quote:
I simply mean that if there was A creator at whatever the "beginning" of everything was doesn't actually address if that creator was the cause of OUR universe's beginning or if that creator is an actively participative in his creation

but that's just postponing the question. if you accept the axiom that nothing can come from nothing, then either there is a creator, who lives independently of creation and is self-existent, or the universe(s) have always existed. Those propositions are equally plausible. so you look at the evidence, which i THINK is that the universe that we live in is in a state of decay, and there is no present evidence of multiple big bangs. Then there's the secondary question of if there is a creator, did he attempt to reveal himself and his character by the events and testimonies as shown in the Bible and do you judge its authenticity by the same standard as other documents of its age or by a the standards of the day.

then there is the existential evidence of the proposed believer and the ultimate choice of belief.

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Posted by ShortyRob

Member since Oct 2008

82116 posts

Posted on 9/21/17 at 3:16 pm to SFVtiger

quote:
but that's just postponing the question.

Not regarding the God of the Bible which is what I was responding to.

quote:
if you accept the axiom that nothing can come from nothing, then either there is a creator, who lives independently of creation and is self-existent, or the universe(s) have always existed.

quote:
Those propositions are equally plausible. so you look at the evidence, which i THINK is that the universe that we live in is in a state of decay, and there is no present evidence of multiple big bangs.

We only would have evidence in OUR universe so, by definition, if there are other universes, we would have no evidence on them.

Alas, by definition, a God capable of making one universe is capable of making more than one.

quote:
Then there's the secondary question of if there is a creator, did he attempt to reveal himself and his character by the events and testimonies as shown in the Bible and do you judge its authenticity by the same standard as other documents of its age or by a the standards of the day.

To me, judging the authenticity by the standards of when it was written makes no sense.

God would be independent of time so, he certainly wouldn't feel compelled to teach people according to any particular time's morality.