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re: Scientist says he found definitive proof that God exists
Posted on 6/9/16 at 8:51 am to Darth_Vader
Posted on 6/9/16 at 8:51 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
ll this proves is you have a misguided and incorrect view of God, and by God, I mean the one you claim cannot exist.
Go on then. Guide and correct. And for clarification, never said "cannot" exist. Said didn't exist in the popular form.
2
Posted on 6/9/16 at 8:57 am to Tiger inTampa
quote:
Go on then. Guide and correct.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:05 am to Tiger inTampa
I'm probably one of the worst people to try and explain the Christian God to you. But I'll try. Basically God is literally perfect, blameless, and totally free of sin. When Adam and Eve sinned in the garden, God could no longer be in their presence. And as has been said already, the introduction of sin into this world basically gave Satan dominion over this world. God made the world, and man perfect. But due to sin the world, and man, are now a fallen creation. It was after the fall that all the bad things you listed came into being.
Before they sinned, God warned Adam and Eve that the punishment for sin was death. The only thing that can erase sin is blood, thus the Old Testament practice of animal sacrifice. God knew this was only a temporary fix to the problem of sin and the only way to bring mankind back to a state of grace with God was for there to be a pure sacrifice totally free of the sin of this world. Thus he sent his son to be that pure sacrifice. It's up to us to either accept or reject his gift of grace. No matter how good of a life we think we lead or hoe many good works we do will be enough to save us from the punishment of sin. Only through accepting his grace can we avoid paying the penalty.
I know you won't believe any of that. And I'm not trying to preach or convert you. I'm just trying to give you a better understanding of what Christanity is based on since you mistakenly believe that it would have been God who created all the bad things in the world.
As for everything I just typed out, there is no way to prove any of it being correct. Each person has to decide to either accept it through faith or reject it all together.
Before they sinned, God warned Adam and Eve that the punishment for sin was death. The only thing that can erase sin is blood, thus the Old Testament practice of animal sacrifice. God knew this was only a temporary fix to the problem of sin and the only way to bring mankind back to a state of grace with God was for there to be a pure sacrifice totally free of the sin of this world. Thus he sent his son to be that pure sacrifice. It's up to us to either accept or reject his gift of grace. No matter how good of a life we think we lead or hoe many good works we do will be enough to save us from the punishment of sin. Only through accepting his grace can we avoid paying the penalty.
I know you won't believe any of that. And I'm not trying to preach or convert you. I'm just trying to give you a better understanding of what Christanity is based on since you mistakenly believe that it would have been God who created all the bad things in the world.
As for everything I just typed out, there is no way to prove any of it being correct. Each person has to decide to either accept it through faith or reject it all together.
This post was edited on 6/9/16 at 9:08 am
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:10 am to Darth_Vader
Christianity is the only faith where you, as individual, don't have do anything as payment for your sins. This concept is hard for man to grasp.
As for the OP, many scientists have come to a similar conclusion.
As for the OP, many scientists have come to a similar conclusion.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:11 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
I'm just trying to give you a better understanding of what Christanity is based on since you mistakenly believe that it would have been God who created all the bad things in the world.
First, you shouldn't assume that because we have a differing opinion I have no knowledge or understanding of the subject. 12 years of parochial school have given me a firm knowledge base. I didn't "mistakenly believe" God created all the bad....I think that if there is a God he ALLOWS all the bad. Which is diametrically opposed to a being supposedly only full of love, compassion, and forgiveness.
This post was edited on 6/9/16 at 9:14 am
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:13 am to Darth_Vader
But which god?
There are tens of thousands and some much older than others...
There are tens of thousands and some much older than others...
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:16 am to N2cars
quote:
Christianity is the only faith where you, as individual, don't have do anything as payment for your sins.
That's not true.
You have to become Christian and accept Jesus died for your sins.
Which is a super easy way to "pay" for your sins. One of the reasons the religion spread so rapidly.
"You mean all I gotta do is say I accept that Jesus died for my sins and is the son of the one true God and I'm going to heaven? Even if I've been an real a-hole? Sign me up!"
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:22 am to Tiger inTampa
quote:
irst, you shouldn't assume that because we have a differing opinion I have no knowledge or understanding of the subject. 12 years of parochial school have given me a firm knowledge base. I didn't "mistakenly believe" God created all the bad....I think that if there is a God he ALLOWS all the bad. Which is diametrically opposed to a being supposedly only full of love, compassion, and forgiveness.
