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Started By
Message
re: WWYD as Wisconsin Coach?
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:33 pm to SouthOfSouth
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:33 pm to SouthOfSouth
quote:
You said you would kneel over punt which is ridiculous.
No I didn't. I would never do either. I ranked it ahead of punting for giving my team the best shot of winning.
1
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:34 pm to nycajun
quote:
Always be cautious about claiming that there is no argument, when what you mean is that you will refuse to consider an argument. OP would argue that you have a better (not good, but better) chance of getting a stop defending 20 yards of the field ( including the EZ) than defending 60 yards. In either case you need a stop or it's game over.
If there was even a small chance at LSU throwing the ball I could understand that. But when you know that LSU would run, there is no difference in the length of the field when defending.
Except that in 1 situation there is only 6 yards till a TD and the other has 10 yards till a first down. Both end the game. I take the 10 yards.
This post was edited on 9/4/14 at 3:36 pm
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:34 pm to TheSexecutioner
okay. I just don't see it. 
This post was edited on 9/4/14 at 3:35 pm
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:36 pm to SouthOfSouth
quote:
But still I think either way LSU was running the ball so well against Wisc 2nd string D line that they score from the 6 or 8 yard line anyway.
But not get the first down anyway?
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:37 pm to TheSexecutioner
quote:
But not get the first down anyway?
I think there's a better chance of stopping LSU from getting 10 yards than stopping them from getting 6 or 8.
This post was edited on 9/4/14 at 3:37 pm
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:38 pm to TheSexecutioner
What?!?!
Kneeling the ball should never be an option, much less a better option than punting.
Might as well put "score a 90 yd td" as an option. Or would that come in 2nd on your list as well?
Kneeling the ball should never be an option, much less a better option than punting.
Might as well put "score a 90 yd td" as an option. Or would that come in 2nd on your list as well?
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:39 pm to SouthOfSouth
quote:
Except that in 1 situation there is only 6 yards till a TD and the other has 10 yards till a first down. Both end the game. I take the 10 yards.
Alright look, I acknowledge this is a huge difference that I did not intend to be in my hypothetical. That changes the game. Like I said, my kneel represented a failed attempt, not a loss of yards.
To get technical, I should correct the premise to run a QB sneak over take a knee. But bear with me here. I'm trying not to get too confusing. The key point is I would rather LSU inherit the ball around the 10 then punt.
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:42 pm to TheSexecutioner
A team has never gained a first by kneeling.
An offense has gained a first down by punting - via penalty or turnover.
An offense has gained a first down by punting - via penalty or turnover.
This post was edited on 9/4/14 at 3:43 pm
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:42 pm to TheSexecutioner
B) Punt
You know when LSU got the ball back they were going to be in a tight power formation and run straight at you. For most the game you've stopped them. (Hindsight, we got the 1st down, didn't fumble, game over).
You have 3 timeouts. Stop them from getting the 1st down or hope for a fumble.
Wisconsin had no success passing the ball downfield. On 4th and 12 if you go for it and don't convert the game was over; outside of a fumble. Statistically their best option was to punt and hope to get the ball back.
Punting and forcing LSU to a 3 and Out also gives you the option for a punt return.
You know when LSU got the ball back they were going to be in a tight power formation and run straight at you. For most the game you've stopped them. (Hindsight, we got the 1st down, didn't fumble, game over).
You have 3 timeouts. Stop them from getting the 1st down or hope for a fumble.
Wisconsin had no success passing the ball downfield. On 4th and 12 if you go for it and don't convert the game was over; outside of a fumble. Statistically their best option was to punt and hope to get the ball back.
Punting and forcing LSU to a 3 and Out also gives you the option for a punt return.
This post was edited on 9/4/14 at 3:46 pm
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:42 pm to TheSexecutioner
quote:
Alright look, I acknowledge this is a huge difference that I did not intend to be in my hypothetical. That changes the game. Like I said, my kneel represented a failed attempt, not a loss of yards.
