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FF16 Theory Work/Known facts:Long3 post with pics What We Know, Map, Combat likely decider
Posted on 2/2/23 at 2:17 pm
Posted on 2/2/23 at 2:17 pm
Things we know
Just from the jump combat is discussed post 3, it will be what is your deciding factor. An insane breakdown is given and it gives of FromSouls precise moves to me with 8 face buttons shifted by trigger
- This is SE tag line for the entire game. I do believe its a double entendre but this is the know section.
- The game will largely be about something called the war of the Eikons
- We have currently seen and confirmed they will be Ifrit, Shiva, Phoenix, Garuda, Odin, Bahaumat, Titan, Ramuh
- We know who the kingdoms each rely on a crystal for ether with two sharing one which is what is all likely to kick off the assassination's of the duke of Rosaria two of our three main trio the Father and Ward keeper of Joshua, Clive, and Jennifer
- We know this is an inside man, and we know this is the first time Clive brings forth Ifrit it is unknown but could be likely said Joshua dies at least for now
- Jill is taken and captured by another warring factions fighting Titans eikons country forced to fight against her will, this is the huge Shiva Titan youve seen a ton
- Eventually our main party will consist of Clive (Ifrit and only main controllable, Cid who is Rama, Jill who is Shiva, and the cute doggie.
- We know the Holy Brick of Simpire began this war on Rosaria and their crown prince is Eikon of Bahaumat
- Barnabas Tharmr - The Dominant of Odin from the eastern continent of Walid along with Garudas dominant. Barnabas Tharmr arrived on the shores of Ash as a wanderer - with not land or title of his own. It was his skill with a blade that won him a kingdom.
- We know the game will have not one but two time skips Clive as a 14/15, Mid to late 20s. and 30 something.
- We can say with 95% certainty the death of the duke happens swiftly possibly killing Joshua (who is the phoenix big hints) and spreading the other siblings Jill and Clive far and wide
Some Speculation
- First it has been noticed quite often there are 2 versions of each Eikon one with red and blue fire? What could it be?
- We known Clive can fight other dominants in sort of demi human form and also Use powers gifted to him via eikons think a skill tree with unlimited amount of wipes and re allocation to allow experimentation
- So, this leads me to believe the Story will more or less be this; Clive will go about trying to gather the Eikons as it were to take revenge on an entity so powerful it could be a god of this world or something "bigger" which also means he'd likely go so far in his revenge he would just destroy all of it. I think SE wants to leave the "Crystal" concept behind here so we may get two endings one where we achieve the goal and just wipe it all away, and two we are put down by our former allies and brother and sister. I mean the trailer ends with what seems blue meteors falling down with Clive saying it all dies today
So talk about whatever? Ask anything. I will post some pics below that are SWEET get some cool gameplay stills and shots of the main 4 party
Revenge Trailer basically putting all that into 2 min of footage
Our main for from behind approaching something? Most likely one of the crystal
Imo this is 30s Clive and he has been touched up big time
Very likely Clive first becoming IFrit
Our main party minus Rama guy so Clive dogga and Jill likely looking out over the Northern Fallen Territories where Jill is born but how she became a Ward to their dad
Jill very likely fighting under some duress or mind control
Odin fighting the king of fricking dragons
This is super interesting. It shows a close up of Clive 1v1 wirh an enemy named Sleepnir. We can see he has three eikons very very akin to Ghost of Tshushima stances but each change moveset. Here he has Titan, Garadua, idk the red one. The blue bars below health im assuming is this version of ATB
Here we have Clive doing an AEO in Garuda mode i think Rama and idk who else is on his 3 plate. It gives you an idea of how numbers and enemies on field will be.
Okay here it shows your ally Ramas dominant off screen doing lightning storm. You can see Rama is equipped Shiva and st a loss for 3.
Clive as Ifrit vs Garuda and yes we will be playing all these out
Will reserve the second post for some map related shite thatll take a while, if it gets any headway sticky if ya want. Talk about your excitements, worries, theories, etc.
Just from the jump combat is discussed post 3, it will be what is your deciding factor. An insane breakdown is given and it gives of FromSouls precise moves to me with 8 face buttons shifted by trigger
quote:
THE LEGACY OF THE CRYSTALS HAS SHAPED OUR HISTORY FOR LONG ENOUGH
- This is SE tag line for the entire game. I do believe its a double entendre but this is the know section.
- The game will largely be about something called the war of the Eikons
- We have currently seen and confirmed they will be Ifrit, Shiva, Phoenix, Garuda, Odin, Bahaumat, Titan, Ramuh
- We know who the kingdoms each rely on a crystal for ether with two sharing one which is what is all likely to kick off the assassination's of the duke of Rosaria two of our three main trio the Father and Ward keeper of Joshua, Clive, and Jennifer
- We know this is an inside man, and we know this is the first time Clive brings forth Ifrit it is unknown but could be likely said Joshua dies at least for now
- Jill is taken and captured by another warring factions fighting Titans eikons country forced to fight against her will, this is the huge Shiva Titan youve seen a ton
- Eventually our main party will consist of Clive (Ifrit and only main controllable, Cid who is Rama, Jill who is Shiva, and the cute doggie.
- We know the Holy Brick of Simpire began this war on Rosaria and their crown prince is Eikon of Bahaumat

