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re: Do any of the libs here have any facts of the evil of the koch brothers?
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:21 am to todospm
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:21 am to todospm
quote:
You don't think the Greenspan / Reagan years had anything to do with Social Security going broke? I remember reading through the transcripts of Carter / Reagan debates...
So, in your view, that "evidence" cited in the transcript is PROOF of your above-quoted premise?
REALLY, dude? This is your idea of a convincing argument?
The statements in the transcript demonstrate that Reagan had concerns about the solvency of the program. Carter dismissed the concerns, conditional upon a Democrat-held White House.
From THAT evidence, you want us to conclude that "Reagan/Greenspan" took actions to accelerate or cause the insolvency of the program????
SERIOUSLY? You are a mental midget, dude. You have no capacity for rational thought, analysis or critical thinking. You should stop for the day and come back tomorrow.
This post was edited on 4/3/14 at 8:23 am
1
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:24 am to CITWTT
quote:
Social Security is going broke because Democrats forty years ago started taking the money from it and spending it in the general fund budget, never has the "loans" been paid back in that time.
Indeed.
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:28 am to todospm
quote:
their companies receive corporate welfare subsidies straight from american taxpayers...
You do know they lobby against subsidies that benefit them, right?
No, no you didn't. But ignorance is the default for you people.
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:31 am to todospm
quote:
Here's one of many Levine/Ames articles about the brothers.
I read the article you cited and found it to be unpersuasive. It's an indictment by a Radical Leftist journalist, but, the indictment in unsupported by any evidence of wrongdoing or criminal activity.
The article's focus first is on the material possessions of the Koch's. Secondly, the article lists the capitalistic ventures of the Koch's.
The Koch's material possessions and capitalistic activities are both impressive. Now, in the Radical Left worldview, both of these are political crimes warranting imprisonment. However, in the World of Normal Reality, i.e. the world that is alien to Democrats, the Koch's are just rich businessmen who don't pay protection money to the Democrat Party Criminal Syndicate.
Thanks for posting something of substance, but, I think that we can all now conclude that the OP's question must be answered in the negative.
This post was edited on 4/3/14 at 8:32 am
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:34 am to Champagne
I said clearly that Ames and Levine don't come from an entirely honest place. I also tossed up a lone article for you to get a feel for some of the criticisms they level against Koch bros. I don't care enough to find their most damning articles, because I'm clearly not going to convince you of anything.
If I really wanted to get into it, I'd discuss Reason magazine's Holocaust denial links, etc.
If I really wanted to get into it, I'd discuss Reason magazine's Holocaust denial links, etc.
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:34 am to todospm
Dear mental midget.
The grainy newspaper article you provided is apparently taken from a microfiche image from February, 1990.
Let me repeat the date: FEBRUARY 1990.
Unpersuasive.
Please have a seat, this debate is concluded.
The grainy newspaper article you provided is apparently taken from a microfiche image from February, 1990.
Let me repeat the date: FEBRUARY 1990.
Unpersuasive.
Please have a seat, this debate is concluded.
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:39 am to todospm
quote:
I also tossed up a lone article for you to get a feel for some of the criticisms they level against Koch bros. I don't care enough to find their most damning articles, because I'm clearly not going to convince you of anything.
You aren't going to convince anybody of anything, because you have no evidence or proof of any kind to contribute towards answering the OP's question.
The OP's question is directed towards the Radical Left tendency to deal in vague unsubstantiated accusations that create a "feel for some of the criticisms" directed against the Koch's.
What YOU need to learn is that feelings and vague accusations that form the basis for concrete direct action against a private citizen is a tool of Totalitarianism.
When such tools are used by a political party, such as the Democrat Party, the logical conclusion is that this party and their followers are willing to use totalitarian methods to wage political warfare.
The question for you to ponder for yourself is: how long are you going to be duped and bamboozled by the propaganda fed to you by your political masters? When are you going to learn to rationally think for yourself?
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:41 am to chadau79
You don't know that.
The stock market can collapse, housing prices can collapse.
You could end up with nothing and be entirely dependent upon SS.
The stock market can collapse, housing prices can collapse.
You could end up with nothing and be entirely dependent upon SS.
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:43 am to Champagne
And you think 1990 is the first time Moynihan raised these issues?
Also, you must have missed the last full paragraph in column one: "Second, democrats say, Bush and his predecessor Ronald Reagan have been able to run on pledges not to increase income taxes because they knew the mounting Social Security surplus would hide the true size of the deficit in other accounts."
