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Is the RNC trying to keep certain candidates off the debate stage?

Posted on 6/3/23 at 11:36 am
Posted by Marcus Aurelius
LA
Member since Oct 2020
3900 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 11:36 am
Some... maybe many or most ... states try to make it hard for the average U.S. citizen ... even if a potential quality candidate ... out of the elections.

Is the RNC trying to keep certain candidates off the debate stage for August?

Why should they give ore favorable position on the stage based on polling?



"On the fundraising side, the RNC will require debaters to have a minimum of 40,000 unique donors to their principal presidential campaign committee or exploratory committee and at least 200 unique donors per state in 20 states or more."

"The RNC will require that all participants attain at least 1% in three national polls or 1% in two national polls and 1% in a state poll from one of four early nominating states — Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina and Nevada. "

LINK
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
35778 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 11:38 am to
quote:

Is the RNC trying to keep certain candidates off the debate stage for August?

Yes.
quote:

Why should they give ore favorable position on the stage based on polling?

Because only people with a viable campaign and realistic shot of getting votes in an election need to be on the debate stage.

quote:

On the fundraising side, the RNC will require debaters to have a minimum of 40,000 unique donors to their principal presidential campaign committee or exploratory committee and at least 200 unique donors per state in 20 states or more." "The RNC will require that all participants attain at least 1% in three national polls or 1% in two national polls and 1% in a state poll from one of four early nominating states — Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina and Nevada.

These things do not set a high bar. No one who doesn’t meet this criteria has a chance at the nomination
Posted by idlewatcher
Planet Arium
Member since Jan 2012
92745 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 11:49 am to
I thought the requirements were fairly lenient.

Polling 1% nationally should be pretty simple for most. But the unique donors will be a problem for the lower tier candidates.
Posted by Marcus Aurelius
LA
Member since Oct 2020
3900 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 11:49 am to
I'll disagree on these two points:

1) The debate stage is important for lessor known candidates to make themselves known to the public. How many people know about the North Dakota Gov... probably not many. By placing them on the stage in a certain order on the FIRST debate, they are giving preference to those with the most name recognition. Do you think that pre-season college football polls are a good idea? No, because, to a large degree, it benefits the schools based on something they did last year (not relevant... what happens on the field is ... just like what happens on the debate stage). I view these as the essentially the same thing.

2) Using the North Dakota Gov again ... who in South Carolina knows who he is? Why should a South Carolina poll matter more than an Alabama or Louisiana or ... a North Dakota poll?

For the initial debates, I'd prefer they change the criteria. They also should state that if you want to be in future debates, if you are running, you have to participate in the first one.
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
35778 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 11:53 am to
quote:

The debate stage is important for lessor known candidates to make themselves known to the public.

Lesser known, sure. Not nobodies who stand zero chance of ever mounting a campaign.

quote:

By placing them on the stage in a certain order on the FIRST debate, they are giving preference to those with the most name recognition

Correct. Name recognition is the single most important thing in politics. The Governor of North Dakota has months to get himself into the news if he wants to run for President.

This process is not about fair. It’s about finding the Republican with the best chance of winning the general. The Governor of North Dakota is highly unlikely to be that person, regardless of what his positions are. Life is not fair. The RNC doesn’t owe equal access to anyone
This post was edited on 6/3/23 at 11:55 am
Posted by udtiger
Over your left shoulder
Member since Nov 2006
112700 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:09 pm to
Of course they are.
Posted by Buzz Blightyear
Member since Jun 2023
16 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:12 pm to
There should never be more than 5 people on a debate stage.
Posted by TrueTiger
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
80189 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:14 pm to
Vivek already made the cut.

I think he will crush the debates.

He is a superb communicator.
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
35778 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:15 pm to
quote:

Vivek already made the cut. I think he will crush the debates. He is a superb communicator.

Vivek is a great example of someone who can meet all of those requirements, but shouldn’t be on the stage because he isn’t a serious candidate.
Posted by TrueTiger
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
80189 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:16 pm to
Wait until more people hear him.

