly more energy efficient than a standard home.
FYI, I have 3200 finished square feet (2 story) and my total cooling load is 1.6 ton. I don't have spray foam in the walls (spray foam was only used for rim joists). I used blown fiberglass in the walls and the house is fairly tight.
There is likely nothing to be concerned about with your system. Have you been through a summer with it yet?
Posted on 3/26/19 at 2:04 pm to Clint Torres
OP, if this was done on a new build purchase you are likely fine. I wouldn't sweat it too much.
The concern with spray foam is that due to it being efficient the HVAC system doesn't run enough and remove enough of the moisture. There are other cheaper methods such as ceiling fans and dehumidifiers that can be used to accomplish that also.
The most important thing for an AC is to be able to cool the house. I'd ask the builder to prove it. It won't cost him anything likely to get his HVAC subcontractor out there or pay someone a little to do it, he should have done this already anyway.
More than likely, as said the 500 sq ft is for older less efficient homes and you are fine.
The concern with spray foam is that due to it being efficient the HVAC system doesn't run enough and remove enough of the moisture. There are other cheaper methods such as ceiling fans and dehumidifiers that can be used to accomplish that also.
The most important thing for an AC is to be able to cool the house. I'd ask the builder to prove it. It won't cost him anything likely to get his HVAC subcontractor out there or pay someone a little to do it, he should have done this already anyway.
More than likely, as said the 500 sq ft is for older less efficient homes and you are fine.
Posted on 3/26/19 at 2:18 pm to notsince98
quote:
There is likely nothing to be concerned about with your system. Have you been through a summer with it yet?
The home is new; no one has spent a night there.
Posted on 3/26/19 at 2:19 pm to baldona
quote:
More than likely, as said the 500 sq ft is for older less efficient homes and you are fine.
Thanks. The builder says that a manual J was done and he's going to get a copy. I feel a good bit better about this after hearing from y'all.
Posted on 3/26/19 at 2:32 pm to Clint Torres
quote:
Thanks. The builder says that a manual J was done and he's going to get a copy. I feel a good bit better about this after hearing from y'all.
Sounds like you have a quality builder. Having properly sized equipment is rare these days. Most crappy builders throw oversized equipment in houses and dont care that it decreases efficiency (higher utility bills), decreases comfort (less humidity control) and shortens equipment life. The extra start/stop cycles on oversized equipment shortens the life of the equipment as most wear and tear occurs during starting, not while running.
Then on top of all that, when you have properly sized equipment, you'll likely buy properly sized replacement equipment in the future instead of wasting money on larger systems that you don't need. That saves even more money.
This post was edited on 3/26/19 at 2:33 pm
Posted on 3/26/19 at 3:48 pm to notsince98
Really sounds like this country is wasting a ton of energy on oversized HVAC equipment
Posted on 3/26/19 at 6:26 pm to Clint Torres
quote:
Really sounds like this country is wasting a ton of energy on oversized HVAC equipment
In the residential world for sure.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 8:45 am to notsince98
Is it unusual to have 3 ton coil/air handler and 2 ton condenser. I've read online that that can cause problems with humidity and with a tight spray foam house, perhaps it could be exacerbated?
Posted on 3/27/19 at 9:27 am to Clint Torres
quote:
Is it unusual to have 3 ton coil/air handler and 2 ton condenser. I've read online that that can cause problems with humidity and with a tight spray foam house, perhaps it could be exacerbated?
This is a complicated question. It depends on where you are located geographically. The interior coil is often oversized by HVAC installers to get a higher SEER rating out of a system. So putting a 3ton coil with a 2 ton AC can get you higher SEER ratings IF the system (coil and AC) is AHRI listed/tested to do so.
The issue with doing this is the larger coil has a larger surface area. This is great for getting the most heat transfer into the refrigerant. the problem is this makes the refrigerant warmer. As a result, the temperature of the coil will be warmer. The downside of this is that it reduces the capability of the coil to remove moisture/humidity from the air. The cooler the coil temp, the more humidity it can remove.
In a humid climate where comfort is the primary concern, you would probably want a 2 ton coil matched to a 2 ton AC unit as that will be better at latent cooling (removing water from the air).
If your system is sophisticated enough, you can still get good humidity control out of a 3 ton coil. If the Air handling unit (AHU) has a variable speed ECM blower and the proper thermostat, the thermostat can be set to slow the blower down when the humidity is high. The slower CFMs across the coil allow the coil temperature to go down and this pull more water out.
If you have detailed equipment info (model numbers and such) I can help you dig into this a bit.
This post was edited on 3/27/19 at 9:30 am
Posted on 3/27/19 at 10:12 am to notsince98
Thanks so much for this response. I’m going to try to get that model info. I do know that the units are single stage which doesn’t sound good per your response. And I’m in New Orleans. Hot and humid. Are you local? I would happily pay for a consult/inspection?
Posted on 3/27/19 at 10:41 am to notsince98
So far I have only gathered that the condensers are American Standard 2 ton and Air Handlers are Lennox 3 ton.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 11:34 am to Clint Torres
quote:
So far I have only gathered that the condensers are American Standard 2 ton and Air Handlers are Lennox 3 ton.
Well that is a red flag for sure. All newly installed systems should be "matched." A matched system comes with an AHRI certified listing that proves the entire system has been tested together and will perform to the ratings as published by AHRI certificate.
Example AHRI rating certificate
If an installed system does not have an AHRI rating certificate, nobody can guarantee final efficiency or rated capabilities of the system. Ask for the AHRI rating certificate or the AHRI Certified Reference Number for the system. If you get the number you can look it up here
From a quick scan through the database, there appears to be no listings for a matching system using American Standard 2 ton AC with a Lennox air handling unit/indoor coil.
It would be very reasonable for you to ask for this proof of matched system and if they can't, they should replace either the AC or the air handlers to provide a fully matched system. They cannot guarantee any performance otherwise. Either American Standard or Lennox systems are good. The install matters more than the brand.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:13 pm to notsince98
Damn.. I'm asking the builder about this certificate. What do you recommend I do? Sounds like I need to get someone else out to evaluate it.
Posted on 3/27/19 at 12:36 pm to Clint Torres
Just see if they can provide the AHRI certificate. Hold tight until they respond. Panicking or jumping to conclusions won't help anyone.
Sometimes people just didn't know and once they learn they want to make it right. I don't think you have anything to worry about at this point.
Sometimes people just didn't know and once they learn they want to make it right. I don't think you have anything to worry about at this point.
Popular
Back to top
