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Message
re: I believe West Virginia should be Team No. 14
Posted on 9/27/11 at 10:37 am to lsu777
Posted on 9/27/11 at 10:37 am to lsu777
quote:
they can't do that, dint have the population nor the viewers. This is assuming that slive would accept a bump of only 1 million. That's a shitty bump and not worth it. Also the big $$$ is in full fledged sec network and the money in that comes in the form of subscribers in an sec market. For example big 10 network gets $.85 for subscribers in market, only $.15 for those out of market. WVU can't help diddly squat when it comes to this.
This is what it's all about. It has nothing to do with the competitiveness of their programs.
0
Posted on 9/27/11 at 10:38 am to bayou2003
quote:
Nope, you're going to get hit back with Markets and Academics 5,4,3,2,1......
Doesn't matter. Those are apples/oranges arguments. I updated my referenced post above and gave reasons why I discount the markets/academics argument that some are stuck on. I believe the SEC is about football excellence and that is the only reason we have the great market share we are enjoying now. It must be the primary motivation (football excellence) in adding any new teams. If they happen to be well-placed in larger markets, great. But even if not, are they marketable? WVU is, absolutely, marketable.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 10:39 am to JawjaTigah
quote:they have been good for the last 8 seasons in arguably the weakest BCS conference. i will give you that. they have one conference championship from 1970-2000
A a pretty decent football program that is here to stay.
quote:valid. that being said, they would come in with the second smallest stadium of 60,000. they would only be larger than Vanderbilt.
A rabid fanbase, much akin to the SEC in that respect.
quote:significance is a matter of opinion. Television viewership is what matters in this market. WVU has not proven to bring it historically.
A small but not totally insignificant increase in the SEC footprint, with a reach into western PA.
quote:howso? i'm not sure what you are trying to say here.
A marketable image/brand nationwide.
quote:based on what metrics?
A reasonable national following.
quote:this is a valid point that deserves consideration
A flagship state university.
quote:this is about money. this have nothing to do with culture.
Regional cultural similarities to Kentucky, Tennessee, maybe Arkansas Ozarks, northern Alabama and north GA.
quote:copy of your first point
The ability to compete in SEC football.
quote:i think this is the best thing that they bring to the table. i think they are a top-4 men's hoops program if they join. the problem is that they are one of the worst baseball, softball (doesn't exist), track (men's track doesn't exist), and a middle of the pack women's hoops program
A decent basketball program that could compete on the non-UK (at its best) level.
quote:
No $20 million price tag.
$1.54 million paid by each member institution is charging people a few extra bucks to park for football for one season
quote:based on my comments, it is not enough
Is this enough?
This post was edited on 9/27/11 at 10:43 am
Posted on 9/27/11 at 10:40 am to JawjaTigah
jawja and how much money do you believe they would add to current contracts as they don't bring anything for a future sec network?
do you really believe that they can add 31 mil? That's a min they need to add and that's just to keep the status quo + 1 million. I don't believe they add enough to make the contract go up that much.
read my hypothetical above and tell me if you were LSU president which would you chose? And why do you think the 20 mil buyout is so much? A&M had an original buyout of 30 mil.
I just don't believe WVU adds enough to make the contract increase much. Nor do I believe the 20mil buyout for acc teams is anything more then an inconvenience.
I think its funny the wvu homers van never debate the facts about money, which expansion is about, it always is about they have a good football team and rabid fans.
So the frick what? All that gets current members is less money. Ratings and the contract numbers back a lot of this up. A week or so ago I posted this, I was off on my numbers some, but the premise still stands. WVU doesn't add enough.
do you really believe that they can add 31 mil? That's a min they need to add and that's just to keep the status quo + 1 million. I don't believe they add enough to make the contract go up that much.
read my hypothetical above and tell me if you were LSU president which would you chose? And why do you think the 20 mil buyout is so much? A&M had an original buyout of 30 mil.
I just don't believe WVU adds enough to make the contract increase much. Nor do I believe the 20mil buyout for acc teams is anything more then an inconvenience.
I think its funny the wvu homers van never debate the facts about money, which expansion is about, it always is about they have a good football team and rabid fans.
So the frick what? All that gets current members is less money. Ratings and the contract numbers back a lot of this up. A week or so ago I posted this, I was off on my numbers some, but the premise still stands. WVU doesn't add enough.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 10:44 am to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
I hope you don't believe UNC will leave the ACC. UNC is a basketball school. They are not leaving the ACC.
i agree with this, but it doesn't change the fact they are still slive's number 1 target. he will not touch wvu until he is done with UNC and VT.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 10:45 am to lsu777
quote:I remember your posting. Your numbers were admittedly off, as you say. I'm saying they may still be off, or the model you're presenting as the only possibility is not the only model. You're entitled to your opinion and I respect it. I just don't subscribe to your model. I still hold to the model that says our market share, our profits, our TV contracts and revenues are related totally to the excellence of our football product in the SEC. And I'm maintaining that in the race for market share, we must NOT lose sight of the thing that got us here in the first place. Football excellence - exciting teams - excited fans - big games. Did you see any of that happening last Saturday night as you watched on TV? A lot of people across America did. They will want to see more.
