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Started By
Message
re: ETA; Ferentz no longer candidate again for 6th time
Posted on 12/5/07 at 2:52 pm to belowpar
Posted on 12/5/07 at 2:52 pm to belowpar
Mich. has more than enough money to pay that and much more. They have said as much. But not for Ferentz. They could have him tomorrow if they wanted him. The fact that he isn't already announced is clear indication that he is not a real candidate. His connection to Mary Sue Coleman who hired him when both were at Iowa, is what is fueling the specualtion.
3
Posted on 12/5/07 at 2:54 pm to loopy
ah...
I know nothing about their hiring situation...I know they have the money, lets just hope they do it...Don't think they've really been used to letting go of that much cash with Carr.
I know nothing about their hiring situation...I know they have the money, lets just hope they do it...Don't think they've really been used to letting go of that much cash with Carr.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 2:56 pm to loopy
So who do you think will get the job, its not Ferentz or Kelly. Hoke? Go after miles again?
Posted on 12/5/07 at 2:59 pm to belowpar
That is one of the actual facts that folks seem to ignore.
The incoming recruits have all been contacted and say they are staying. So no pressure there.
There are no other major programs now looking to cause Mich to rush to judgement. So no pressure there.
Mich does not want to pre-empt Lloyd's finale, it is their sense of loyalty.
And most importantly, the only guy who does know anything, Bill Martin, did say that he was going to follow the process and he hoped to have this done by the end of Dec. Folks seem to think he is lieing. He hasn't so far. And he is the only one who knows what is going on. So you have to trust that he will, absent some change to the landscape, do what he said.
The incoming recruits have all been contacted and say they are staying. So no pressure there.
There are no other major programs now looking to cause Mich to rush to judgement. So no pressure there.
Mich does not want to pre-empt Lloyd's finale, it is their sense of loyalty.
And most importantly, the only guy who does know anything, Bill Martin, did say that he was going to follow the process and he hoped to have this done by the end of Dec. Folks seem to think he is lieing. He hasn't so far. And he is the only one who knows what is going on. So you have to trust that he will, absent some change to the landscape, do what he said.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 3:06 pm to loopy
I can tell you...While the process is happening and rumors are flying that deals are done on both sides...Basically none of them will be true to let you know.
These situations are EXTREMELY fluid...They change daily...Even if you are on the inside you can only know which way someone might be leaning...You never know FOR SURE until the deal is actually done...
In Miles situation it wasn't 100% done until early Saturday morning. So anyone that said they knew FOR SURE didn't...Even when I was posting I was just giving percentages that he was leaning to staying but it was not for sure.
Once the deal is absolutely done and agreed to in principle then the news will be released probably that day.
Moral of my post...Be patient, things change.
These situations are EXTREMELY fluid...They change daily...Even if you are on the inside you can only know which way someone might be leaning...You never know FOR SURE until the deal is actually done...
In Miles situation it wasn't 100% done until early Saturday morning. So anyone that said they knew FOR SURE didn't...Even when I was posting I was just giving percentages that he was leaning to staying but it was not for sure.
Once the deal is absolutely done and agreed to in principle then the news will be released probably that day.
Moral of my post...Be patient, things change.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 3:06 pm to belowpar
Carr was an interim hire who ended up staying. He never was sought by other programs so he was cheap to Mich. And he won, at least early in his tenure, enough to keep folks mollified (not happy, just not hostile).
He was Mich's first coach to break the $1.0 million barrier, but the entire athletic program was on shaky fiscal ground. That is why Bill Martin was brought in to fix the money and rebuild the athletic campus (not just the football stuff, everything). Well now the athletic budget runs a surplus, the campus is well underway, the football faclitites upgrade ($230 million) was approved in the spring and things are in place to move into the 21st century of BCS football. And they have the money to do it..big time.
He was Mich's first coach to break the $1.0 million barrier, but the entire athletic program was on shaky fiscal ground. That is why Bill Martin was brought in to fix the money and rebuild the athletic campus (not just the football stuff, everything). Well now the athletic budget runs a surplus, the campus is well underway, the football faclitites upgrade ($230 million) was approved in the spring and things are in place to move into the 21st century of BCS football. And they have the money to do it..big time.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 3:16 pm to TheEdge
Not hard to say, but not easy either.
