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Started By
Message
re: Sorry Bernie Bros But Nordic Countries Are Not Socialist
Posted on 7/31/18 at 9:45 am to Antonio Moss
Posted on 7/31/18 at 9:45 am to Antonio Moss
quote:
On what are you judging this?
Because the US has better survival rates for basically every major killer of human beings: Cancer, infectious disease, traumatic injury, etc. and was rated higher than Canada in healthcare responsiveness, which is defined as the desired outcome of the treatment.
0
Posted on 7/31/18 at 9:59 am to Ebbandflow
quote:
I don't understand what you're not getting about this. I'm talking about eliminating insurance companies. We're just removing profit from the equation.
I dont think you understand what the core concept of what insurance actually is.
Its a bet. A gamble. The insurance company is betting you dont get sick, get in a car accident, die, house burn down, etc. Youre betting you do. The market sets the betting line. How accurate that line is depends on how free the market is. Its only skewed when gov't throws its power around or people engage in Tulip Mania(got to have a pill for everything and dont price shop medical services, I get the weirdest looks when I ask how much a medical procedure will cost and no one seems to ever know).
No one is forcing you to have health insurance(except Fuhrer Obama), no one is stopping you from paying cash for your health services if you want. You dont have to walk into the casino.
This post was edited on 7/31/18 at 10:02 am
Posted on 7/31/18 at 10:04 am to RedStickBR
quote:
The point that should jump out and slap leftists in the face when they read that article is this one: quote: It was not the government benefits that created wealth, but wealth that allowed the luxury of such generous government programs [in the first place].
Yep. Socialism can't begin unless there is first some wealth to confiscate.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 10:05 am to Ebbandflow
quote:
attack pharma and medical device companies
quote:
Them only.
FIFY
Posted on 7/31/18 at 10:09 am to Ebbandflow
quote:
don't think People's Health is something other people should be able to monetize in such a way.
Just wondering.
Can you tell me where the vast majority of medical improvements, innovation, new meds, new devices etc come from?
Do they come from countries that have socialized medicine? Or do they come from countries where companies make a profit off of these new inventions and drugs?
Posted on 7/31/18 at 10:16 am to Revelator
They all have single payer healthcare, paid family leave and longer paid vacation periods.
Advanced education is free or much cheaper than in the USA.
They also work harder at having clean air and water.
Advanced education is free or much cheaper than in the USA.
They also work harder at having clean air and water.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 10:19 am to BigAppleBucky
quote:
They all have single payer healthcare, paid family leave and longer paid vacation periods.
Advanced education is free or much cheaper than in the USA.
They also work harder at having clean air and water.
They also tax the hell out of the middle class and are expensive places to live
This post was edited on 7/31/18 at 10:20 am
Posted on 7/31/18 at 10:29 am to bmy
quote:
Get dunked on
you didn't italicize or underline anything that even gets you a 2 inch vertical.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 10:49 am to BigAppleBucky
quote:
They all have single payer healthcare, paid family leave and longer paid vacation periods. Advanced education is free or much cheaper than in the USA. They also work harder at having clean air and water.
Denmark has a 60% tax rate. It's easy for the government to take your money, give some of it back to you, and then convince you that what you are getting is free.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 10:49 am to TexasTiger89
quote:
I traveled to Norway quite regularly in the early 2000's. One thing you notice is all workers are Norwegian. I am talking wait staff, hotel staff (all including maids), garbage men/women, etc. I would assume their policy is very strict.
Norway is much more strict on immigration than Sweden.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 12:33 pm to Antonio Moss
quote:
Why?
Do you realize that it’s better to get sick in the US than anywhere else in the world? We have the best survival rates for basically every major killer of mankind.
I dont mean the medicak facilities or doctors, I meant insurance. Health insurance shouldn't be for profit.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 12:35 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:Should food be for profit? Should housing?
Health insurance shouldn't be for profit.
Profit is payment to providers of a good or service? Should a business owner offer a service for free?
Posted on 7/31/18 at 12:37 pm to beerJeep
quote:
Just wondering.
Can you tell me where the vast majority of medical improvements, innovation, new meds, new devices etc come from?
Do they come from countries that have socialized medicine? Or do they come from countries where companies make a profit off of these new inventions and drugs?
I was referring to insurance. I don't want to stop our private healthcare otherwise. Though I would love big pharma to be better.
Posted on 7/31/18 at 12:42 pm to bmy
quote:if you can't understand how this makes a difference, perhaps you should refrain from commenting on the issue. you're even acknowledging that multiple people understand it
I like how the "demographically homogenous" argument comes up time and time again.. in an argument about economics
Posted on 7/31/18 at 12:45 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:
How does the number of people make any difference?
ok, you can't be reasoned with. that's all you had to say holy crap does size make a difference?
quote:you realize you're just rearranging the deck chairs right?
The whole point is to go Single Payer which basically just illiminates Insurance Company profits
Posted on 7/31/18 at 12:45 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:i addressed this in a previous comment. libs can't even get on the same page as to what it actually is
The only people I see that conflate social programs with full-blown socialism are conservatives
Posted on 7/31/18 at 12:59 pm to Revelator
There is one really import fact that you have missed in this socialist, capitalist economy game that you have laid our for our Nordic friends. You are correct in that their economy was a capitalist economy and continues down the free market path even today, and that is not a socialist economy. You are also correct in that they have raise taxes to extremely high levels in order to pay for those government guaranteed benefits. The one thing you didn't mention is the vast majority in those societies are pulling the wagon and contributing to the socialist benefits being provided by the government and that is acceptable to the Nord's only if you are contributing my friend. Unlike here in the US, where 1% pay 85% of the taxes, and over 50% pay absolutely no taxes, all under the 1% want more benefits, health care, free college, guaranteed income, etc. So my friend unless you have a rare social network like the Nord's where a large portion of the population posses a great work ethic and actually work for a living, where you have wagon pullers, in lieu of wagon riders, like here in the US, socialism is a doomed economical theory and work even less in practical application. We have entirely way to many wagon riders in the US for that shite show of an economical experiment, and Bernie and all the rest know it, there just playing with a lot of dump arse folks along the way in their little power game. So just forget about it.
This post was edited on 7/31/18 at 1:01 pm
Posted on 7/31/18 at 1:29 pm to Ebbandflow
quote:
I dont mean the medicak facilities or doctors, I meant insurance. Health insurance shouldn't be for profit.
"Is there some society you know that doesn't run on greed? You think Russia doesn't run on greed? You think China doesn't run on greed? What is greed? Of course, none of us are greedy, it's only the other fellow who's greedy. The world runs on individuals pursuing their separate interests. The great achievements of civilization have not come from government bureaus. Einstein didn't construct his theory under order from a bureaucrat. Henry Ford didn't revolutionize the automobile industry that way. In the only cases in which the masses have escaped from the kind of grinding poverty you're talking about, the only cases in recorded history, are where they have had capitalism and largely free trade. If you want to know where the masses are worst off, it's exactly in the kinds of societies that depart from that. So that the record of history is absolutely crystal clear that there is no alternative way, so far discovered, of improving the lot of the ordinary people that can hold a candle to the productive activities that are unleashed by the free-enterprise system."
- Pulitzer Prize winning & most popular economist in history
Posted on 7/31/18 at 10:27 pm to Revelator
Let it be known: this is one of the all-time great quotes I’ve seen on TD:
Such an incredibly good point.
quote:
Denmark has a 60% tax rate. It's easy for the government to take your money, give some of it back to you, and then convince you that what you are getting is free.
Such an incredibly good point.
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