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Complete Newb Questions
Posted on 2/28/13 at 1:12 pm
Posted on 2/28/13 at 1:12 pm
Alright, I'm trying to figure out some things about the EPL and European soccer in general. I've been reading a shite ton about the EPL and the English system and it's fascinating. There are a few questions I have, though. Hopefully you guys can help me out here.
Why do they use the term "fixtures" instead of "matches," which I've seen elsewhere for soccer? Irrelevant, I know, but I'm just curious.
How does the prestige of the titles breakdown? Is it Champions League, EPL, Europa, FA, in that order?
How likely is it that one of the, say, fifth level teams ever work its way up to the EPL?
Does the EPL have the largest collection of both top quality talent and top quality teams in Europe?
I may have more, but that's it for now.
Thanks in advance. This shite is complicated.
Why do they use the term "fixtures" instead of "matches," which I've seen elsewhere for soccer? Irrelevant, I know, but I'm just curious.
How does the prestige of the titles breakdown? Is it Champions League, EPL, Europa, FA, in that order?
How likely is it that one of the, say, fifth level teams ever work its way up to the EPL?
Does the EPL have the largest collection of both top quality talent and top quality teams in Europe?
I may have more, but that's it for now.
Thanks in advance. This shite is complicated.
6
Posted on 2/28/13 at 1:25 pm to Homespun
quote:
Why do they use the term "fixtures" instead of "matches," which I've seen elsewhere for soccer? Irrelevant, I know, but I'm just curious.
Just British terminology. They don't use the word "schedule" like we do.
Fixture List = Schedule
Matches = Fixture = Games
quote:
How does the prestige of the titles breakdown? Is it Champions League, EPL, Europa, FA, in that order?
I'd have it at...
Champions League
EPL
FA
Europa
Capital One Cup
...for English teams. You'll get a debate over FA vs. Europa in terms of prestige.
quote:
How likely is it that one of the, say, fifth level teams ever work its way up to the EPL?
Very unlikely. Teams have fallen from the top all the way down to that level (Luton Town comes to mind), and it's usually because of some financial issues.
That being said, a few League One and Two sides have made it to the Premier League. Southampton hit back-to-back promotions to get up there this season.
It's just really hard to make the jump from non-League (fifth level and below) back to the top, especially with today's big money game.
quote:
Does the EPL have the largest collection of both top quality talent and top quality teams in Europe?
And...here...we...go.
It's a raging debate. The Premier League has been down this year (United is running away with the title, not a very good showing in the Champions League from Chelsea/City, and the remaining two teams might be on their way out next week).
The Premier League has more top clubs than other leagues, but it can be argued that the strength of the fewer top clubs in other leagues makes them equal.
For example: Man United, Man City, Chelsea, Arsenal, Tottenham and Liverpool are historically/currently huge clubs. (Tottenham is kind of a wild card, I guess.)
Compare the Big Six to say, Barcelona and Real Madrid in La Liga. (Atletico closing in and Malaga was before the financial hit.) Barcelona and Real Madrid are two of the top three clubs all-time. Which is the more powerful league? Tough to say, and it's all cyclical.
The Premier League pulls the best talent from all over the world, but the top teams in La Liga, Bundesliga, and Serie A do the same.
League comparisons turn into nasty things on this board, so I'll leave it at that.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 1:35 pm to WarSlamEagle
quote:
League comparisons turn into nasty things on this board, so I'll leave it at that.
I got in an IM battle with my friend this week over whether La Liga or Bundesliga was the #2 league.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 1:36 pm to DEANintheYAY
hopefully you were taking the germans.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 1:39 pm to Homespun
quote:
Does the EPL have the largest collection of both top quality talent and top quality teams in Europe?
It changes frequently and depends on the year. IMO this year absolutely not and it isn't even close. A good measuring stick is to look at how many teams from each league make up the Champions League Round of 16.
This year you can make a strong argument for the Bundesliga since 3 teams made it, and 2 of those 3 won their groups (Bayern Munich, Borussia Dortmund). Manchester City, last year's BPL title holders finished dead last in their group (won by Dortmund). Chelsea, also from the BPL and the 2012 Champions League winners also didn't make it out of their group.
Best league vs best team are always two different arguments. And yeah, it gets pretty crazy on here debating as such.
Hala Madrid
Posted on 2/28/13 at 1:44 pm to WarSlamEagle
Thanks, man. Great info. I appreciate it.
I was definitely not trying to start anything about the strength of the various leagues. I didn't know if the answer was obvious, but it appears that it's debatable.
One of the things that seems hardest to figure out is the scheduling of all the various titles/cups. It seems like a nightmare to have to orchestrate. Do teams routinely (or ever) sit their best players for one game that is part of a less prestigious tournament/cup to rest them for an upcoming game in a more prestigious tournament/cup? If so, do fans bitch about that or is it simply a typical strategy for an EPL team?
I was definitely not trying to start anything about the strength of the various leagues. I didn't know if the answer was obvious, but it appears that it's debatable.
One of the things that seems hardest to figure out is the scheduling of all the various titles/cups. It seems like a nightmare to have to orchestrate. Do teams routinely (or ever) sit their best players for one game that is part of a less prestigious tournament/cup to rest them for an upcoming game in a more prestigious tournament/cup? If so, do fans bitch about that or is it simply a typical strategy for an EPL team?
