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re: WoW - sense of community gone? Who's to blame?
Posted on 8/28/19 at 11:53 am to brucevilanch
Posted on 8/28/19 at 11:53 am to brucevilanch
True
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Posted on 8/28/19 at 11:58 am to Mystery
quote:
I don't believe what you are saying is correct. You honestly sound like an old man, I don't believe younger people are any less social than before even if everyone's heads are in phones.
I am old. But go out and say hello to a younger person on the sidewalk at a crosswalk. Most don't even acknowledge you, and most of the ones that do are weird about it.. Very few look up and say hello back with a smile. I work at a university. So, yeah, I have some experience in this.
Seems like many don't know how to interact with a stranger.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 12:01 pm to Mystery
quote:
For example I grew up playing SOCOM. SOCOM had no matchmaking, just lobbies. I played in US East lobbies always. Which meant I regularly ran into the same players. Which made the game more sociable. That just will not happen anymore. Matchmaking gives you no real reason to talk to anybody in today's shooters. This is the same problem the dungeon finders of today's MMOs have.
I agree with you here. This is one of the reasons you can blame the game itself. WoW has this issue.
You LFG for a dungeon run. Get 5 people in there. Not a single word in chat from anyone. Finish the run, everyone instantly leaves the group.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 12:02 pm to i am dan
Maybe, maybe not. Just seems like one of those things people romanticize the past about. I am in my 30s and don't notice much of a difference, although I am not hitting the sidewalks.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 12:02 pm to Mystery
quote:
Also to add to my point. I completely stopped meeting people online in games because of how new games are structured, specifically shooters.
I also play CS. People talk all the time in that game. Makes it much more fun.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 12:43 pm to 50_Tiger
quote:
I disagree. Server communities were legit back in Vanilla. I knew who the shite heads were on Alleria.
Yep, I played a bit of vanilla. The community was good through BC too.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 12:46 pm to brucevilanch
quote:
You're not 14 anymore. So, hanging out with incels and talking about raiding dragon magic, or whatever the frick you nerds do, isn't exactly the most stimulating situation anymore.
The median age of WoW player is close to 30.
Hey, I only play for the false sense of achievement that I can't attain in real life. Get that straight now.
How many comic book Avenger movies have you watched, cool guy?
Posted on 8/28/19 at 12:51 pm to i am dan
quote:
The median age of WoW player is close to 30.
An entire guild that I play with on retail is over the age of 30.
I never understood why people give a damn what others do that does not affect them
Posted on 8/28/19 at 1:22 pm to Mystery
quote:
That just will not happen anymore. Matchmaking gives you no real reason to talk to anybody in today's shooters
Agreed.
This was one thing I loved about Destiny. I met so many people on LFG subreddits and sites that if I wanted to do any activity I could at pretty much any time.
Matchmaking for co-op, PvE, content is one of my least favorite things to do. It is obviously convenient, but if I can avoid using it I will every time.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 1:28 pm to i am dan
quote:
Blizzard isn't to blame for this. The players are.
Incorrect IMO. People ALWAYS go to the path of least resistance. If you give people an easy out, they will almost all take it.
Original WoW had community because the game fundamentally required it. They restructured the game dramatically and made a lot of things that used to be required optional.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 2:53 pm to i am dan
You're wanting something much deeper but the real answer is sharding and phasing. As soon as it no longer mattered what realm you picked to play on and you could be randomly placed in a shard with anyone from any other server, community got nuked. How can you develop a sense of community if you're never wondering around the world with the same people any given day? Nothing more immersion breaking than watching someone freeze running in place in front of you then just phase out into a different shard for no reason.
That coupled with how streamlined and impersonal they've made group-finding in general and you've got a community full of people that doesn't see the need in talking to each other.
In BFA you don't even really have to group up to have access to all of the gear you could need for heroic raiding. A lot of people (at least the people still playing retail) are going to choose a single player campaign if you give them that option.
Saying this isn't Blizzard's fault isn't true. It's a give and take situation.
That coupled with how streamlined and impersonal they've made group-finding in general and you've got a community full of people that doesn't see the need in talking to each other.
In BFA you don't even really have to group up to have access to all of the gear you could need for heroic raiding. A lot of people (at least the people still playing retail) are going to choose a single player campaign if you give them that option.
Saying this isn't Blizzard's fault isn't true. It's a give and take situation.
