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re: LOTR: Return of the King ending...

Posted on 1/27/19 at 12:26 pm to
Posted by Scoob
Near Exxon
Member since Jun 2009
20561 posts
Posted on 1/27/19 at 12:26 pm to
quote:

I’ve come to the conclusion that Bombadil was an Ainur, the same class of being as were the Valar and Morgoth, and thus a literal god on earth in terms of power. The Silmarillion tells us that there were many more Ainur than just those that took an interest in Arda after its creation and came down to become the Valar, and Bombadil must have been one of those. Obviously he had interest in Arda, since he made his home there, but apparently he didn’t have any interest in its creation or governance (which is in line with the character as we know him). This would explain why he called himself “Eldest.” He was part of the song of creation.

Sauron, for all his might, was only an extremely powerful Maia, and thus Bombadil would be far more powerful than he, which is demonstrated when Bombadil puts on the Ring and it has absolutely no effect on him.
Tolkien himself was very evasive on Bombadil, and in his letters he always seemed to avoid defining him. He did seem to shoot theories down, but wouldn't then provide an alternate. I think he wanted to create an intentionally undefined presence.

In-book (and onscreen), Gandalf makes the comments that this whole crisis is fleeting, as terrible as it seems. There are also multiple statements that Gollum, Bilbo and Frodo were "meant" to find the Ring, and that is a comforting thought. That suggests there is far more out there than we are shown, Powers greater than Sauron at work, that even the Wise do not perceive in detail. I always took that as the Valar at work, but it could possibly include Bombadil too... as a Vala, or outside their scope.

Tulkas, the last Vala to enter Arda, who wrestled and defeated Morgoth in combat- he was also said to be merry and full of laughter. But he wasn't "first" or "eldest", and I can't remember if he came before Morgoth made the night full of terror.
quote:

It is told among the wise that the First War began before Arda was full-shaped, and ere yet there was any thing that grew or walked upon earth; and for long Melkor had the upper hand. But in the midst of the war a spirit of great strength and hardihood came to the aid of the Valar, hearing in the far heaven that there was battle in the Little Kingdom; and Arda was filled with the sound of his laughter. So came Tulkas the Strong, whose anger passes like a mighty wind, scattering cloud and darkness before it; and Melkor fled before his wrath and his laughter, and forsook Arda, and there was peace for a long age. And Tulkas remained and became one of the Valar of the Kingdom of Arda; but Melkor brooded in the outer darkness, and his hate was given to Tulkas for ever after.

Hmm, so Tulkas WAS the last Vala to enter, but it does seem he came in prior to any life present. And since Morgoth fled to the outer darkness, you COULD say he remembered the Night before Morgoth came (back).

His description
quote:

Greatest in strength and deeds of prowess is Tulkas, who is surnamed Astaldo, the Valiant. He came last to Arda, to aid the Valar in the first battles with Melkor. He delights in wrestling and in contests of strength; and he rides no steed, for he can outrun all things that go on feet, and he is tireless. His hair and beard are golden, and his flesh ruddy; his weapons are his hands. He has little heed for either the past or the future, and is of no avail as a counsellor, but is a hardy friend.

So, Tulkas is seen as ruddy with a beard, has mastery in combat (as a Vala, that goes beyond the physical), he seems associated with laughter. As an Ainur, singing would be far more than just making noise, it's the means of Power deployment.
Bombadil sings and laughs, apparently never loses, runs around through rain without getting a drop on him.

You could easily make that connection too. And both his overall demeanor (no avail as a counsellor), and the Valar's commitment to not interfere with Middle Earth directly anymore, those fit why you can't ask him to join the Fellowship. He would keep others safe from the Wild, but he can't/won't engage Sauron directly, as his full manifestation would cause too much collateral damage... and it's no longer the place for the Valar to interfere.
Posted by Scoob
Near Exxon
Member since Jun 2009
20561 posts
Posted on 1/27/19 at 12:50 pm to
Some will say Bombadil =/= Tulkas, citing the following information:

Tom says he remembered the night before the Dark Lord came, before there was fear of the dark.
Tulkas was the last Vala to enter Arda, and changed the balance (Morgoth was winning prior to his entry).

But... referring to the first wars: that was before Arda was complete, and there was zero life on it as of yet.
Semantics maybe (but Tolkien WAS an English professor, and LOVED semantics ), but there was no Middle Earth until AFTER Tulkas entered. There was no night as such, no stars in the sky, etc. Everything was still primordial. They drove Morgoth out, and then completed Arda.
And the Valar were then the first sentience that was present within it (Tulkas included). He WAS there already when Yavanna started putting plants on it, and was there before the Trees began to light up the world.
So, he would still fit.
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