Then you should understand how and why all the bad things in the world happen. God did not choose to allow the world to fall to sin. We did that. When God made Adam and Eve he created them in his image, and that includes giving them free will. Adam and Eve used that free will to choose to rebel against God by disobeying the one and only rule he gave them. God is not to blame for the bad things in the world, we are.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:23 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
When God made Adam and Eve he created them in his image, and that includes giving them free will.
interesting
so your God is not omnipresent?
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:28 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:
That's not true.
You have to become Christian and accept Jesus died for your sins.
Which is a super easy way to "pay" for your sins. One of the reasons the religion spread so rapidly.
"You mean all I gotta do is say I accept that Jesus died for my sins and is the son of the one true God and I'm going to heaven? Even if I've been an real a-hole? Sign me up!"
This is another misconception. You don't just say your"accept" him. You have to repent from sin. The term "repent" is key. It does not mean to say you're sorry for something or merely confess something. Repent means to turn away from something. So to become a follower of Chirst one must turn away from their sin. And that's no even close to being easy and the truth of the matter is all of us, myself included, fall short constantly.
But, according to Chritian belief, if one did truly repent from sin, God gives them the gift of the Holy Spirit that will help keep them on the right path, or at least as much as is possible while still living in a fallen world and occupying a body of fallen flesh.
I know I'm probably doing a piss poor job of trying to explain all this. Like I said I'm a terrible option at trying to explain these types of things.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:30 am to Salmon
quote:
quote:
When God made Adam and Eve he created them in his image, and that includes giving them free will.
interesting
so your God is not omnipresent?
How does God giving Adam and Eve mean he's not omnipresent? What does one have to do with the other?
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:32 am to Darth_Vader
I'm only on page 3 of this thread, but I have a few thoughts. Kaku is really smart and really likable. I am fascinated by quantum physics even though I understand almost none of it--I have a liberal arts degree. : 
But I fell in love after reading and watching a video about the double slit theory(which I was pointed to on here, actually) and seeing Kaku explain the Schrodinger's Cat thought experiment on some video. I also used to listen to his radio show on Saturdays 5 years or so ago.
I remember him saying that he thought we would hit singularity in our lifetimes, and one day he went on about 3D printing technology allowing us to basically clone ourselves and teleport. Again, in our lifetimes. To me, it seemed like he was almost hoping for immortality of some kind. So, with him getting older, it's not very surprising to me that he's trying to find it elsewhere.
Another thing about him is that 5-10 years ago, he was the quantum physics rock star. But with Tyson emerging as the face of physics, and History Channel 2 becoming Vice and producing--and showing--less science shows on the regular History Channel, I think he may be desperate to stay relevant. Like I said, he's very likable, and he's responsible for my--and I'm sure many others--interest in the quantum world, but I think he may 1) be dealing with his own mortality, and 2) worrying about his current relevance and subsequent legacy.
To be fair, I have not read this new theory and have no idea what it means. I'm just arm-chair shrinking him.
But I fell in love after reading and watching a video about the double slit theory(which I was pointed to on here, actually) and seeing Kaku explain the Schrodinger's Cat thought experiment on some video. I also used to listen to his radio show on Saturdays 5 years or so ago. I remember him saying that he thought we would hit singularity in our lifetimes, and one day he went on about 3D printing technology allowing us to basically clone ourselves and teleport. Again, in our lifetimes. To me, it seemed like he was almost hoping for immortality of some kind. So, with him getting older, it's not very surprising to me that he's trying to find it elsewhere.
Another thing about him is that 5-10 years ago, he was the quantum physics rock star. But with Tyson emerging as the face of physics, and History Channel 2 becoming Vice and producing--and showing--less science shows on the regular History Channel, I think he may be desperate to stay relevant. Like I said, he's very likable, and he's responsible for my--and I'm sure many others--interest in the quantum world, but I think he may 1) be dealing with his own mortality, and 2) worrying about his current relevance and subsequent legacy.
To be fair, I have not read this new theory and have no idea what it means. I'm just arm-chair shrinking him.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:32 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
This is another misconception. You don't just say your"accept" him. You have to repent from sin. The term "repent" is key. It does not mean to say you're sorry for something or merely confess something. Repent means to turn away from something. So to become a follower of Chirst one must turn away from their sin. And that's no even close to being easy and the truth of the matter is all of us, myself included, fall short constantly.
Well, the common misconception that its easy makes it a popular religion.
I should rephrase. If everyone had to drastically change their lifestyle to "say" they're a Christian, far fewer would do it.