Posted on 8/28/19 at 2:58 pm to PEPE
quote:
If you give people an easy out, they will almost all take it.
quote:Bingo. The struggles and annoyances of Classic WoW created this "just survive together" mentality.
Original WoW had community because the game fundamentally required it
People are willing to ask for help with quests because chances are if they don't, they either can't do the quest at all or it'll be way more difficult, or people who don't want to fight over tagging mobs so they end up grouping up.
None of that has the ability to happen in retail because it's not facilitated by the game's current design. The world isn't difficult enough to require someone's aid or genuinely appreciate the help of someone else in a "kill x" quest. Starting at level 20, you just round up the whole zone and AoE it down, pretty much regardless of what class you play. The lack of mob sharing encourages group forming on the fly. Things that people consider annoyances were actually catalysts for what made the game so good.
Speaking of, I'm now firmly within the "flying ruined WoW" bandwagon. I was a Wrath baby so I never quite understood the vitriol some players had for flying, but I get it now. The sense of scope is absolutely massive when there's just flight points and running. I really prefer it.
This post was edited on 8/28/19 at 3:03 pm
Posted on 8/28/19 at 3:11 pm to i am dan
quote:
WoW - sense of community gone? Who's to blame?
Seriously?
The tireless grind? Being screamed at because your dps to fluxability ratio dropped from 7.9 to 7.684? Or whatever random number/stat was the most important metric of the week? Getting a loot item in a raid and having players manipulate guild leaders because they were jealous they didn't get the same item for free?
Yeah, social my arse. MMOs got away because the people already got toxic.
Imagine you're on a football team. Everyone is playing their role, but somehow the game is still lost.
Now imagine on that team, the coach barely containing the other players screaming at the left guard because on one play a DL got past him and made a tackle.
That's "the sense of community" in an MMO raid guild.
Good riddance.
Posted on 8/29/19 at 12:55 am to skrayper
quote:
players screaming at the left guard because on one play a DL got past him and made a tackle.
You pulled the whelps, didn’t you?
Posted on 8/29/19 at 3:06 am to Drewbie
quote:
Speaking of, I'm now firmly within the "flying ruined WoW" bandwagon. I was a Wrath baby so I never quite understood the vitriol some players had for flying, but I get it now. The sense of scope is absolutely massive when there's just flight points and running. I really prefer it.
Absolutely correct.
When flying was introduced in TBC it had a minimal negative impact because the community was already well established at that point.
However as time went, flying proved to be a gigantic cancer. Forcing people to run around on the ground forces hem to see others and interact with others.
Every expansion the game got more streamlined so you could play it faster and with less assistance from others.
Posted on 8/29/19 at 4:06 am to PEPE
It just never really seemed to hit me at all because the sheer size of Azeroth alone was already so massive even with flying when I was new that I couldn't possibly imagine traversing a world that large without that ability. While I will say I think when flying is actually a focal point of the design choices made when constructing zones (Northrend) it can be absolutely jaw-dropping, it's just not worth losing that respect for distance and travel within the world itself.
Posted on 8/29/19 at 8:14 am to i am dan
Back in the late 2000s, Teamspeak became huge for the Runescape clan I was in (180+ people at one point). We still talked very regularly in chat, but it was in IRC, not the game chat.
IRC + Video Chat killed in-game communication, IMO. That was 12 years ago. Discord has all of that in 1, so it doesn't shock me that there is little in game chat for these games.
IRC + Video Chat killed in-game communication, IMO. That was 12 years ago. Discord has all of that in 1, so it doesn't shock me that there is little in game chat for these games.
Posted on 8/30/19 at 1:28 pm to PEPE
quote:
Incorrect IMO. People ALWAYS go to the path of least resistance. If you give people an easy out, they will almost all take it. Original WoW had community because the game fundamentally required it. They restructured the game dramatically and made a lot of things that used to be required optional.
I agree somewhat, but if the community wants to be more social, then they should be.
I also agree that the phasing is the worst thing to happen to the game.
There can be a discuss on long term and short term "socialness".
If you're doing an instance (especially a raid), throw out a discord channel. Talk and have a good time.
One of the guys in my guild leaves in mic on the whole time. DO NOT DO THIS. Use push to talk, people. Hate hearing him smash his keys nonstop and listening to his weird breathing.. that's fricked up.
This post was edited on 8/30/19 at 1:29 pm
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