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re: Am I the only person who sees that Spain....

Posted on 7/5/10 at 9:25 am to
Posted by ohiovol
Member since Jan 2010
21044 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 9:25 am to
quote:

I think what it is, is Villa and Torres cannot play on the field at the same time

They've played very well together before. Torres assisted Villa a few times before Villa's injury in Euro 2008, IIRC. They played well in 2006 before they were eliminated, too. In my opinion, the problem is their style doesn't really suit Torres' speed, not to mention he's been hurt.
This post was edited on 7/5/10 at 9:32 am
Posted by ohiovol
Member since Jan 2010
21044 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 9:28 am to
quote:

Gorilla, stop while you're slightly behind, every comment rapes whatever semblance of footballing credibility you felt you had.


I haven't looked up any stats like that, but is he wrong? In any case, Germany has been 10 times as interesting to watch as Spain. Doesn't mean they'll win for sure, but they've been fun.
This post was edited on 7/5/10 at 9:29 am
Posted by GeauxDT
Baton Rouge
Member since Jan 2009
3654 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 9:43 am to
quote:

what do you do then, bench one of the best strikers in the world?


Yes. Torres obviously is not 100% physically OR mentally and seems to get frustrated pretty easily. There is no reason to force putting him on the field, ESPECIALLY with David Villa playing out of his frickin mind right now.

quote:

those are 2 guys you just have to put on the field because they can change the game at any moment.


Again, they may be 2 of the best players individually on the team, but there is no reason to try and force a partnership between them, especially this late in the WC...

Bench Torres, throw Fabregas into the starting 11 and run a 4-5-1. Spain will possess the frick out of the ball, wait for the young Germans to have a quick lapse in concentration/get anxious, and slip a nice ball in to Villa for a quick strike or force a rash challenge for a dangerous FK.

Spain's back line >>>>>>>> Argentina's back line so Germany shouldn't get as many chances or open looks, and IMO what killed the Argentinians was the lack of the midfield connection from the backs to the forwards. It always seemed like direct long ball play from the outside backs to the frontmen, who were then just beaten in the air. Messi sometimes had to go into his own half to get the ball from Demichellis/Heinze just to try and make something happen. A midfield combination of Xavi, Alonso, Iniesta, AND Fabregas will be able to successfully connect Puyol/Pique to Villa and be much more threatening than Argentina was.
Posted by WelcomeToDeathValley
1st & 1st
Member since Aug 2006
16947 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 10:04 am to
quote:

Again, they may be 2 of the best players individually on the team, but there is no reason to try and force a partnership between them, especially this late in the WC...


They could play Fabregas without benching Torres, its not like sitting him is the only way Cesc can be on the field. They like having the option to bring Fabregas, Pedro, Llorente etc. off the bench. Fabregas is not going to play 90 minutes no matter what you do. I dont think Spain is so worried about Germany where they are going to change their formation and personnel that has been successful.

Torres has not looked good though, its just big time controversy if he doesnt start or play 70 minutes. Spain loses with that move and its shite storm city. Also would you want to be the coach who tells your star that hes benched in the semis of the World Cup? They should use Pedro and Fabregas as they did last game, just bring them on a little earlier. I really do see your logic, im just being realistic about whats really going to happen.
This post was edited on 7/5/10 at 10:08 am
Posted by lsugorilla
PNW
Member since Sep 2009
6700 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 10:12 am to
quote:

germany's passing accuracy of 91.54% is the best of the tournament so far


dandy lion welcome back. where have you been.

i would never claim germany has the prettist football when we dominated back in the 70's but we won, which i consider more important. but i would never try to argue that a team was not playing prettier football than them just because i didn't like them. i liked the spain od the last euro, but this team is not at that same level, they barely made it to the quarters
This post was edited on 7/5/10 at 10:15 am
Posted by Dandy Lion
Member since Feb 2010
51403 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 11:49 am to
thx gorilla! at the beach, didn't take the laptop nor a mobile phone.

My comment concerns the fact that the defensive posture of each side which has played them (except for Chile and Portugal in the 2nd half) does not afford the football which Spain was famous for prior to the Confed Cup.

You can't demand free flowing heaving towards the final third all match if there is a wall there.

Common sense IMHO.


