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Started By
Message
Where will Torres fit in
Posted on 9/6/11 at 8:54 pm
Posted on 9/6/11 at 8:54 pm
when we have Holden, Bradley, Jones, etc, all ready (assuming they'll all be healthy at the same time obviously).
He was the brightest spot today. He was very, very good. I don't even know why people are so upset about the performance actually. It wasn't an easy spot, and there were a couple of real good performances, Torres, and Shea at times.
Could a Holden-Torres partnership work at times? I know some will dismiss it out of hand (and I'm not sure it would work either) as being too lightweight but really, where is the "steel" in a central midfield partnership of Anderson and Tom Cleverly? Its a bit of an overrated concept IMO. And Holden is probably our best tackling central midfielder anyway. What would worry me most about that is positional discipline, i.e. would they both get forward too much at the same time? But you could say the same thing about Holden and Bradley as they both like to be box to box midfielders.
On another note, Beckerman deserves to be a permanent squad player the way he's playing. He looked good again today. I didn't think Edu was that bad before the 80th minute or so when he started shitting all over himself, but I think at this point Beckerman should be above him in the pecking order.
He was the brightest spot today. He was very, very good. I don't even know why people are so upset about the performance actually. It wasn't an easy spot, and there were a couple of real good performances, Torres, and Shea at times.
Could a Holden-Torres partnership work at times? I know some will dismiss it out of hand (and I'm not sure it would work either) as being too lightweight but really, where is the "steel" in a central midfield partnership of Anderson and Tom Cleverly? Its a bit of an overrated concept IMO. And Holden is probably our best tackling central midfielder anyway. What would worry me most about that is positional discipline, i.e. would they both get forward too much at the same time? But you could say the same thing about Holden and Bradley as they both like to be box to box midfielders.
On another note, Beckerman deserves to be a permanent squad player the way he's playing. He looked good again today. I didn't think Edu was that bad before the 80th minute or so when he started shitting all over himself, but I think at this point Beckerman should be above him in the pecking order.
This post was edited on 9/6/11 at 8:55 pm
5
Posted on 9/6/11 at 8:56 pm to Crede15
Torres has actually gotten much better as a tackler as well. He's done really well under Klinsmann, he's playing with much more confidence and isn't scared to make a mistake. I think Torres and Holden should be tried out as well.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 8:58 pm to Crede15
I though Torres was great as well. We just have to offensive flair minus Shea on the left.
I hate to say it but Altidore today just wasn't that good. The only thing he could do was hold it up when we kicked it long. There were few runs. We improved a little when Agudelo came on though
I hate to say it but Altidore today just wasn't that good. The only thing he could do was hold it up when we kicked it long. There were few runs. We improved a little when Agudelo came on though
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:20 pm to tsmi136
quote:
I hate to say it but Altidore today just wasn't that good
Jozy needs a running mate. He isn't a lone striker and these half arse "forwards" that we have been putting out is all kinds of fail. I really want to see him and Juan. Juan has enough pace to be the lightning to Jozy's thunder. But shite, I don't really know soccer better than Jurgy so I'll bow to his beliefs.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:24 pm to Bho
quote:
M Jose Torres, 4 -- No one can say Torres isn't getting his chances under the new coach after making a third consecutive start Tuesday. Some good technical minutes are nice and all, but he still isn't making enough happen in the final third. (Stop us if you've heard this before.) Even when given the freedom after intermission to play a more advanced position, Torres passively preferring to orchestrate from more recessed areas. Sometimes that's OK, but eventually more aggressive action is required. For instance, a few more dashes into doggone 18 wouldn't hurt! Elsewhere, his size and strength remain an ongoing issue, one that becomes more obvious against the bigger, European teams. The guy looks like a garden hose in a room full of fire hoses, and he gets knocked around like a ragamuffin in most physical confrontations. Finally, as a central midfielder, his flawed defensive angles of pursuit fail him time and again.
LINK
I disagree with the 4 rating (everybody was about a 3 for me, except for Howard
), but agree with the sentiment. He did a lot, without really doing anything.... if that makes sense.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:26 pm to Sheep
Jose Torres isn't an attacking midfielder. Giving him a poor rating for not going into the 18 is pretty dumb. I'm going to give Howard a 2 for his career because he doesn't score enough.
giving Rogers and Torres the same grade is some of the dumbest shite I've ever seen.
giving Rogers and Torres the same grade is some of the dumbest shite I've ever seen.
This post was edited on 9/6/11 at 9:29 pm
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:30 pm to hendersonshands
quote:
giving Rogers and Torres the same grade is some of the dumbest shite I've ever seen.
I agree with that.
I think his point is that Torres doesn't offer enough to be a #10.
Of course, Holden is probably the closest thing we have to a #10.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:35 pm to Sheep
Torres plays a more reserved role because he's a holding midfielder. You can't just expect players to be something they aren't and then get pissed when they don't live up to the expectations. He played well today and I think his tackling has gotten considerably better. We don't have a 10, Landon has to be the de facto 10.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:37 pm to Sheep
Dear God, that's an awful evaluation. He didn't get knocked around, he played very well in tight spaces, repeatedly getting us out of trouble when Belgium were pressuring him. If only he were bigger and gave up the ball consistently we would really have something.
He's not a playmaker in the hole type guy. He's a central midfielder. We don't have a true number ten. Holden isn't that guy either.
He played very well. And I wasn't one of the screeching Torres fanboys after the Turkey game. I've waited till now to overrate him.
He's not a playmaker in the hole type guy. He's a central midfielder. We don't have a true number ten. Holden isn't that guy either.