Fans, media, former players, alums all think that now that the Miles thing is history, Martin needs to come up with something as good or better.
Don't think he feels that way, but how the big $$ donors feels will play into his decision.
You could make an argument, since the $$'s really are not in question, that any top coach could be approached with a package that would be very juicy. But it isn't always just money. Mich can also sell the huge upgrades to Mich football facilities, great pools for asst. coaches. Ownerhip of a very lucrative coaches TV show, many, many lucarative speaking opportunities, etc.
Is that enough. At that level of coaching, it can't be so much about money, but what you want out of the job. Otherwise, if it is only money, then the only place left to go is the NFL.
I think the challenge is one factor. For some it may be "home" as many felt with Les Miles and is true for Jim Tressel.
If I had my wish, it would be Urban Meyer. I wanted him when he left Bowling Green, and again when he left Utah. Rumor said he contacted Mich each time to come and be Lloyd's heir apparent, but they turned him down -- just rumor. Is that possible, it's what I would want.
I think if it is not a big name, then it will be a real up and comer - Chris Petersen type.
Fans, media, former players, alums all think that now that the Miles thing is history, Martin needs to come up with something as good or better.
Don't think he feels that way, but how the big $$ donors feels will play into his decision.
You could make an argument, since the $$'s really are not in question, that any top coach could be approached with a package that would be very juicy. But it isn't always just money. Mich can also sell the huge upgrades to Mich football facilities, great pools for asst. coaches. Ownerhip of a very lucrative coaches TV show, many, many lucarative speaking opportunities, etc.
Is that enough. At that level of coaching, it can't be so much about money, but what you want out of the job. Otherwise, if it is only money, then the only place left to go is the NFL.
I think the challenge is one factor. For some it may be "home" as many felt with Les Miles and is true for Jim Tressel.
If I had my wish, it would be Urban Meyer. I wanted him when he left Bowling Green, and again when he left Utah. Rumor said he contacted Mich each time to come and be Lloyd's heir apparent, but they turned him down -- just rumor. Is that possible, it's what I would want.
I think if it is not a big name, then it will be a real up and comer - Chris Petersen type.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 3:24 pm to loopy
quote:
If I had my wish, it would be Urban Meyer. I wanted him when he left Bowling Green, and again when he left Utah.
I think you'll missed that ship, at least for now.
quote:
Chris Petersen
Brad Hoke?
Posted on 12/5/07 at 3:36 pm to TheEdge
Urban Meyer may be beyond our reach, but that doesn't mean I don't want him.
Just to play devil's advocate. Meyer's contract says that the only time he can be contacted or contact other programs is beginning 12/1 and ending 1/1 or just prior to their bowl game each year. Anything else is cause for dismissal.
12/1 was last Saturday, when Martin could not be reached (supposedly), yet everyone knew where he was........FLORIDA. (I'm just playing, the story is that Martin was hosting big $$ donors to the football facilities)
No it won't be Brady Hoke!!! Consensus is that Lloyd is orchestrating these interviews (also with Debord and English) to "polish" them up and improve their hiring image with other schools. Hoke would fall into that category as well.
Just to play devil's advocate. Meyer's contract says that the only time he can be contacted or contact other programs is beginning 12/1 and ending 1/1 or just prior to their bowl game each year. Anything else is cause for dismissal.
12/1 was last Saturday, when Martin could not be reached (supposedly), yet everyone knew where he was........FLORIDA. (I'm just playing, the story is that Martin was hosting big $$ donors to the football facilities)
No it won't be Brady Hoke!!! Consensus is that Lloyd is orchestrating these interviews (also with Debord and English) to "polish" them up and improve their hiring image with other schools. Hoke would fall into that category as well.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 3:37 pm to loopy
quote:
Just to play devil's advocate. Meyer's contract says that the only time he can be contacted or contact other programs is beginning 12/1 and ending 1/1 or just prior to their bowl game each year. Anything else is cause for dismissal.
He's got another MNC in the pipes at UF over the next few years with Tim Tebow, why leave just now? Do you think it'll actually be Peterson?
This post was edited on 12/5/07 at 3:39 pm
Posted on 12/5/07 at 3:55 pm to TheEdge
Don't know the man that well. Tebow is great, but a lot has to go right to get to the NC game, and even more to win it. A few key injuries almost derailed LSU's "guaranteed" NC season. And a really strange performance by WVU got you back in. LSU had nothing to do with that. Just good luck for the Tigers.