- Barnabas Tharmr - The Dominant of Odin from the eastern continent of Walid along with Garudas dominant. Barnabas Tharmr arrived on the shores of Ash as a wanderer - with not land or title of his own. It was his skill with a blade that won him a kingdom.


- We know the game will have not one but two time skips Clive as a 14/15, Mid to late 20s. and 30 something.
- We can say with 95% certainty the death of the duke happens swiftly possibly killing Joshua (who is the phoenix big hints) and spreading the other siblings Jill and Clive far and wide
Some Speculation
- First it has been noticed quite often there are 2 versions of each Eikon one with red and blue fire? What could it be?
- We known Clive can fight other dominants in sort of demi human form and also Use powers gifted to him via eikons think a skill tree with unlimited amount of wipes and re allocation to allow experimentation
- So, this leads me to believe the Story will more or less be this; Clive will go about trying to gather the Eikons as it were to take revenge on an entity so powerful it could be a god of this world or something "bigger" which also means he'd likely go so far in his revenge he would just destroy all of it. I think SE wants to leave the "Crystal" concept behind here so we may get two endings one where we achieve the goal and just wipe it all away, and two we are put down by our former allies and brother and sister. I mean the trailer ends with what seems blue meteors falling down with Clive saying it all dies today
So talk about whatever? Ask anything. I will post some pics below that are SWEET get some cool gameplay stills and shots of the main 4 party
Revenge Trailer basically putting all that into 2 min of footage

Our main for from behind approaching something? Most likely one of the crystal

Imo this is 30s Clive and he has been touched up big time

Very likely Clive first becoming IFrit

Our main party minus Rama guy so Clive dogga and Jill likely looking out over the Northern Fallen Territories where Jill is born but how she became a Ward to their dad

Jill very likely fighting under some duress or mind control

Odin fighting the king of fricking dragons

This is super interesting. It shows a close up of Clive 1v1 wirh an enemy named Sleepnir. We can see he has three eikons very very akin to Ghost of Tshushima stances but each change moveset. Here he has Titan, Garadua, idk the red one. The blue bars below health im assuming is this version of ATB

Here we have Clive doing an AEO in Garuda mode i think Rama and idk who else is on his 3 plate. It gives you an idea of how numbers and enemies on field will be.

Okay here it shows your ally Ramas dominant off screen doing lightning storm. You can see Rama is equipped Shiva and st a loss for 3.

Clive as Ifrit vs Garuda and yes we will be playing all these out
Will reserve the second post for some map related shite thatll take a while, if it gets any headway sticky if ya want. Talk about your excitements, worries, theories, etc.
This post was edited on 2/2/23 at 3:49 pm
Posted on 2/2/23 at 2:19 pm to td01241
Map
Below ill allay an empty map then the same with each realm set on it with info.
That is SE official but this one is best I think for orientation

quote:
As you can see, the world of Valisthea is split into two main landmasses with a smaller set of islands on the lower western side, with 5 major landmarks sprinkled throughout.
The map also features smaller landmarks across the world and boat paths, as all three main areas of land are split apart by sea. It would seem you'll be getting around by boat or airship, though you'll also likely be utilizing Chocobos quite a bit when you're on land.
Below ill allay an empty map then the same with each realm set on it with info.