He played very well. And I wasn't one of the screeching Torres fanboys after the Turkey game. I've waited till now to overrate him.
This post was edited on 9/6/11 at 9:38 pm
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:43 pm to Crede15
quote:
Clarence Goodson
quote:
Usually precise on the pass
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:48 pm to Sheep
If we play 3 mids, Baby Bradley should be ahead of Edu. For me Bradley's engine gives him a better chance of holding the midfield by himself. His discipline is much better, he's good in the tackle, and hopefully he can understand the necessary positioning.
A problem I've noticied today and in other games is how poor our midfield works as a unit. It's something we have struggled with for some time. I'd like that spacing issue to be worked, as in transition going both ways we look disjointed.
A problem I've noticied today and in other games is how poor our midfield works as a unit. It's something we have struggled with for some time. I'd like that spacing issue to be worked, as in transition going both ways we look disjointed.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:49 pm to Wario Balotelli
There's little connection between our back line and front line.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:53 pm to tsmi136
Our center backs' ball skills are lacking. Its a problem and not a new one. It hurts us possession wise especially when we're dealing with a team that presses high up the pitch (Mexico).
Tim Ream can do it to some extent but he's not our best defensive option there.
Tim Ream can do it to some extent but he's not our best defensive option there.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 9:55 pm to Crede15
quote:
He's not a playmaker in the hole type guy. He's a central midfielder. We don't have a true number ten. Holden isn't that guy either.
He played very well. And I wasn't one of the screeching Torres fanboys after the Turkey game. I've waited till now to overrate him.
The thing is, that's where he's being played.
He's being asked to be a #10, but not creating much. He's providing a lot of industry, but not much else.
Don't know if that's a product of him, the role he's in (currently), or the players around him.
ETA: The author clearly has a hard-on for Torres. He rated him lower than LOLrentowicz.
This post was edited on 9/6/11 at 10:00 pm
Posted on 9/6/11 at 10:08 pm to Sheep
I think he's a creative player for us but more in the deep lying playmaker/holding midfielder role than a true advanced playmaker/number 10.
I'm still in favor of a 4-2-3-1 type formation. Jozy may not be a prototypical lone striker but he can do it and he's playing as one in Holland. Not to mention the strength of our team appears to be the three attacking midfielders (assuming we can get them all on the field at the same time) in Shea on the left and Donovan and Dempsey rotating between playing as the central attacking mid and on the right.
Behind Jozy and those three you have some selection questions: Bradley, Jones, Holden when available, Torres, Beckerman, Klejstan, Edu. I see it as two spots being available so its just a question of who those two are.
I'm still in favor of a 4-2-3-1 type formation. Jozy may not be a prototypical lone striker but he can do it and he's playing as one in Holland. Not to mention the strength of our team appears to be the three attacking midfielders (assuming we can get them all on the field at the same time) in Shea on the left and Donovan and Dempsey rotating between playing as the central attacking mid and on the right.
Behind Jozy and those three you have some selection questions: Bradley, Jones, Holden when available, Torres, Beckerman, Klejstan, Edu. I see it as two spots being available so its just a question of who those two are.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 10:16 pm to Crede15
There's some versatility there. Demps could play up top if Jozy or Juan were injured. Holden or Torres could move to a more advanced central role if needed, even though I don't think they're number ten type attacking central midfielders. I wouldn't be against Beasley being Shea's main cover at left wing. And Bedoya could play on the right if Dempsey moved up top.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 10:32 pm to Crede15
I don't think he does. Actually, I don't think any of our midfielders, with the possible exceptions of Holden and Dempsey, fit into Jurgy's plans.
I'm starting to think that Jurgy's wants a squad that produces goals in the midfield and relies on a lone, poaching striker up top.
At this point in time, we don't have the players for this system. Jozy is not a lone striker, and our midfield can't do it for 90 minutes.
I propose that we swap managers with Scotland. Craig Levein suits our players better than Jurgy, and Jurgy suits Scotland better than Levein (Commons, Fletcher, Naismith, Miller, etc.).
I'm starting to think that Jurgy's wants a squad that produces goals in the midfield and relies on a lone, poaching striker up top.
At this point in time, we don't have the players for this system. Jozy is not a lone striker, and our midfield can't do it for 90 minutes.
I propose that we swap managers with Scotland. Craig Levein suits our players better than Jurgy, and Jurgy suits Scotland better than Levein (Commons, Fletcher, Naismith, Miller, etc.).
Posted on 9/6/11 at 11:47 pm to TN Bhoy
quote:
I'm starting to think that Jurgy's wants a squad that produces goals in the midfield and relies on a lone, poaching striker up top.
We don't have a Gotze or Ozil and probably never will in the foreseeable future. The result today in the long run isn't a problem. Jurgy is building to WC qualifying(duh)and that is all that matters. We will see infinite combinations and formations. Hopefully one maximizes our squads abilities.
Posted on 9/6/11 at 11:50 pm to Bho
quote:
I really want to see him and Juan. Juan has enough pace to be the lightning to Jozy's thunder
I know everyone else kind of glossed over this, but I totally agree. Let agudelo fetch the ball high and allow jozy to get in to deeper position without having to receive the ball near the sideline.
With our wealth of midfielders and the way Shea is being utilized by dallas, I would not be surprised if he comes in as a sub some more in the future.
I'm not going to say jurgens' system doesn't fit our players just yet. I think the man is trying to mesh his tactics with the talent pool and it is going to take some time
Posted on 9/6/11 at 11:58 pm to americanoutlaw
Rogers was a fluke, he just doesn't play with quick enough speed of play. I liked our back line today
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