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Mark Bowden (Black Hawk Down, Killing Pablo) piece on North Korea

Posted on 8/8/17 at 5:57 pm
Posted by Big Scrub TX
Member since Dec 2013
39833 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 5:57 pm
Cover story in The Atlantic last month on just how scarily intractable the situation is. Required reading for serious adults on the matter:
quote:

I learned that the U.S. has four broad strategic options for dealing with North Korea and its burgeoning nuclear program.

1. Prevention: A crushing U.S. military strike to eliminate Pyongyang’s arsenals of mass destruction, take out its leadership, and destroy its military. It would end North Korea’s standoff with the United States and South Korea, as well as the Kim dynasty, once and for all.

2. Turning the screws: A limited conventional military attack—or more likely a continuing series of such attacks—using aerial and naval assets, and possibly including narrowly targeted Special Forces operations. These would have to be punishing enough to significantly damage North Korea’s capability—but small enough to avoid being perceived as the beginning of a preventive strike. The goal would be to leave Kim Jong Un in power, but force him to abandon his pursuit of nuclear ICBMs.

3. Decapitation: Removing Kim and his inner circle, most likely by assassination, and replacing the leadership with a more moderate regime willing to open North Korea to the rest of the world.

4. Acceptance: The hardest pill to swallow—acquiescing to Kim’s developing the weapons he wants, while continuing efforts to contain his ambition.

Let’s consider each option. All of them are bad.
LINK
Posted by subotic
Member since Dec 2012
2822 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 5:59 pm to
Already discussed in another thread, FYI.
Posted by a want
I love everybody
Member since Oct 2010
19771 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:11 pm to
quote:

Already discussed in another thread, FYI.

Link?

"Germans" has become a tactic employed by Trumpkins and bots to deflect and distract away from problematic subjects for the Trump admin (and yes, there are a lot of problematic subjects).
Posted by geauxbrown
Louisiana
Member since Oct 2006
27204 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:13 pm to
Option 1. Next......
Posted by Big Scrub TX
Member since Dec 2013
39833 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:21 pm to
quote:

Already discussed in another thread, FYI.
I searched for Bowden and didn't see anything.
Posted by BBONDS25
Member since Mar 2008
59449 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:23 pm to
I assume you blame Trump for NK?
Posted by asurob1
On the edge of the galaxy
Member since May 2009
26971 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:26 pm to
quote:

I assume you blame Trump for NK?


NK has been a problem since the Chinese intervened. It's no one president's fault.

That being said, this hot potato is now on Trump's desk. So far he has shown that he isn't a very capable leader...

...time to change perceptions and get shite done or don't draw lines in the sand.
Posted by BBONDS25
Member since Mar 2008
59449 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:27 pm to
I agree. What do you think the response should be?
Posted by GeauxxxTigers23
TeamBunt General Manager
Member since Apr 2013
62514 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:31 pm to
5. Use the North Korea situation to convince our allies and partners in the region to build and enhance their militaries, specifically missile defense and naval forces(that they buy from American defense companies of course), to counterbalance China's growing military might.
This post was edited on 8/8/17 at 7:34 pm
Posted by asurob1
On the edge of the galaxy
Member since May 2009
26971 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:31 pm to
quote:

I agree. What do you think the response should be?


As I said in the other thread.

Time to beginning moving forces in the area. No one says a single bullet needs to be fired...but let fat kim see the team he is playing against.
Posted by RCDfan1950
United States
Member since Feb 2007
39616 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:31 pm to
quote:

...time to change perceptions and get shite done or don't draw lines in the sand.


Do you favor one of those Options, A?

I sometimes wonder if Fatboy is a ruthless bluff. Pat Buchannan thinks he's both rational and smart.
Posted by geauxbrown
Louisiana
Member since Oct 2006
27204 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:34 pm to
quote:

5. Is the North Korea situation to convince our allies and partners in the region to build and enhance their militaries, specifically missile defense and naval forces(that they buy from American defense companies of course), to counterbalance China's growing military might.


I like your idea even better than option 1
Posted by asurob1
On the edge of the galaxy
Member since May 2009
26971 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:40 pm to
quote:

Do you favor one of those Options, A?

I sometimes wonder if Fatboy is a ruthless bluff. Pat Buchannan thinks he's both rational and smart.


I more then understand the complications of military intervention.

But we gave the Chinese an opportunity to rein fatboy in.

They didn't.

It's time to lay the ground work for some serious military options.

That should get Fat Kim's attention.
Posted by GeauxxxTigers23
TeamBunt General Manager
Member since Apr 2013
62514 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:43 pm to
quote:

It's time to lay the ground work for some serious military options.
Im fine with that but the ultimate goal should be ensuring that China is not the dominant player in the region. At the end of the day North Korea is a sideshow. We should turn this into an opportunity to permanently deploy more air and naval forces to the region and also convince our allies to beef up their militaries.
Posted by a want
I love everybody
Member since Oct 2010
19771 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:44 pm to
quote:

I assume you blame Trump for NK?

Nope. You can't stop a sovereign nation from obtaining nuclear weapons if they want them.

Trump's response today was idiotic, though.
Posted by RCDfan1950
United States
Member since Feb 2007
39616 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:44 pm to
Posted by asurob1
On the edge of the galaxy
Member since May 2009
26971 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 7:48 pm to
quote:

We should turn this into an opportunity to permanently deploy more air and naval forces to the region and also convince our allies to beef up their militaries.



Completely agree.

Posted by Ace Midnight
Between sanity and madness
Member since Dec 2006
95578 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 8:25 pm to
quote:

But we gave the Chinese an opportunity to rein fatboy in.

They didn't.

It's time to lay the ground work for some serious military options.

That should get Fat Kim's attention.


And, I think Trump should be given some credit in very openly encouraging/inviting China to do something about it, and letting the world see those results. And I don't think China even half-assed it this time, like they usually do.

It's just this young Kim Jong a-hole didn't get that his father and grandfather were largely bluffers, left in place by the Chicoms to be a thorn in the side of the West. Maybe he really believes the cult he's the head of?

We should disabuse the whole peninsula of that nonsense, once and for all. Move on to some other problems to solve.
Posted by subotic
Member since Dec 2012
2822 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 8:39 pm to
Did I say Germans, count?
Posted by DisplacedBuckeye
Member since Dec 2013
76732 posts
Posted on 8/8/17 at 8:58 pm to
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