That is SE official but this one is best I think for orientation

This post was edited on 2/2/23 at 2:31 pm
Posted on 2/2/23 at 2:20 pm to td01241
Combat
So we know Torgal is our loyal always around wolf pal and this gamaes Cid is our ally Ramas dominant
web page at bottom
They go so fricking deep down into the mechanics of each and every eikon and skill set and moves and more ill post a bit then the web page.
Phoenix
Odin
Elemental Cast: Dark
Eikon Ability: Arm of Darkness
Eikon Skill: Heaven’s Cloud
Eikon Skill: Gungnir
They do one of those for Titan Shiva and Garuda too then opine on who else is gonna make an appearance.
Eikon summons could have three forms
Seriously it goes on give it view
LINK
quote:
This includes information about how players can enhance Clive’s abilities, the companions players will meet throughout the game, and how the special “Summon” actions will function. [Thanks, Famitsu!]
As a Dominant, Clive will be able to channel various abilities attributed to specific summons, called Eikons in the game. Players will be able to switch between each of these “Summons” in real time and make use of their specific abilities and attacks on the fly. Players will also be fighting these iconic Final Fantasy summons in game as well, through large scale battles. More information on this will appear sometime in the future.
Alongside general combat details, Square Enix further extrapolated on the “Story” and more “Action” focused modes players can choose from in Final Fantasy XVI. The story mode will also allow for summon augmented attacks to be executed with ease, and and to automatically avoid attacks with some of these accessories. Additionally, players will be able to level up various abilities associated with Clive’s weapons and the abilities associated with the various Dominants.
Torgal, Clive’s wolf-dog, will function as a companion throughout the game. Players can instruct Torgal to attack, and to even engage enemies together. Additionally, Clive will be joined by other characters which will function as AI controlled companions. This includes Cid and Jill.
So we know Torgal is our loyal always around wolf pal and this gamaes Cid is our ally Ramas dominant
web page at bottom
quote:
he third-person action of Final Fantasy XVI is real-time and reactive to your input, most similar to Devil May Cry. This is telegraphed in the trailer by the use of Clive’s numerous different attacks while only having a singular attack button. These attacks could change based on your directional input, as well as whether you are on the ground, aerial, tapping the button or holding it.
Enemies and bosses alike also have an additional staggered state that you can build up with attacks. After you stagger them, enemies can go into a crumpled state where you can exploit them into a highly-damaging combo.
![]()
[quote]Eikons can be likened to a skill loadout that you will be able to actively switch between mid-combat. If you possess more than one Eikon, you can switch them with L2. Eikons give you a different set of four skills that you can use that possess some kind of elemental potency. Having Phoenix equipped gives you access to a default elemental cast, such as Fire, in addition to having two unique moves.
These are specific moves that can be used when using a modifier button such as R2, then pressing triangle or square. These moves can be used on a cooldown, as we see them grey out after usage. The way these controls are mapped makes this quite similar to how Dragon's Dogma is controlled - and these games of course share a lead combat designer.
Eikon Skills and their elemental casts could be used to enhance damage on certain enemy types, and could also affect their stagger gauge. This is marked on the HUD with a color of damage in addition to a multiplier that appears after your attack.
Finally, each Eikon will also give you access to a unique skill that can be used with the circle button. This is likely to spend a portion of the yellow meter that you see underneath your health bar and can be built up by attacking enemies. Garuda’s Deadly Embrace will pull the enemy toward you, or could even trigger a toppled state, as we saw when Clive used it to topple a Coeurl, which allowed him to chain into a flurry of additional attacks on the helpless enemy.