I bet fewer than 10% of "Christians" actually "repent" in the sense you speak of. Even fewer have read a majority of the bible.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:33 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
How does God giving Adam and Eve mean he's not omnipresent? What does one have to do with the other?
the church I grew up in did not preach free will, as they believed that God was all knowing, omnipresent, and omnipotent, which would mean he knew everything that has happened and what will happen
meaning he knew that Adam and Eve would fall to sin when he set everything in motion
if he knew it was going to happen, is that free will?
I'm just always kinda fascinated about how other people within the same religion, even the same denomination, interpret the bible
I, am in no way, claiming you are wrong or vice versa, just find this stuff interesting
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:36 am to Darth_Vader
quote:
When God made Adam and Eve he created them in his image, and that includes giving them free will. Adam and Eve used that free will to choose to rebel against God by disobeying the one and only rule he gave them.
Exactly. His allowance of sin by placing temptation in the Garden started the whole sin wagon rolling. Not Adam and Eve's curiosity and poor choices. Look at it this way, I tell my kids all you have to do is not smoke dope in my house and I will provide you with every thing you need. Then I go and throw a pound of Purple hair hydro-sticky and a vaporizer on the dinning room table and bolt. Then I get pissed and throw them out when I get home from creating the Andromeda galaxy and find they busted into the stash I told them not to.
All I'm saying is if the whole endgame was to have us all living in paradise why throw the test into the mix? I don't ask my kid to prove her love to me.
My conference call has ended so I have to get back to real work but i have enjoyed our conversation. Thanks for the post.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:36 am to Salmon
Wait...
...there are adults that actually believe in Adam and Eve?
Like 2 people, one made from a rib and ate a forbidden fruit, started all the billions on Earth?
I thought even Christians agreed for the most part that the bible has a ton of “fables” there just to teach a story. Like Adam and Eve, Jonah, Noah, etc.
...there are adults that actually believe in Adam and Eve?
Like 2 people, one made from a rib and ate a forbidden fruit, started all the billions on Earth?
I thought even Christians agreed for the most part that the bible has a ton of “fables” there just to teach a story. Like Adam and Eve, Jonah, Noah, etc.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:37 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:
Wait...
...there are adults that actually believe in Adam and Eve?
come on bro
there are adults that believe the Earth is only 6,000 years old and that humans and dinosaurs lived together
This post was edited on 6/9/16 at 9:39 am
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:39 am to TheCaterpillar
quote:
Well, the common misconception that its easy makes it a popular religion.
Sad but true. And a lot of it is Christians own fault but trying to go around acting like they're better than everyone else and passing judgment on others. If they'd spend less time doing these things and more time reading scripture (something I should do as well) they'd realize that a core belief for Christians is that in God's eyes we are no better than the most wretched murderer or rapist. We're all sinners, equally guilty and equally bound to pay the penalty for our guilt. Nothing we can do on our own can save us. None of us are righteous nor should we try to act like we are.
quote:
I should rephrase. If everyone had to drastically change their lifestyle to "say" they're a Christian, far fewer would do it. I bet fewer than 10% of "Christians" actually "repent" in the sense you speak of. Even fewer have read a majority of the bible.
I don't know if your percentage is correct but I'd guess it's at least not far from the mark. And that's sad. The Bible even warns of us these things and yet we still fall prey to it.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:39 am to Salmon
quote:
come on bro
there are adults that believe the Earth is only 6,000 years old
Yeah but I figured they all live in shanties without internet.
There can't be a large contingent of adults in the US with educations who believe that is 100% true. By large I mean like millions of people.
Are there millions of adults that think that is true?
frick.
Posted on 6/9/16 at 9:43 am to Salmon
quote:
the church I grew up in did not preach free will, as they believed that God was all knowing, omnipresent, and omnipotent, which would mean he knew everything that has happened and what will happen
Here's the ting. Both are true. God is omnipresent and He gave us free will. It's his gift of free will that separates us from the rest of his creation and makes us more in his image. Without free will Adam and Eve would have never been able to chose to disobey God in the first place.
quote:
meaning he knew that Adam and Eve would fall to sin when he set everything in motion if he knew it was going to happen, is that free will?
He did know what they'd do and he chose to create them (and us) anyway. I don't fully understand it either and I doubt anyone can really grasp the full truth of it to be honest.
quote:
I'm just always kinda fascinated about how other people within the same religion, even the same denomination, interpret the bible I, am in no way, claiming you are wrong or vice versa, just find this stuff interesting
Same here. This is a very good discussion.
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