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Started By
Message
re: Harmones are much more important than caloric balance... weight loss & health
Posted on 5/25/18 at 11:02 pm to tommy2tone1999
Posted on 5/25/18 at 11:02 pm to tommy2tone1999
quote:
Whatever dude. You're stuck on CICO so there's no changing your mind, but the science is clear.
You are right the science is clear, go read the studies. Even the study you posted didn't say anything about utilizing body fat better, it says fat mobilization, there is a reason for that.
And I guess you know more than the Experts like Lyle McDonald (you know the guy who wrote the ketogenic book, did bodyopus under duchaines direction, write ud2.0), Eric helms, Greg nuckoles, Martin Berkham, also argon, Layne Norton etc.
Watch these
LINK
LINK
LINK
LINK
There are some advantages to keto, mainly it blunts hunger for many, this helps many stay consistent. And there is a slight thermic advantage, although very slight.
quote:
Insulin drives the fat storage, fat burn cycle, not calories.
Then how are so many Americans to get ripped, stage ready ripped without going low carb? Ever consider the role cortisol plays when lifting heavy on Lee carbs? If not you should.
quote:
If calorie deficit diets worked everyone who went to Weight Watchers or was a contestant on Biggest Loser would stay skinny, but it never happens that way.
First of when it comes to weight watchers, they aren't eating enough protein to m maintain muscle mass but are many lifting heavy. This lowers metabolic rate and people that gain the new weight back do so because they are no longer on the diet.
Biggest losers end up with metabolic damage just if the time sure to super low calls. Also when they go back to normal life they start eating a lot more.
Both of these were terrible examples. And it's sad I wrote something that long on a Friday night
0
Posted on 5/25/18 at 11:04 pm to Powerman
There is nothing wrong with keto, there is just nothing special about it when it comes to fat loss either
Posted on 5/25/18 at 11:13 pm to lsu777
I only used the keto study for the info on insulin. Strictly speaking, anything that lowers serim insulin whether it is low carb, or fasting is the key to allowing the body to tap into fat. I’ve posted the studies in previous posts about insulin being the makor driving force not calories, and you agreed with my posts then, but now you’re back on calorie restriction. So whatever. Believe what you want.
Posted on 5/26/18 at 3:23 am to tommy2tone1999
You are right that you will use stored glucose as fuel first but insulin levels do not have to be surprised to mobilize fat stores.
And what I am saying is you don't understand the study you linked.
I have always, always been a cico, iiyfm guy for strictly weight loss. I believe you should use whatever diet you want and for most people focus on two key areas, daily protein and weekly calories. For 95% if the population this will get then where they want to go so long as they are consistent. Do I believe it's the most effecient way to do things? Nope but it's the base of the nutritional pyramid.
Lastly, you are saying I am closed minded, I read the study you posted, you won't even watch what I posted it even acknowledge you could be wrong.
And what I am saying is you don't understand the study you linked.
I have always, always been a cico, iiyfm guy for strictly weight loss. I believe you should use whatever diet you want and for most people focus on two key areas, daily protein and weekly calories. For 95% if the population this will get then where they want to go so long as they are consistent. Do I believe it's the most effecient way to do things? Nope but it's the base of the nutritional pyramid.
Lastly, you are saying I am closed minded, I read the study you posted, you won't even watch what I posted it even acknowledge you could be wrong.
Posted on 5/26/18 at 8:42 am to lsu777
I have read studies that you have posted, and if you recall from other IF posts I acknowledge that calorie restriction plays some roll in the process, but from what I have read the physiological processes driven by hormones, with insulin being the major player, have the greater effect. Hell I used to be one of those who supported CICO years ago, until I started digging deeper. We’re coming at it from opposite ends of the spectrum and getting close to agreement somewhere in the middle. I posted a comment, and you chose to make it personal. As a result I defended my comment with science, and again you made it personal. How about we agree to disagree and keep the personal jabs out of it?
Posted on 5/26/18 at 9:04 am to lsu777
I changed the first post on the putthefork thread for ya, let me know if thats what you needed...
Posted on 5/26/18 at 9:09 am to tommy2tone1999
I never made it personal nor took it that away of you did, I apologize, never meant it that away. We can agree to disagree.
And just to clarify, it's not that what your saying doesn't play some role but you are focusing on majoring in the minors so to speak and listening to so called experts that have been discredited over and over.
And just to clarify, it's not that what your saying doesn't play some role but you are focusing on majoring in the minors so to speak and listening to so called experts that have been discredited over and over.
Posted on 5/26/18 at 9:09 am to Junky
Thanks man, that's good.
Posted on 5/26/18 at 9:27 am to lsu777
Okay I can accept that we agree to disagree. I have seen a lot of so-called experts on both sides of this spectrum discredited. If I see an article or video or even a forum post, I always dig deeper. I look for the studies they cite, I also look for associated and similar studies, but only those done in vivo on humans, and even then I look for bias. The issue of what triggers fat loss is not settled in the scientific community and it won’t be for some time. So even there it is expert opinion based in study. Even with individuals the different triggers will have different degrees of effect. On my end, please don’t feel that if I have a difference of opinion with you, that I am attacking you personally. I, like you am the first line lab rat in my own personal experiment, and am constantly testing new theories.
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