They go so fricking deep down into the mechanics of each and every eikon and skill set and moves and more ill post a bit then the web page.
quote:
By examining the trailer closely and carefully frame-by-frame analysing the user interface, we can transcribe move names and pull out the move sets of several of these beasts, seeing how they augment Clive's fighting style.
Phoenix

quote:
Elemental Cast: Fire
Eikon Ability: Phoenix Shift
Eikon Skill: Scarlet Cyclone
Eikon Skill: Rising Flames
Phoenix appears to be the default Eikon that you’ll kick off with in Final Fantasy XVI, as we see Clive accessing Phoenix’s skills without the multi-Eikon symbol in the top-left corner of the screen. This gives him access to Rising Flames, a launcher attack that uppercuts your enemies into the air. This can be followed up with Scarlet Cyclone, an aerial barrage of attacks. We have not yet seen exactly what Phoenix Shift does, but judging by the name, it could be some form of dodge or parry.
Odin

Elemental Cast: Dark
Eikon Ability: Arm of Darkness
Eikon Skill: Heaven’s Cloud
Eikon Skill: Gungnir
quote:
We see Clive use Gungnir in the latest trailer, which is a ground-based flurry of attacks. Heaven’s Cloud could also potentially be an aerial area-of-effect attack or launcher based on the icon, but we’ve yet to see it in action. This is the same for Arm of Darkness, which could potentially be a form of command grab or high-stagger skill.
They do one of those for Titan Shiva and Garuda too then opine on who else is gonna make an appearance.
quote:
We’ve yet to see Eikons such as Bahamut or Ifrit playable in-game, and there are potentially more of them that we have yet to see, further widening the numerous skills and playstyles that you will be able to utilise. If we're following the traditionally present elements in Final Fantasy, notably missing are the Water and Holy-type Eikons.
Leviathan seems like the obvious, slightly boring choice for a Water element Eikon, but we could also see Bismark or Famfrit make a return if they really want to get into the weeds with it. The Holy or Light-based Eikon could also potentially be Ultima, Alexander, or Madeen. The Ivalice summons like Famfrit or Madeen could be an incredibly unique appearance from Summons that we have never seen in a mainline Final Fantasy title.
Eikon summons could have three forms

quote:
As we see Clive use Odin’s skills, we see a gauge build up to the left of the screen. It is possible that when the gauge fills, you are able to summon the Eikon who will do an attack for a healthy dose of extra damage. The team could be developing the system and gauge in a similar way to the way that ranks are built up in Devil May Cry V.
Since there are so many similarities to Devil May Cry, it could also be a form-change, where Clive could partially transform into that Eikon in a similar way to how the Devil Trigger works. We actually see this in the trailer as Hugo Kopka faces off against Clive in a partially Titan-like form.
On this topic, also look to the key artwork of Clive - where he has one arm partially ablaze and covered in spiky appendages. Could this be a hint of the power of Ifrit within him, something the Dominance trailer's stinger also appears to wink towards?