To get technical, I should correct the premise to run a QB sneak over take a knee. But bear with me here. I'm trying not to get too confusing. The key point is I would rather LSU inherit the ball around the 10 then punt.
Okay. Well I'll stop now, cause we obviously see this differently, but I think LSU having the ball at the 10 would be much worse than LSU having the ball at the 40 or 50. I honestly think Miles would either score a TD or go for it on 4th down. At the 40 LSU would punt on 4th. From the 2 LSU goes for it and either leaves you at the 1 or scores.
This post was edited on 9/4/14 at 3:43 pm
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:46 pm to TheSexecutioner
With 1:35 left, you have to go for it.
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:49 pm to SouthOfSouth
As a coach you would not give the chance of a missed first down and allow your opponent the closeness to the goal which would have occurred. If Miles attempted something like you contend the Wisconsin coach should have, all of Tiger nation would be upon his case for doing so.
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:50 pm to Broham
quote:
With 1:35 left, you have to go for it.
Meh. When LSU had 3rd and 3 it was 1:14 so between a punt, and 2 run plays(then timeouts) only 21 seconds had run off.
Get the stop, use your last time out.
Realistically not that much time had run off the clock.
Posted on 9/4/14 at 3:50 pm to Broham
quote:
With 1:35 left, you have to go for it
Absolutely not.
Posted on 9/4/14 at 4:04 pm to TheSexecutioner
quote:
I mean, I literally wrote twice that kneeling could NEVER be the correct choice and still over half of the posters somehow gathered that I was advocating kneeling.
You indicated previously that you explained why it was an option in the first few pages. So clearly you seemed to think it had merit (it doesn't and never will). And if it is never the correct option, why even include it at all? You might as well have said d) line up with only 8 guys and put our fat kicker at QB. It would have made as much sense as "kneel"
Posted on 9/4/14 at 4:09 pm to Chucktown_Badger
quote:
You indicated previously that you explained why it was an option in the first few pages. So clearly you seemed to think it had merit (it doesn't and never will). And if it is never the correct option, why even include it at all? You might as well have said d) line up with only 8 guys and put our fat kicker at QB. It would have made as much sense as "kneel"
I did no such thing. I explained why it had more merit than punting. It has zero merit as long as going for it is an option as well, which it is.
It's been explained why it was included. Some people understand. You just don't. So I guess to answer your question, it was included for the benefit of those who do understand.
Posted on 9/4/14 at 4:10 pm to TheSexecutioner
quote:
Not very far. A 50 yard punt is only long because they are punting from ~15 yards behind the line of scrimmage. I do agree with your point that field position really wouldnt be any better.
For that guy? He sucked.
And I agree with another point made. You have to factor in that LSU being up 4 and LSU being up 7 is very different. Yes, you need a touchdown either way. But in one case, a touchdown wins you the game.
Posted on 9/4/14 at 4:11 pm to Chucktown_Badger
punting was the safest way to cover the spread
Posted on 9/4/14 at 4:12 pm to Broham
quote:
With 1:35 left, you have to go for it.
In all honesty, and this ridiculous kneel option aside, I think Andersen thought, do we have a better chance to get 12 yards on one play, or stop them from getting a first. Obviously he landed on the side of the latter option...which could be debated. Our defense didn't show the ability to stop you guys in the second half, but our offense also didn't show an ability to pick up chunks of yards via the pass.
Clement's longest run of the half was, i think, about 7 yards...so the run wasn't a good option either.
But, as I said earlier, if you go for it and don't get the first down, you're in the same situation you would be if you punt...which is, you need to force a 3 and out and it's still a 1 score game. But going for it at least gives you the potential for a first down.
(Hell, in hindsight, I'd have faked the punt and had our punter throw the ball...couldn't have been any worse than T Mac.)
This post was edited on 9/4/14 at 4:21 pm
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