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Message

Statues, protest and Southerners---
Posted on 6/25/20 at 8:13 pm
Posted on 6/25/20 at 8:13 pm
White Southerner people today and white southerners in 1860 were not bad people.
Slavey had existed throughout human history and one's morals were not defined so much by feelings toward slavery prior to 1860.
Take down all the Confederate statues if you want--if you have standing to take them down. Change the flags. Rename the streets and buildings and towns if you like. It doesn't change history.
The facts forgotten are that these symbols were created by a defeated people. A race of people. (A race is a grouping of humans based on shared physical or social qualities into categories generally viewed as distinct by society. The term was first used to refer to speakers of a common language and then to denote national affiliations.)
This race of people created a nation of 9 million people--only 5.5 million free, the rest slaves. Of those 5.5 million, approximately 500,000 were casualties of the war they started to separate themselves from the USA. (some say only 350,000 but others say more than 500,000). You read that right----about one in every 10 white people living in the South or all ages were casualties in that war. In no other war has a North American race suffered that many loses. None. Imagine that--if half the 5.5 million were women then over 25% of the men of all ages were casualties. There were only 326,000 slave holders of all races (one the largest slave owners in Louisiana was a "free man of color").
It was a very rare family in the South that did not give up a man in that war.
After the war the men that survived the war could not vote for a time. The women couldn't vote either. They lived first under military rule. The free slaves were mostly uneducated and had never earned a living on their own but they with their carpetbagger backers ran the South. (Watch the first academy award winning film "Birth of a Nation" filmed in 1915 when the war and reconstruction was still fresh in the minds of the country. Woodrow Wilson had it shown in the White House.) The wealth of the region was completely gone. The currency worthless the Southern banking system collapsed. Crops were destroyed. It was a horrible time for all races in the South.
From that poverty, slowly the South started to rebuild. As they rebuilt and the economy began to grow it was natural they built monuments to the cause they lost. They gave their sons and fathers to the cause whether it was right or wrong. I can't find the facts but I suspect most of the monuments were financed by Confederate veterans groups and groups formed by their families and heirs. It was from mourning and pride these statues were erected---not hate. Sure politicians seeking favor in the South named forts and towns after Confederates seeking votes but that can't be called hate.
Slavery was a horrible institution that I wish had never existed in America but it doesn't change the fact that it existed and that good people supported it. I suspect most of them really did not believe blacks were capable of free lives. Certainly no one visiting Africa at the time could come away thinking that. It was black African chiefs and kings that facilitated the travesty.
So forgive my long post but I hope readers prone to do so will please quit bashing our Southern ancestors with your modern day morals.
It was wrong and the concept of the CSA was wrong but good people at time felt otherwise.
Racism, unfortunately, will be with us forever. Cultural differences will assure that. We aren't going to change it fighting over statues. Cultures that tolerate violence and lawlessness among their community will always face ridicule from those that think society should be more civil and property should be respected.
I long for the day people quit insisting on defining themselves by color of their skin. No one should experience discrimination or expect special treatment based on their skin color.
Slavey had existed throughout human history and one's morals were not defined so much by feelings toward slavery prior to 1860.
Take down all the Confederate statues if you want--if you have standing to take them down. Change the flags. Rename the streets and buildings and towns if you like. It doesn't change history.
The facts forgotten are that these symbols were created by a defeated people. A race of people. (A race is a grouping of humans based on shared physical or social qualities into categories generally viewed as distinct by society. The term was first used to refer to speakers of a common language and then to denote national affiliations.)
This race of people created a nation of 9 million people--only 5.5 million free, the rest slaves. Of those 5.5 million, approximately 500,000 were casualties of the war they started to separate themselves from the USA. (some say only 350,000 but others say more than 500,000). You read that right----about one in every 10 white people living in the South or all ages were casualties in that war. In no other war has a North American race suffered that many loses. None. Imagine that--if half the 5.5 million were women then over 25% of the men of all ages were casualties. There were only 326,000 slave holders of all races (one the largest slave owners in Louisiana was a "free man of color").
It was a very rare family in the South that did not give up a man in that war.
After the war the men that survived the war could not vote for a time. The women couldn't vote either. They lived first under military rule. The free slaves were mostly uneducated and had never earned a living on their own but they with their carpetbagger backers ran the South. (Watch the first academy award winning film "Birth of a Nation" filmed in 1915 when the war and reconstruction was still fresh in the minds of the country. Woodrow Wilson had it shown in the White House.) The wealth of the region was completely gone. The currency worthless the Southern banking system collapsed. Crops were destroyed. It was a horrible time for all races in the South.
From that poverty, slowly the South started to rebuild. As they rebuilt and the economy began to grow it was natural they built monuments to the cause they lost. They gave their sons and fathers to the cause whether it was right or wrong. I can't find the facts but I suspect most of the monuments were financed by Confederate veterans groups and groups formed by their families and heirs. It was from mourning and pride these statues were erected---not hate. Sure politicians seeking favor in the South named forts and towns after Confederates seeking votes but that can't be called hate.