Seriously it goes on give it view
LINK
This post was edited on 2/2/23 at 3:41 pm
Posted on 2/2/23 at 2:47 pm to td01241
quote:
white guy who is Rama
That’s Cid
Posted on 2/2/23 at 2:49 pm to JakeFromStateFarm
Yup got to him and Torgal in third post on Combat, bear with this is a massive undertake and am editing on fly
Incidental info not fit for the main three post
Ill keep a going run here from me and other posters
-Using the power of the Eikon does drain your life turning you into stone. How, how much, when, no more is known.
- Iron Kingdom kills eikons when found, it is almost certainly they who have subjugated Jill to battle the Crusaders and Titan
- I think Alexander (His counter maybe Ultima from the IValice mythos) and Levitation are 100% going in. I think the red dog in some of the stills is Fenrir. I expect to see Ixion to counter Rama but could be Queztulcult, idk as Shivas counter maybe Levitation, Ifrit and Phoenix, Garuda and Valefor?, Odin and Diablos, etc
- The one thing I’m holding out for is basic sword combo modifiers. I’m 90% we’ll get them, because DMC and DD (and even VIIR to some extent) both had them, but if XVI is going to be operating on an “attack to fill gauge -> gauge to use skills” system, those basic attacks need to be more than just Tales of Arise-esque mashing attack with no variation.
If Clive can juggle, combo, stinger, etc. just with his sword, then I’m 100% in.
- Preorder access only content is limited to a sword and cait sith accessory that just give slight bumps to xp and gold when used. I like not locking 1 bit of any part of the game out of anyone.
- Why are the 4 ATB segments below health blue some and yellow some, imo yellow is full or this version of limit and your AI ally does their eikon attack say Heavenly Strike or Lightning Bolts, or powers you up?
- There is always some lesser second big bad think Seymour to Jecht and Yevon in FF10. Just a shot at the dark but the hooded man Clive sees could be that guy and what brings "the mysterious blight" which seems to be what drives war
Incidental info not fit for the main three post
Ill keep a going run here from me and other posters
-Using the power of the Eikon does drain your life turning you into stone. How, how much, when, no more is known.
- Iron Kingdom kills eikons when found, it is almost certainly they who have subjugated Jill to battle the Crusaders and Titan
- I think Alexander (His counter maybe Ultima from the IValice mythos) and Levitation are 100% going in. I think the red dog in some of the stills is Fenrir. I expect to see Ixion to counter Rama but could be Queztulcult, idk as Shivas counter maybe Levitation, Ifrit and Phoenix, Garuda and Valefor?, Odin and Diablos, etc
- The one thing I’m holding out for is basic sword combo modifiers. I’m 90% we’ll get them, because DMC and DD (and even VIIR to some extent) both had them, but if XVI is going to be operating on an “attack to fill gauge -> gauge to use skills” system, those basic attacks need to be more than just Tales of Arise-esque mashing attack with no variation.
If Clive can juggle, combo, stinger, etc. just with his sword, then I’m 100% in.
- Preorder access only content is limited to a sword and cait sith accessory that just give slight bumps to xp and gold when used. I like not locking 1 bit of any part of the game out of anyone.
- Why are the 4 ATB segments below health blue some and yellow some, imo yellow is full or this version of limit and your AI ally does their eikon attack say Heavenly Strike or Lightning Bolts, or powers you up?
- There is always some lesser second big bad think Seymour to Jecht and Yevon in FF10. Just a shot at the dark but the hooded man Clive sees could be that guy and what brings "the mysterious blight" which seems to be what drives war
This post was edited on 2/2/23 at 3:44 pm
Posted on 2/2/23 at 3:54 pm to JakeFromStateFarm
Combat Pt 2 over 7900 characters
If anyone is thrown off by the switch to solo DMC Dragon Dogma style this is a 6-7 min vid laying out how story mode is likely to be a olive branch to the turn based people. It has more info on Cid and others as well, so maybe it isnt a deal breaker.
Youtube
If anyone is thrown off by the switch to solo DMC Dragon Dogma style this is a 6-7 min vid laying out how story mode is likely to be a olive branch to the turn based people. It has more info on Cid and others as well, so maybe it isnt a deal breaker.
Youtube
Posted on 2/3/23 at 8:05 am to td01241
Godamn June can’t get here soon enough
Posted on 2/3/23 at 8:12 am to cfish140
This thread was a serious amount of work and its a pretty major upcoming title and very serious contender for GoTY and the make of break for maybe SE and the FF franchise. Can i get some feedback on if anyone found it worth it, enlightning, interesting, etc so I will keep update things as we get them along this style.
Posted on 2/3/23 at 12:12 pm to td01241
My body is ready.
If you are a fan of final fantasy and know anything about Yoshi P and what the man has done for Square…
You have to be excited for this.
He and his team working on a main numbered title is all I needed to hear and I was sold.
I actually didn’t read the long post because I know I’m in good hands and I want to remain as blind to it all as possible. Had this been another team or director I’d be digging through all the weeds.
Im just comfy and waiting.
If you are a fan of final fantasy and know anything about Yoshi P and what the man has done for Square…
You have to be excited for this.
He and his team working on a main numbered title is all I needed to hear and I was sold.
I actually didn’t read the long post because I know I’m in good hands and I want to remain as blind to it all as possible. Had this been another team or director I’d be digging through all the weeds.
Im just comfy and waiting.
This post was edited on 2/3/23 at 12:13 pm
Posted on 2/3/23 at 12:25 pm to Blitzed
Should at least check out the visuals I include for every point lol. Especially in post 3that concerns combat and we can learn a lot none is spoilers is shite though.
If enough people have want as info drips to release I’ll continue to update ITT in the same style. And fans can use it for theory crafting
Also it must be said at least 50% or more is still pure speculation right now
If enough people have want as info drips to release I’ll continue to update ITT in the same style. And fans can use it for theory crafting
Also it must be said at least 50% or more is still pure speculation right now
This post was edited on 2/3/23 at 12:29 pm
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