Meyer knows that Tebow could go down, Harvin could blow out his knee, anything can happen. Coaches are loyal, but also pragmatic. Chance plays a bigger role in getting to the NC and in winning it than talent and preparation. Just ask OSU (actually they won't admit it). Key injury to McGhee, a late and questionalbe pass interference call in overtime all fed into their win. It was not a clear cut, unquestioned victory like FLA 41 OSU 14 last year. Things happened that skill, planning, prep, strategy, recruiting had no role in.
So Meyer should not look at where he is, and what he has, but what he wants. And I don't know, and you don't know what that is. Only he knows. My philosophy is: "Go ask the man." That way you do know, just don't assume you know.
Look at Pelini. He could have stayed and won a NC. His stock, rationally would be much higher, and there are still programs looking, and one not known yet, because Mich has not pulled the trigger to create that opening yet. So he could parlay his NC contribution into a very lucrative gig at maybe a better location than what NEB is right now. But he wants to be a HC now. He likes NEB -- even thought it is a shambles. He wants the challenge. Are they close to a NC at NEB? Is he the guy to get them there? Common sense would say not soon and not likely for a first time HC. But he wants to go. It's not always rational.
Meyer knows that Tebow could go down, Harvin could blow out his knee, anything can happen. Coaches are loyal, but also pragmatic. Chance plays a bigger role in getting to the NC and in winning it than talent and preparation. Just ask OSU (actually they won't admit it). Key injury to McGhee, a late and questionalbe pass interference call in overtime all fed into their win. It was not a clear cut, unquestioned victory like FLA 41 OSU 14 last year. Things happened that skill, planning, prep, strategy, recruiting had no role in.
So Meyer should not look at where he is, and what he has, but what he wants. And I don't know, and you don't know what that is. Only he knows. My philosophy is: "Go ask the man." That way you do know, just don't assume you know.
Look at Pelini. He could have stayed and won a NC. His stock, rationally would be much higher, and there are still programs looking, and one not known yet, because Mich has not pulled the trigger to create that opening yet. So he could parlay his NC contribution into a very lucrative gig at maybe a better location than what NEB is right now. But he wants to be a HC now. He likes NEB -- even thought it is a shambles. He wants the challenge. Are they close to a NC at NEB? Is he the guy to get them there? Common sense would say not soon and not likely for a first time HC. But he wants to go. It's not always rational.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 3:58 pm to loopy
quote:
A few key injuries almost derailed LSU's "guaranteed" NC season.
Which is why we started off ranked #2?
quote:
He could have stayed and won a NC.
Check the other sticky he's going to coach us during the NCG, he gets his ring(if we win)
I'm not saying Meyer is guaranteed a MNC, but UM will probably stick around for a while to coach this team through their careers, then he may end up at UM if you don't like whoever you get.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 4:03 pm to TheEdge
If its is not big, then Martin has to pick the acknowledged up-and-comer. To me that is either Paul Johnson or Chris Petersen. It is the 2007 version of hiring Bo Schembechler (not coaching wise, but Bo was sold as the next Woody Hayes). It's all about selling his potential not his record.
Any Ferentz, or Grobe or Pinkel....would be seen a settling for seconds, their records would be the issue and directly compared to Miles'. And that would be unsaleable at Mich.
Petersen would not suffer that comparison, because he is the high risk, high upside guy. He is fresh dynamic and much lower cost. So it could be more easliy sold. And if need be changed sooner if it doesn't work out.
Any Ferentz, or Grobe or Pinkel....would be seen a settling for seconds, their records would be the issue and directly compared to Miles'. And that would be unsaleable at Mich.
Petersen would not suffer that comparison, because he is the high risk, high upside guy. He is fresh dynamic and much lower cost. So it could be more easliy sold. And if need be changed sooner if it doesn't work out.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 4:05 pm to loopy
quote:
They could have him tomorrow if they wanted him. The fact that he isn't already announced is clear indication that he is not a real candidate. His connection to Mary Sue Coleman who hired him when both were at Iowa, is what is fueling the specualtion.
