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re: WWII buffs: let's talk about Germany's biggest strategic blunder
Posted on 8/19/14 at 11:31 pm to Jim Rockford
Posted on 8/19/14 at 11:31 pm to Jim Rockford
Interesting perspective. I can send where you're coming from but to be honest, from a military capability standpoint, Spain would have been even more of a burden on the Germans than their Italian Allies were. Spain had just come out of a bloody civil war and was in no position to make any serious contribution to Germany.
And speaking of the Italians, I believe they actually were the Germans biggest blunder. I base my opinion on the fact it was the Italians collapse in North Africa that made it necessary for the Germans to divert much needed resources to the Med theater. On top of this it was also due to the Italian fiasco in Greece and Albania that forced the Germans to divert resources to the Balkans and more importantly pushed back the original start date of Operation Barbarossa from May to June. This delay meant that the Germans reached Moscow in a full blown Russian winter wile the Russians had time to bring reinforcements from Siberia along with evacuating a huge chunk if it's industrial capacity the safety of Urals. Had operation Barbarossa kicked off at the start of May as was originally intended, the Germans may have actually been able to take Moscow and force the Soviets to sue for peace. But by delaying it for that key month, they wasted any chance if victory they had.
And speaking of the Italians, I believe they actually were the Germans biggest blunder. I base my opinion on the fact it was the Italians collapse in North Africa that made it necessary for the Germans to divert much needed resources to the Med theater. On top of this it was also due to the Italian fiasco in Greece and Albania that forced the Germans to divert resources to the Balkans and more importantly pushed back the original start date of Operation Barbarossa from May to June. This delay meant that the Germans reached Moscow in a full blown Russian winter wile the Russians had time to bring reinforcements from Siberia along with evacuating a huge chunk if it's industrial capacity the safety of Urals. Had operation Barbarossa kicked off at the start of May as was originally intended, the Germans may have actually been able to take Moscow and force the Soviets to sue for peace. But by delaying it for that key month, they wasted any chance if victory they had.
This post was edited on 8/19/14 at 11:36 pm
Posted on 8/20/14 at 12:17 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
And speaking of the Italians, I believe they actually were the Germans' biggest blunder.
Idk if I'd go as far as THE biggest blunder, but the Italians were an ally on paper only. They offered next to nothing for the Germans and in reality forced them to divert quite a few resources like you mentioned (including some of their most elite tank commanders) to clean-up Italy's mess.
Italy was a joke in WWII.
Posted on 8/20/14 at 8:17 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
pushed back the original start date of Operation Barbarossa from May to June.
There was quite a bit of muddy terrain all along the Eastern Front until late June, 1941. The terrain had not dried out from spring thaw until just about the time that Barbarossa launched.
There are many who agree with your point. But, it is an important fact that the operational pace of Barborossa launched in May would have been more slow than the pace sustained later with the launch on 22 June.
German tanks and halftracks were not good in mud. A May launch of Barbarossa would have allowed the Soviet Union to mobilize and deploy forces while the German tanks sloshed slowly eastward in the mud.
Posted on 8/20/14 at 8:43 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
Spain had just come out of a bloody civil war and was in no position to make any serious contribution to Germany
This is why Spain stayed out of it.
Two front war with dwindling natural resources killed them.
Posted on 8/20/14 at 8:52 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
pushed back the original start date of Operation Barbarossa from May to June. This delay meant that the Germans reached Moscow in a full blown Russian winter wile the Russians had time to bring reinforcements from Siberia along with evacuating a huge chunk if it's industrial capacity the safety of Urals. Had operation Barbarossa kicked off at the start of May as was originally intended, the Germans may have actually been able to take Moscow and force the Soviets to sue for peace. But by delaying it for that key month, they wasted any chance if victory they had.
So it seems like the or one of the biggest blunders wasn't invading Russia per se, but the timing of it?
Posted on 8/20/14 at 10:50 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
And speaking of the Italians, I believe they actually were the Germans biggest blunder. I base my opinion on the fact it was the Italians collapse in North Africa that made it necessary for the Germans to divert much needed resources to the Med theater. On top of this it was also due to the Italian fiasco in Greece and Albania that forced the Germans to divert resources to the Balkans and more importantly pushed back the original start date of Operation Barbarossa from May to June. This delay meant that the Germans reached Moscow in a full blown Russian winter wile the Russians had time to bring reinforcements from Siberia along with evacuating a huge chunk if it's industrial capacity the safety of Urals. Had operation Barbarossa kicked off at the start of May as was originally intended, the Germans may have actually been able to take Moscow and force the Soviets to sue for peace. But by delaying it for that key month, they wasted any chance if victory they had.
Was going to post this exact point as well. However I think the over-arching blunder that Hitler made was that he placed political considerations ahead of military ones every single time.
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