So the frick what? All that gets current members is less money. Ratings and the contract numbers back a lot of this up. A week or so ago I posted this, I was off on my numbers some, but the premise still stands. WVU doesn't add enough.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 10:46 am to lsu777
jawja... Sec isn't highest grossing in tv, big 10 is by a long ways. Over 5 mil per school more. That's why this expansion is so important.
and I agree with you about the reason sec is great is because of competitive games, atmosphere etc but this isn't 1992 anymore. Tv $$ rule the day and wvu doesn't help in this department.
you keep posting opinions, how about showing in numbers what wvu brings to the table.
and I agree with you about the reason sec is great is because of competitive games, atmosphere etc but this isn't 1992 anymore. Tv $$ rule the day and wvu doesn't help in this department.
you keep posting opinions, how about showing in numbers what wvu brings to the table.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 11:57 am to lsu777
:crickets:
Posted on 9/27/11 at 11:58 am to lsu777
quote:You keep posting numbers. Those are your opinions. Can you make a real case how just going after dollars, or going after dollars first, keeps or improves the SEC football product? If we're not the highest grossing football product around, so what? The B1G is in what appears to be a much bigger tv situation in terms of major markets and population centers than the SEC to begin with, as is the PAC 12. But we've got something they don't have - SEC football, which is rapidly becoming a national brand. Yes, I can see that it would be nice to increase those television contracts and squeeze even more revenue into the SEC coffers. But I believe dilution of $$ value and $$ return can be caused not just by adding a smaller television market like WVU, even though I believe their marketing appeal extends far from their state line. But perhaps dilution of product can reduce $$ returns moreso by adding more vanilla-bland teams to the SEC lineup like Mizzou, whose national appeal might very well end with the MO state border. Of course that is simply an opinion, but I stand by it.
you keep posting opinions, how about showing in numbers what wvu brings to the table.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:02 pm to JawjaTigah
The SEC is not waiting 27 months to bring in a crap team...sorry WVU.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:13 pm to Tigersomething
WVU would be the worst academic institution in the SEC if they are allowed in.
Thanks but no thanks. They offer nothing outside of a middle of the road football team and a decent basketball team.
They have too many negatives.
Thanks but no thanks. They offer nothing outside of a middle of the road football team and a decent basketball team.
They have too many negatives.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:18 pm to JawjaTigah
quote:
A a pretty decent football program that is here to stay.
A rabid fanbase, much akin to the SEC in that respect.
A small but not totally insignificant increase in the SEC footprint, with a reach into western PA.
A flagship state university.
Regional cultural similarities to Kentucky, Tennessee, maybe Arkansas Ozarks, northern Alabama and north GA.
The ability to compete in SEC football.
A decent basketball program that could compete on the non-UK (at its best) level.
No $20 million price tag.
unfortunately none of that crap matters.
quote:
A marketable image/brand nationwide.
A reasonable national following.
you on drugs?
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:21 pm to vegas-tiger
quote:
crap team
based on what?
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:43 pm to lsu777
Remember 60-50-40. Notre Dame joining the ACC could return significant dollars to the SEC.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:44 pm to rocket31
quote:Great tactic - when you have no ability to refute an argument, resort to personal attacks.
you on drugs?
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:47 pm to StraightCashHomey21
WVU would no better than Kentucky, Ole Miss, and State in the SEC. That's not a put down. It just is what it is.
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:49 pm to Geaux2002
quote:
Thanks but no thanks. They offer nothing outside of a middle of the road football team and a decent basketball team
The SEC should invite an institution that would be beneficial to the SEC and that institution. WVA joining the SEC would only be be beneficial to WVA and the SEC would get nothing of value or very little value in return.
The SEC is on a roll, we just grabbed a highly coveted school in A&M. Now we are going to end it with a whimper by accepting WVA, a school that was rejected by the ACC?
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:53 pm to StraightCashHomey21
quote:
based on what?
Watching them play over the years.
Do you consider them good? 6 big east championships since '91. Syr has 5 of those, cincy and uconn have 2 each. So, do you consider Syr, Cincy, and Uconn, good teams too?
Posted on 9/27/11 at 12:59 pm to JawjaTigah
quote:
MIT? Not much.
FWIW the last president of MIT was a WVU graduate, not that it really means anything but for 'shitty' academics its pretty impressive, I dont really undesrstand what academics have anything to do with conferences? Are there science bowls I'm not aware of? Just because Stanford and Arizona St are in the same conference doesn't mean I have the same idea of prestitge for both in my head
Posted on 9/27/11 at 1:04 pm to NorthernWV
After the way our fans were treated in Morgantown, I don't want any SEC team to ever have to play amongst those toothless methed out feral white trash ever again.
HELL NO To WV in the SEC.
HELL NO To WV in the SEC.
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