First off they could not have him tomorrow if they wanted. What facts do you have of that? Michigan has said he was a candidate, it wasnt the other way around. Ferentz has said he is happy at Iowa. If he changes his mind, he changes his mind. But there has been NO CONCRETE evidence that he has. There has only been SPECULATION because MICHIGAN says they are interested in him. Its not always vice versa.
Mary Sue Coleman was the President at Iowa when Kirk Ferentz was hired BY BOB BOWLSBY the athletic director at Iowa at the time. Mary Sue Coleman does like Kirk there is no doubt as does Lloyd but I would be surprised if Kirk is even remotely interested in the job. IMHO I think Kirk woudl listen out of respect for MSC and Lloyd but that is about it. Perhaps I am wrong but I doubt it.
IMO you would be nuts to want Michigan right now. Whoever gets that job is in for a world of trouble.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 4:10 pm to TheEdge
Then, the analysis is even more pertinent. Why NEB? The heart wants what the heart wants. There is not always logic to it.
Meyer has to think that if Mich makes another solid hire (Ferentz, Grobe, Pinkel) the job is gone for 8-10 years (again, I am assuming there is some affinity he has for Mich other than $$'s). If it is Chris Petersen, it could be available sooner, or never (if he is a hit, he could lock it up for decades). Again assuming Meyer has some other driving force, this might be his one shot. Les seemed to think that way (for other reasons, like his age).
Meyer has to think that if Mich makes another solid hire (Ferentz, Grobe, Pinkel) the job is gone for 8-10 years (again, I am assuming there is some affinity he has for Mich other than $$'s). If it is Chris Petersen, it could be available sooner, or never (if he is a hit, he could lock it up for decades). Again assuming Meyer has some other driving force, this might be his one shot. Les seemed to think that way (for other reasons, like his age).
Posted on 12/5/07 at 4:16 pm to IA*ARES*IA
Then you are not aware that Kirk and Bo struck up quite a good friendship while Bo was still alive. And that counts for a lot with Board of Regents at Michigan. No one is hired at any public university without the OK of the Pres and the Board of Regents/Supervisors. Yes AD's hire the guy, but they have to sell him to their bosses.
I am not suggesting that Mich wants him or that he wants Mich. Has Bill Martin contacted anyone at Iowa about KF. NO! And he is the only one that counts. Rumors, postings, media, they aren't driving the search or making the candidate list.
I don't think KF is even going to be talked to.
I am not suggesting that Mich wants him or that he wants Mich. Has Bill Martin contacted anyone at Iowa about KF. NO! And he is the only one that counts. Rumors, postings, media, they aren't driving the search or making the candidate list.
I don't think KF is even going to be talked to.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 4:18 pm to belowpar
quote:
They want to get the right guy
They had the right guy and he sailed away.
quote:
First off they could not have him tomorrow if they wanted. What facts do you have of that? Michigan has said he was a candidate, it wasnt the other way around. Ferentz has said he is happy at Iowa. If he changes his mind, he changes his mind. But there has been NO CONCRETE evidence that he has. There has only been SPECULATION because MICHIGAN says they are interested in him. Its not always vice versa.
Do us a favor and please keep Ferentz.
This post was edited on 12/5/07 at 4:27 pm
Posted on 12/5/07 at 4:56 pm to MichiganMan
quote:
Do us a favor and please keep Ferentz.
I know a few fans of the Big Ten that are absolutely thrilled at the prospect of Michigan hiring Ferentz. One cheers for Penn State, the other for OSU.
That about sums up that hire, in my opinion.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 5:45 pm to RuLSU
quote:
I know a few fans of the Big Ten that are absolutely thrilled at the prospect of Michigan hiring Ferentz. One cheers for Penn State, the other for OSU.
Herbstreit said he is one of the best coaches in the country. Like I needed another reason to hate Ferentz to Michigan.
Posted on 12/5/07 at 11:52 pm to Aged Woverine
I heard today that many of Kelly's recruits have had some serious character issues, and that Michigan's scared that he might do the same there! Crap, when you're coaching CMU...and the Nati...and you want to win???
Besides, Michigan men aren't always great (morally speaking):
LINK
HA! We actually passed on this kid. He's from Louisiana...no offer from Da Tigahs!
Besides, Michigan men aren't always great (morally speaking):
LINK
HA! We actually passed on this kid. He's from Louisiana...no offer from Da Tigahs!
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