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re: 4Chan found the playbook on spinning vax narrative

Posted on 1/11/23 at 3:17 pm to
Posted by DerkaDerka
Member since Jul 2016
1317 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 3:17 pm to
quote:

That's an interesting idea. Everybody can and should improve their critical skills to try to judge better, but there's still so much information out there that you get 2nd, 3rd, or Nth hand, that you can't even figure out where to go to evaluate a particular claim and don't try. Like people asking today, "what are even the sources of documented vaccination deaths?" People both don't know and despair of the possibility of knowing, so they just speculate to each other about conspiracies to obscure knowledge.


As much as I don't care for google (doubly now that the ex wife works there), the last I checked google docs was pretty good for primary documentation from ppl that lived in the time. Depends on the topic of course. For example, you can get memoirs from ppl that lived during the civil war to hear what they had to say about why they fought and/or supported either side. Compare that against the overly-simplistic narrative and you can walk away with some significant info whether it be what you were looking for or not. Could be the only take away is that history as taught is garbage and you can find your own sources for context elsewhere.

I will look at those books you listed and at least read the final chapters :)

Any tips on how to vet data would be quite welcomed.

One thing that I struggle with is, so what. So I spent a life digging for truth and fine tuning my bullshite meter. What do I do with it? If it goes to the grave with me then what was the point? So there is the rub, can't wait for perfect understanding before taking some form of action. Do the best we can with what we know or think we know and stay open to change.
This post was edited on 1/11/23 at 3:22 pm
Posted by TigerDoc
Texas
Member since Apr 2004
11844 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 3:20 pm to
I agree. The information environment is already difficult and malign actors definitely take advantage of it. Old-school propaganda tried to deceive you. E.g., the USSR saying "industrial production is up" and coming up with 20 ways of misleading you into believing this. Now they prefer the "firehose of falsehood" where they hit you with 4 mutually exclusive narratives and encourage everybody to go out there and find truth.
Posted by TigerDoc
Texas
Member since Apr 2004
11844 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 4:04 pm to
quote:

One thing that I struggle with is, so what. So I spent a life digging for truth and fine tuning my bullshite meter. What do I do with it? If it goes to the grave with me then what was the point? So there is the rub, can't wait for perfect understanding before taking some form of action. Do the best we can with what we know or think we know and stay open to change.


That's right. And speaking of your last-chapter method, the last chapter of the Constitution of Knowledge is about just that problem - what does an individual do. Rauch is a major proponent of free speech and his answer you'll read in that chapter is to speak your mind in the public square (like this one), but the other part that's important is that you have to cultivate a certain attitude of intellectual humility where you expect that you'll learn from others even as they learn from you.

As far as the point of it all, I wonder about that too. I see two points - one is to "know when a man is talking rot" (i.e. to identify likely lies, bullshite, and other falsehoods) and thus to be less likely made a tool for others' ends and two is to hopefully contribute to a public space that is clearer and more trustworthy than you found it.

As far as better vetting information, there's lots to say on that, but I think it starts with taking stock of your own intellectual vices and virtues and then trying to improve where you're weak and learning to defer well to others who know more than you.
Posted by UncleFestersLegs
Member since Nov 2010
16879 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 4:10 pm to
quote:

Yes, it's typical public health messaging.
ahh your safe space to hide from all the biden classified docs threads it must be physically painful to have to skip over them
Posted by Padme
Member since Dec 2020
9724 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 4:12 pm to
quote:

So, who created the docs in question?


SloFloPro
Posted by Milf n Cookies
Texas
Member since Nov 2021
730 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 4:26 pm to
quote:

Holy FN shite!


quote:

Do you morons actually think that this is something nefarious?


Here's a better question. Why should a safe and effective vaccine, who's purpose is to protect against a supposedly dangerous pathogen, need marketing in the first place?

Answer: It wouldn't.
Posted by VoxDawg
Glory, Glory
Member since Sep 2012
77464 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 4:52 pm to
#AnonsKnew
Posted by 2020_reVISION
Richmond,VA
Member since Dec 2020
3289 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 6:06 pm to
I can recall when the AMA came out with their "playbook"...

AMA COVID-19 GUIDE Background/messaging on vaccines, vaccine clinical trials & combating vaccine misinformation

These two sections are certainly "language focused";

pg. 8 Best practices: general media messaging
&
pg. 9 Best practices: social media content


Lest we forget the collaborative effort/contribution towards DEI by the AMA & AAMC/Center for Health Justice

ADVANCING HEALTH EQUITY: A GUIDE TO LANGUAGE, NARRATIVE AND CONCEPTS

Posted by LSUAngelHere1
Watson
Member since Jan 2018
10137 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 6:13 pm to
quote:

I just have a hard time believing anything from 4chan....

By all means, tune in to your favorite person who reads their govt script.
Posted by Dirtyboro
Member since Jul 2014
717 posts
Posted on 1/11/23 at 7:49 pm to
We’re getting real close to the part where this squabble goes live
Posted by DerkaDerka
Member since Jul 2016
1317 posts
Posted on 1/12/23 at 12:37 pm to
quote:

hopefully contribute to a public space that is clearer and more trustworthy than you found it.


This is why I don't post often and do my best to avoid insults and derailing angles. Typically I wait until I have some previous context on the subject.


quote:

and learning to defer well to others who know more than you.


Just can't "trust the experts" blindly anymore. In public forums, yes, it is good to concede as needed and otherwise learn from others when warranted.
This post was edited on 1/12/23 at 12:39 pm
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