re: Without God, are all men truly equal?

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its one of the most evil things i can imagine.

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if you think providing nice things to poor people while teaching them a relatively positive religious morality is "oen of the most evil things you can imagine", you need to expand your imagination

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When did I mention atheism? I just asked him/her a question.

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You didn't need to.

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if you think providing nice things to poor people while teaching them a relatively positive religious morality

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1 - if the goal is to help someone in need, and you claim to be a good person, why not just help them? why do they owe you something?

2 - what if Muslims were doing the exact same thing? would you still think it was positive then, or would you think they were trying to take over the world?

3 - "a relatively positive religious morality" according to who? to you? do you mean like this...

"'God Loves Uganda' explores the role of the American evangelical movement in Uganda, where American missionaries have been credited with creating schools and hospitals, but also blamed for promoting dangerous religious bigotry. For many American evangelicals, Uganda is fertile territory to spread their interpretation of the Bible. But their proselytizing may have more nefarious results than they realize, as the missionaries’ teachings about homosexuality becomes part of a culture of intolerance and hatred towards Uganda’s LGBT community."

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ah yes. another good and kind christian. But I say unto you which hear, Love your enemies, do good to them which hate you, Bless them that curse you, and pray for them which despitefully use you. Luke 6: 27-28 But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be children of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. Luke 6:35 so you read the words of jesus there and took it to mean, "lend no REAL love and mercy...receive none." is that right? this is YOUR god, right? and YOUR faith?

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Don't quite understand your line of reasoning there, MS; but I'll do what you do...offer an opinion not based on somebody else's words...but on my personal feeling re what is good and true.

Living a life filled with Love, is a good life. At least for me. Of course all people have differing values, goals and abilities. I seek to perfect my own character, and ability to appreciate ALL of Life because I believe that Life is the result of an all powerful and loving Conscious Energy. I also realize that I exist in a Universe of free-willed and limited (imperfect) Beings; choosing, reacting to their own choices (impulse, belief and action) and those of their peers. And Natural forces as well, according to Scientific Natural Law.

There is an Ideal; according to one's values. One perceives the Ideal...and strives toward it. One does not become a REAL manifestation of said Ideal, simply upon realizing it. Therein, irl...one's actions and beliefs are relatively...imperfect; and could be perceived by demagogic detractors or relatively ignorant critics (for whatever reason) as being...'fake'. And truly, there are many fakers who are so based on their personal inclinations...of the which I am unable and disinterested in knowing or judging. It's their baby...they rock it. You'd love M. Scott Peck's "People of the Lie". So would Jesus.

I simply believe that we do the best we can to form our Perceptive Reality (Character), and we "walk to the level that we have attained". No more...no less. "To whom much is given..." (you know the drill).

Re "good and kind"...I'm no Mother Teresa. I'm hardcore. But I'll hit the ditch dodging a turtle in the road...because I RESPECT All of Life. And that respect is based on the Principle that Life (Total Energy/Consciousness) both created and loves...your's truly. As it does all. For to not do so, would be the less profitable of the Two Choices. Love...and it's Opposite. No rocket science there. I do believe that minus that Love (Belief)...one progresses toward intellectural cynicism, and the opposite of Love...in due time. There is no where else to go...and Mother Nature (Darwinian Law) wins that battle; because that is all that exist in the 'real' Natural (un-godly) World.

We could banter for days. I only argue...for the Record; nothing personal to me, and no interest in a personalized battle with those who choose the Godless Paradigm. I respect theirs, and even the *Devil's* principled choice...just not my cup of tea. I prefer and choose Love. I defend the Idea of God, Faith and Truth, only for those to whom Faith is a viable option.

Later.

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if the goal is to help someone in need, and you claim to be a good person, why not just help them? why do they owe you something?

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i agree, but that selfishness isn't close to being evil, let alone "the most evil thing i cam imagine"

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2 - what if Muslims were doing the exact same thing?

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they do the same shite.

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would you still think it was positive

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well the message of Christianity is better than the message of Islam, so that comes into play. however, it doesn't move the needle much for me either way (unless we're talking about some super extreme madras)

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3 - "a relatively positive religious morality" according to who? to you?

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yes, obviously

Jesus had a good moral message. i don't think it's compatible with government and building an economy, but it's a good overall message with lots of overlap with the best parts of all sorts of other religions. love your neighbor as yourself. turn the other cheek. be charitable and don't obsess over wealth. these are core messages of Jesus and they're very good things

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"'God Loves Uganda' explores the role of the American evangelical movement in Uganda, where American missionaries have been credited with creating schools and hospitals, but also blamed for promoting dangerous religious bigotry. For many American evangelicals, Uganda is fertile territory to spread their interpretation of the Bible. But their proselytizing may have more nefarious results than they realize, as the missionaries’ teachings about homosexuality becomes part of a culture of intolerance and hatred towards Uganda’s LGBT community."

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this supposition that Christianity is the cause of anti-LGBT beliefs in SSA is laughable

the reason the idea is fertile in Uganda is that Uganda already hated LGBT people

now do i think this is a perverted view of Christianity? yes, but i can't control warped views. just like my comment above about the extreme Islamic madaras, i don't think that is good. however, being "not good" is a LONG ways away from "the most evil thing i can imagine" (which becomes even more extreme in the context of Uganda)

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You're also ignoring the most important piece of information about natural selection.. it's context-dependent. White people for example.. if the north american continent became uninhabitable due to some cataclysmic event.. would result in massive depopulation at the hands of skin cancer if forced to move closer to the equator.

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Hmmm. I wonder what would happen to white people if an ice age were to come or maybe something blocks the sun and only a little light gets through?

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Hmmm. I wonder what would happen to white people if an ice age were to come or maybe something blocks the sun and only a little light gets through?

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Die, like everyone else, due to food shortages.

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The Quickening

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i agree, but that selfishness isn't close to being evil, let alone "the most evil thing i cam imagine"

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it only hits this level in the specific scenario i described. when you look at the complete picture, its fricked up.

"they sought out one of the poorest places in our hemisphere, and these impressionable young children can either come to their school for 8 hours with food and water and AC, while learning about jesus, or they can frick off."
"thats not kindness. its preying upon the weakest members of society for the sole purpose of indoctrinating them into religion. its a purely selfish act, and theyre proud of it."

and why a school?



was i a tad dramatic in calling it "one of the most evil things i can imagine"? yes, probably, but its still reprehensible.

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well the message of Christianity is better than the message of Islam, so that comes into play.

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again, according to you. which is why going around the globe and indoctrinating children is fricked up. why not let them choose.

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Jesus had a good moral message ... turn the other cheek. be charitable and don't obsess over wealth. these are core messages of Jesus and they're very good things

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no argument. the world would be a much better place if people, including christians, would live by this.

God didnt make them equal.

Sam Colt did that.