Slavery was a horrible institution that I wish had never existed in America but it doesn't change the fact that it existed and that good people supported it. I suspect most of them really did not believe blacks were capable of free lives. Certainly no one visiting Africa at the time could come away thinking that. It was black African chiefs and kings that facilitated the travesty.
So forgive my long post but I hope readers prone to do so will please quit bashing our Southern ancestors with your modern day morals.
It was wrong and the concept of the CSA was wrong but good people at time felt otherwise.
Racism, unfortunately, will be with us forever. Cultural differences will assure that. We aren't going to change it fighting over statues. Cultures that tolerate violence and lawlessness among their community will always face ridicule from those that think society should be more civil and property should be respected.
I long for the day people quit insisting on defining themselves by color of their skin. No one should experience discrimination or expect special treatment based on their skin color.
This post was edited on 6/25/20 at 8:18 pm
Posted on 6/25/20 at 8:18 pm to dowahdiddy
quote:
I long for the day people quit insisting on defining themselves by color of their skin. No one should experience discrimination or expect special treatment based on their skin color.
This is closer to being true here than almost anywhere else on earth.
Posted on 6/25/20 at 8:23 pm to dowahdiddy
quote:
Take down all the Confederate statues if you want--if you have standing to take them down. Change the flags. Rename the streets and buildings and towns if you like. It doesn't change history.
If you built all the Confederate statues you wanted, it wouldn’t change history either. Those people fought and died trying to harm the country you currently pledge allegiance to.
Posted on 6/25/20 at 8:28 pm to Steadmans Cheddar
quote:
If you built all the Confederate statues you wanted, it wouldn’t change history either. Those people fought and died trying to harm the country you currently pledge allegiance to.
When, in the course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume, among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the laws of nature and of nature’s God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
Posted on 6/25/20 at 8:49 pm to Steadmans Cheddar
Many will tell you that it was the Civil War that was the beginning of the "United" states. Prior to that their were few examples of united actions and federalism was just a dream.
It changed the entire country---not just the South. The idea the Confederates fought the country I proudly pay allegiance to is simply not true.
I don't care if all the monuments come down.
It changed the entire country---not just the South. The idea the Confederates fought the country I proudly pay allegiance to is simply not true.
I don't care if all the monuments come down.
This post was edited on 6/25/20 at 8:51 pm
Posted on 6/25/20 at 8:50 pm to dowahdiddy
Most white southerners were sharecroppers back then, they didn't hold much more social standing than a slave.
Posted on 6/25/20 at 8:52 pm to Tunasntigers92
My grandfather was a share cropper and rose to buy his own farm.
Posted on 6/25/20 at 8:53 pm to dowahdiddy
TL:DR
I will never apologize for the South, they were right, and people who cuck over it are pathetic.
I will never apologize for the South, they were right, and people who cuck over it are pathetic.
Posted on 6/25/20 at 9:01 pm to Tunasntigers92
The first step toward the Civil War was the tariffs of 1828. It was sold as a means to make the industrial North and agricultural South trade with each other rather than with Europe. However, the North didn't need much of the South's agricultural products. The result was a decade long depression in the South that affected everyone but an economic boom in the North.
Animosity in the South became deep. Lust for the tariff generated economic boom in the North became a political addiction.
It didn't go unnoticed that 5 out of 6 dollars raised on tariffs which were the main source of the federal budget went to Northern improvements.
Animosity in the South became deep. Lust for the tariff generated economic boom in the North became a political addiction.
It didn't go unnoticed that 5 out of 6 dollars raised on tariffs which were the main source of the federal budget went to Northern improvements.
Posted on 6/25/20 at 9:29 pm to dowahdiddy
Lotta newbies in this thread...
Posted on 6/25/20 at 10:14 pm to Tunasntigers92
quote:
Most white southerners were sharecroppers back then, they didn't hold much more social standing than a slave.
This is nonsense. Sharecropping was a curse laid on the formerly free men of the South by the wretched Union. Reconstruction was the crime that proved the wickedness of the Northern elites. Such a bold misunderstanding of the South is common in the reconstructed mind.
The lesson of reconstruction is this:
1. Don't lose a war. Never ever lose a war, no matter what. If you can't win it, go around it.
2. There is never a full reconciliation between the winner and the loser. You either win or lose, and the winners never stop winning until then losers stop losing.
The South spent decades being utterly humiliated in their defeat. Then, they begged for mercy, to be allowed back in the Union, only the be bypassed completely by the economic boom that happened everywhere else.
It wasn't until the Union realized they had a weak immigrant population that couldn't sustain the global war fighting required of it, that the Union tossed the South a bone in exchange for doing all the hard fighting in the wars. To this day, the Southerners are the biggest war fighting asset for a Union that would piss on them before acknowledging them as equals.
Watching 2020 unfold is seeing the fruits of the Civil War fully matured.
Posted on 6/25/20 at 10:20 pm to Steadmans Cheddar
quote:
Those people fought and died trying to harm the country you currently pledge allegiance to.
The Founding Fathers would have overwhelmingly sided with the Confederates. The idea that states were bound to the Union perpetually goes against the foundational principles of the Republic. The Confederates were the heirs of the American Revolution, not the Union.
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