He is capable of stealing the show.
Posted by Marcus Aurelius
LA
Member since Oct 2020
3900 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:19 pm to
Agree re politics and name recognition... and part of my point. Those tied to the donor class get an advantage over others. That is part of "our" problem. Both the GOP and DEM parties do NOT want potentially great candidates for the country.

The first debate is less than three months off.

-----

"Correct. Name recognition is the single most important thing in politics. The Governor of North Dakota has months to get himself into the news if he wants to run for President.

This process is not about fair. It’s about finding the Republican with the best chance of winning the general. "
Posted by rhar61
Member since Nov 2022
5109 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:19 pm to
quote:

He is capable of stealing the show.



He is young. He can steal it in 10 years after successfully filling a cabinet position or two.
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
35778 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:23 pm to
quote:

He is capable of stealing the show.

You’re entitled to your opinion. But IMO he Will never gain any type of traction unless 4-5 people including both Trump and DeSantis die between now and the Iowa caucus.

There isn’t any room for that type of thing this cycle.
This post was edited on 6/3/23 at 12:26 pm
Posted by Marcus Aurelius
LA
Member since Oct 2020
3900 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:24 pm to
Why? I'd actually like to see a lot of candidates. I have no problem with two debates to get all of the candidates as long as they don't do it by the polls initially. Make it random... let the best of each group survive. After a few debates, then use the polls. Again, I'll use the pre-season college football polls analogy... why should last years national champion get some benefit from what they did last year? They shouldn't. They changed that to some degree, but the first poll that matters in college football still gets influenced by the early polls. Screw the polls until after a couple of debates. The best candidates would rise to the top, and the weak ones fade.
This post was edited on 6/3/23 at 12:29 pm
Posted by Marcus Aurelius
LA
Member since Oct 2020
3900 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:26 pm to
If Vivek wasn't already a Fox News contributor, he would not have the numbers on the polls. Bad way to let someone into the debates.

I'm fine with him being in the race.
This post was edited on 6/3/23 at 12:28 pm
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
35778 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:26 pm to
quote:

After a few debates

Having 78 debates giving a platform to people who don’t resonate at all beyond their home constituency is a clown show and pointless.
Posted by TrueTiger
Chicken's most valuable
Member since Sep 2004
80189 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:28 pm to

Do you recall how Obama stole the show at the democrat convention that nominated Kerry?

Even though I knew I wouldn't like his policies I could tell that he had 'it'.

Vivek also has 'it'.
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
35778 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:31 pm to
quote:

Vivek also has 'it'.

He really doesn’t. But I respect that you like the guy.

He doesn’t have the political platform that Obama had, and never will. He’s just some guy. Obama at least held office.
This post was edited on 6/3/23 at 12:32 pm
Posted by Marcus Aurelius
LA
Member since Oct 2020
3900 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:33 pm to
How do you know that Burgam or Vivek wouldn't / won't take off if on the debate stage? YOu don't know. We'll get better candidates if the two main parties lose some power. Your way puts the power in the hands of a smaller number of Elites. I say have more candidates and more debates early on and let "We the People" decide. After thinking about it... some regional debates may actually be a good idea that would allow some potentially great leaders to rise to the top.
.
This post was edited on 6/3/23 at 1:21 pm
Posted by Indefatigable
Member since Jan 2019
35778 posts
Posted on 6/3/23 at 12:35 pm to
quote:

how do you know that Burnam or Vivek won't take off if on the debate stage?

Because that doesn’t happen in real life. This isn’t an Aaron Sorkin screenplay.

quote:

After thinking about it... some regional debates may actually be a good idea that would allow some potentially great leaders rise to the top.

Just more time wasting. The actual candidates have already been decided. There are 2 of them, maybe 4/5 tops. Vivek is not one of them, nor is the governor of ND.

We don’t live in fantasy land.
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