Finally, I've seen nothing, not so much as a grainy newspaper article, about Democrats destroying SS other than a random assertion and your co-sign.
Also, you must have missed the last full paragraph in column one: "Second, democrats say, Bush and his predecessor Ronald Reagan have been able to run on pledges not to increase income taxes because they knew the mounting Social Security surplus would hide the true size of the deficit in other accounts."
Finally, I've seen nothing, not so much as a grainy newspaper article, about Democrats destroying SS other than a random assertion and your co-sign.
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:45 am to samson'sseed
Social security will be made obsolete by inflation by the time see a penny of it. I want my contributions back.
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:47 am to Champagne
quote:
You aren't going to convince anybody of anything
I know I can't. I 'lost' about 100 internet arguments wrt to the Iraq invasion and later occupation. Shrugs. No one to blame but myself, though. I know these things going into it.
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:50 am to todospm
quote:
You aren't going to convince anybody of anything
I know I can't.
you cant because you arent posting facts.
So they have money...so what, does that make them evil?
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:51 am to CptBengal
Here's the first of several posts including facts about the Koch brothers...seriously.
Pollution:
The Political Economy Research Institute ranks Koch Industries as the tenth worst air polluter in the U.S. in their Toxic Release Inventory. CARMA reports that Koch releases about 200,000 tons of atmospheric carbon dioxide annually.
Koch Industries has a long record [PDF] of environmental crimes and violations, including, but not limited to:
•A $1.7 million fine by the EPA and $500 million commitment to correct pollution violations in seven states
•Millions of gallons of spilled oil from Koch pipelines throughout the past decade
•A $25 million settlement with the U.S. government in 2001 after falsifying extraction records for oil collected on Native American and federal land
•A $20 million settlement in 2000 for falsifying documents relating to a major release of the carcinogen benzene
•A 1996 explosion that killed two teenagers due to a leaking Koch gas pipeline
While David Koch, a victim of prostate cancer, has donated millions to cancer research institutions and is a member of the National Cancer Advisory Board, Koch Industries subsidiary Georgia-Pacific is actively working to downplay the dangers of formaldehyde, a known carcinogen
Pollution:
The Political Economy Research Institute ranks Koch Industries as the tenth worst air polluter in the U.S. in their Toxic Release Inventory. CARMA reports that Koch releases about 200,000 tons of atmospheric carbon dioxide annually.
Koch Industries has a long record [PDF] of environmental crimes and violations, including, but not limited to:
•A $1.7 million fine by the EPA and $500 million commitment to correct pollution violations in seven states
•Millions of gallons of spilled oil from Koch pipelines throughout the past decade
•A $25 million settlement with the U.S. government in 2001 after falsifying extraction records for oil collected on Native American and federal land
•A $20 million settlement in 2000 for falsifying documents relating to a major release of the carcinogen benzene
•A 1996 explosion that killed two teenagers due to a leaking Koch gas pipeline
While David Koch, a victim of prostate cancer, has donated millions to cancer research institutions and is a member of the National Cancer Advisory Board, Koch Industries subsidiary Georgia-Pacific is actively working to downplay the dangers of formaldehyde, a known carcinogen
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:54 am to samson'sseed
quote:
polluter
quote:
Koch releases about 200,000 tons of atmospheric carbon dioxide annually.
I bet you think that number is alot...dont you?
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:56 am to CptBengal
This place was so much better without CptDA and these shitshow threads
Posted on 4/3/14 at 8:59 am to CptBengal
quote:
you cant because you arent posting facts.
Georgia Pacific's government teets were left unharmed in the recent farm bill, including nearly 1 billion dollars for mandatory biomass energy programs, while 8 billion dollars in food stamps were cut.
The Kochs must be doing a sh*t job of 'lobbying against' the subsidies that benefit them. (Oh, wait, Koch's lobbying efforts have specifically earmarked the biomass spending as untouchable... you don't say!)
Posted on 4/3/14 at 9:00 am to Layabout
quote:good to see you judge people by their wallet, not their character.
Behind every great fortune lies a great crime.
Posted on 4/3/14 at 9:01 am to todospm
quote:
were left unharmed in the recent farm bill,
you do know the Koch brothers spent a lot of money campaigning against those subsides within, right???
quote:
Koch's lobbying efforts have specifically earmarked the biomass spending as untouchable... you don't say!)
link?
Posted on 4/3/14 at 9:04 am to todospm
quote:What have they changed? What legislators have done things for them? Names and examples. List them.
These men have become some of the most influential and powerful people in the world; their influence in DC is astronomical;
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