ETA If Germany plays like everyone seems to think they will, then there will be space.
I doubt it, highly doubt it.
This post was edited on 7/5/10 at 11:51 am
Posted by hendersonshands
Univ. of Louisiana Ragin Cajuns
Member since Oct 2007
160203 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 12:08 pm to
Germany is going to absorb pressure then hit Spain on the counter. The thing that makes Germany's counter so good is that their wingers are willing to track back and play defense after the counter.
Posted by Dandy Lion
Member since Feb 2010
51403 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 12:12 pm to
quote:

Germany is going to absorb pressure then hit Spain on the counter. The thing that makes Germany's counter so good is that their wingers are willing to track back and play defense after the counter.
I agree, but they have yet to play a side with a decent midfield (they also saw teams with NO midfield), and Spain's is a bit better than decent.
This post was edited on 7/5/10 at 12:15 pm
Posted by hendersonshands
Univ. of Louisiana Ragin Cajuns
Member since Oct 2007
160203 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 12:15 pm to
England's midfield isn't bad going forward, they just suck tracking back. Argentina has good players but they ruined spacing for each other. Spain has a tendency to cut down on spacing for their teammates, Xavi is great but he negates spacing so much sometimes when he dribbles toward a teammate to make a 5 yard pass. If Spain doesn't use the spacing to their advantage, Schweinsteiger and Khedira will be able to break everything up before it even gets to Mertesacker and Friedrich.
Posted by JEAUXBLEAUX
Bayonne, NJ
Member since May 2006
55375 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 12:18 pm to
Germany's midfield seems to be there to support and service the Strikers. Xavi seems to think he's there as a one man team sometimes. and I always liked and respected him
Posted by Dandy Lion
Member since Feb 2010
51403 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 12:22 pm to
quote:

If Spain doesn't use the spacing to their advantage,
This is the problem, and it will be dicey going in the match. If Spain scores first they've got a chance. If not, let's hope Germany scores really early, so Del Bosque pulls Torres then, and not in minute 65.

Spain sorely misses Senna. He was the linchpin which made the impossible possible (you can't have Iniesta drifting where he pleases, Xavi trying to accomodate himself to his runs, which is damn difficult because Xavi does not possess the athletic prowess necessary to obey his uncanny vision, Busquets goes wherever to flop-block/block-flop, Alonso is not a great defender, etc...). He also had great criteria on the ball and shot as well as Alonso from long range.
This post was edited on 7/5/10 at 12:28 pm
Posted by hendersonshands
Univ. of Louisiana Ragin Cajuns
Member since Oct 2007
160203 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 12:27 pm to
That's one of the things I was saying I didn't like about Spain, apparently he was out of form but I like him much more than Busquets.

I think Germany is going to try to exploit Capdevilla and Ramos to lure out Pique/Puyol giving space for Klose to run through.
Posted by lsugorilla
PNW
Member since Sep 2009
6700 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 1:01 pm to
i just hope to see spain of '08 and germany 2010, so i can finally see a game with 2 good teams on the field at the same time.
Posted by geauxaddai
Chicago, IL
Member since Jan 2008
2864 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 1:04 pm to
quote:

A midfield combination of Xavi, Alonso, Iniesta, AND Fabregas will be able to successfully connect Puyol/Pique to Villa and be much more threatening than Argentina was.



I think the other thing that was in play with Argentina was that their back 4 did not have the speed to match up with Muller, Ozil, Podolski, and Klose. Bastian Schweinsteiger was faster than them for crying out loud! I think they will find it harder to counter attack if anything, Spain's mid-fielders are all defensive stalwarts who cover a lot of ground, to go with their pin point precision passing, and speed.

In my opinion, the mid-field and defense favors Spain while Germany has the better strikers.
Posted by Dandy Lion
Member since Feb 2010
51403 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 1:05 pm to
quote:

lsugorilla
That would be a "crackah" of a match. But this Spain of 2010 is missing the glue of 2008 (Mr. Marcos Senna).

ETA and playing with 10 players untill the 65th minute!

ETA2 and feeding the ball to the hole where that 11th player should be
This post was edited on 7/5/10 at 1:09 pm
Posted by lsugorilla
PNW
Member since Sep 2009
6700 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 1:09 pm to
quote:

at the beach


nice to know someone that has a life and doesn't post from their vacation


mundaka?



This post was edited on 7/5/10 at 1:13 pm
Posted by Dandy Lion
Member since Feb 2010
51403 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 1:10 pm to
Comillas
Posted by lsugorilla
PNW
Member since Sep 2009
6700 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 1:14 pm to
nice a lot of history in the Cantabria. i'm sure the sights at the beach are nice also
Posted by crazy4lsu
Member since May 2005
39820 posts
Posted on 7/5/10 at 1:17 pm to
Spain has too many of the same type of players. There is no reason to field Xavi, Alonso, Iniesta and Fabregas on the field at the same time. They need more natural width, either from Navas, Mata, or the full-backs.

They need to go back to the 4-1-4-1 that was so successful in the semifinal and final of the Euro.
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