Posted on 2/28/13 at 1:51 pm to PurpGold 14-0
Not to nitpick, but schalke also won their group and if for a good time you want to throw in Europa league, the bundesliga ha 7/7 teams advance to knockout stages
But I don't debate what is the strongest league. I think it's kind of arbitrary and uppity, bc after all it just desolves into people choosing the league they watch most often. I know we soccer boarders are all hipsters, but it ends up sounding rather silly to proclaim "the overall, top-to-bottom strength of the foreign soccer league I watch every weekend is stronger than that foreign league you choose to watch bc it has your favorite team." The top 4-5 leagues all have lots of quality, the next 4-5 have just a little less, etc etc
But I don't debate what is the strongest league. I think it's kind of arbitrary and uppity, bc after all it just desolves into people choosing the league they watch most often. I know we soccer boarders are all hipsters, but it ends up sounding rather silly to proclaim "the overall, top-to-bottom strength of the foreign soccer league I watch every weekend is stronger than that foreign league you choose to watch bc it has your favorite team." The top 4-5 leagues all have lots of quality, the next 4-5 have just a little less, etc etc
Posted on 2/28/13 at 1:59 pm to Tweezy
Nobody cares about Europa except the Germans.
City and united both bowed out last year to focus in the league, Napoli did the same this year.
City and united both bowed out last year to focus in the league, Napoli did the same this year.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 2:04 pm to Tweezy
Thanks for the info. And thanks, Purple and Gold.
How about I rephrase the question. What are the top five leagues in Europe(or six or seven if that make it less controversial)?
How about I rephrase the question. What are the top five leagues in Europe(or six or seven if that make it less controversial
)? 
Posted on 2/28/13 at 2:04 pm to Homespun
quote:
How likely is it that one of the, say, fifth level teams ever work its way up to the EPL?
As War said, not very likely, but Swansea City avoided relegation to the 5th division on the last day of the season 10 years ago, and are now a top 10 side in the EPL and just won the League/Capital One Cup. Southampton doing the back to back promotion was pretty big as well.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 2:06 pm to Homespun
quote:
Do teams routinely (or ever) sit their best players for one game that is part of a less prestigious tournament/cup to rest them for an upcoming game in a more prestigious tournament/cup?
Simply, yes. If a big team (say ManU) draws a small League 2 side in the FA Cup, they will usually sit a lot of the big names in order to 1) rest them for upcoming league play, champions league, etc games and 2) give the normal subs some starts and quality minutes.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 2:06 pm to Homespun
I'll throw in some completely debatable and downright insulting (to some) comparisons...
Champions League is the BCS, the NCAA Tournament; Europa is the NIT.
Premier League is the SEC,
La Liga is the Pac12,
Bundesliga is the B1G,
Serie A is the Big 12.
Champions League is the BCS, the NCAA Tournament; Europa is the NIT.
Premier League is the SEC,
La Liga is the Pac12,
Bundesliga is the B1G,
Serie A is the Big 12.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 2:10 pm to Homespun
quote:
What are the top five leagues in Europe(or six or seven if that make it less controversial )?
EPL
La Liga (Spain)
Bundesliga (Germany)
Serie A (Italy)
Ligue 1 (France)
Posted on 2/28/13 at 2:13 pm to etm512
Swansea came from the fourth division to the Premier League and they just own the FA cup
Posted on 2/28/13 at 2:18 pm to j1897
The Germans don't care about Europa bro. No one cares about Europa, if anyone does it would be Spain since they've dominated it recently.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 2:19 pm to GABlueDog
quote:
Premier League is the SEC
the Premier League should do a lot better than winning 3 out of the last 8 Champions League's Finals to be called the SEC since no one cares who loses the BCS title game. Barca has won the same amount in that time frame. Perhaps a more accurate assessment would be Premier League = SEC East (UF, UGA, USC = Man United, Man City, Arsenal/Spurs) and La Liga = SEC West (Bama, LSU = Barca, Real Madrid). However, this year the Bundesliga is by far the top league.
See? This is what were talking about Homespun
Posted on 2/28/13 at 2:25 pm to PurpGold 14-0
quote:
See? This is what were talking about Homespun
ha ha. I had no idea what I was opening up. I am huge college football fan, but this EPL and other European soccer has me so intrigued. I played soccer growing up, played in high school, etc. and have watched the World Cup since 1994. I'm just now starting to get into this and the amount of nuances and intricacies are staggering and seemingly never ending.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 3:15 pm to etm512
Reading ascended up from the 4th tier not long ago and finished in 7th place their first season in the EPL under Steve Coppell (they since have gone down and come back up). I believe Marcus Hahnemman (American GK) played in all 4 divisions with them. Bobby convey was vital to the team the year they won the Championship as well.
Posted on 2/28/13 at 4:05 pm to BobLoblaw
Here's the full college basketball comparison again:
Premier League = Conference Play
Champions League = NCAA Tournament
FA Cup = Conference Tournament
Europa League = NIT
Carling Cup = Maui Invitational
Premier League = Conference Play
Champions League = NCAA Tournament
FA Cup = Conference Tournament
Europa League = NIT
Carling Cup = Maui Invitational
Posted on 2/28/13 at 4:29 pm to Atom-Z
quote:
Swansea came from the fourth division to the Premier League and they just own the FA cup
No they didn't.
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