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re: Optometry: LA HB 1065/SB 568: What if your Louisiana Eye Surgeon is NOT an MD?

Posted on 5/22/14 at 11:36 am to
Posted by Hopeful Doc
Member since Sep 2010
15388 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 11:36 am to
quote:

PAs kind of already 'substitute the doctors out?' The only difference is that the doctors are making money off of them, not the DOs.



Careful with your letters. DOs are doctors of medicine and capable of doing anything an MD can do (+ a few extra residencies are open to them). They'll actually be joining oversight with the USMLE if I'm not mistaken. ODs are doctors of optometry. Probably just a typo, but worth pointing out.
Posted by theunknownknight
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2005
60243 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:19 pm to
quote:

So when an optometrist gets sued for malpractice after a botched eye or lid surgery, will they have to go in front of a medical review panel like other surgeons?


No. And that's great for them and sucks for ya'll.

The difference is they took advantage of the system to better their profession. Nothing's stopping MDs from fighting back the same way except complacency

For too long MDs have relied on the idea the world thinks they are the best because they made it through medical school. MDs have no will to fight because the never dreamed they'd have to because they "earned" their way.

Well guess what? While ya'll been doing your own thing, the fight's been brought to you.

First NPs
Now ODs

Then what?

Maybe it's time for you to take this ACA restructuring seriously and better your lobby because apparently it sucks.

If we patients are too dumb to understand and need protection, educate us. Start a movement. Fight back.

Too many talkers in quitters in this world today. Be a doer and maybe something will be done.

This post was edited on 5/22/14 at 12:20 pm
Posted by guttata
prairieville
Member since Feb 2006
22632 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:24 pm to
Next- CRNAs
Posted by LATigerdoc
Oakdale, Louisiana
Member since May 2014
933 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:26 pm to
What do you think starting this thread was about?
This misinformed vote will not be the last word in the discussion on who exactly can do surgery on patients.
Term limits exist for a reason
This post was edited on 5/22/14 at 12:28 pm
Posted by theunknownknight
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2005
60243 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:29 pm to
quote:

What do you think starting this thread was about? This misinformed vote will not be the last word. Term limits exist, remember that...


That's fine. And if history has shown anything, this is all talk.

If I were as mad as you I wouldn't settle for term limits, I'd do them what they did to you. Take THEIR turf.
Posted by jamarkus
Nola
Member since Oct 2007
185 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:30 pm to
I can't argue with you there. Pretty accurate assessment. I really didn't know about them going in front of the medical review panel. Guess they'll to to standard for malpractice too?
Posted by LATigerdoc
Oakdale, Louisiana
Member since May 2014
933 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:44 pm to
An MD Ophthalmologist is a full spectrum physician for the eye. How can you take turf that's by training already yours?

Optometry has an ever-evolving legislatively expanding vision for their professional role.

One was trained to learn the body and then master knowledge of the eye and to fully take care of the eye medically and surgically. The other defines its own expertise year-to-year

Posted by jamarkus
Nola
Member since Oct 2007
185 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:49 pm to
quote;
An MD Ophthalmologist is a full spectrum physician for the eye. How can you take turf that's by training already yours?

Optometry has an ever-evolving legislatively expanding vision for their professional role.

One was trained to learn the body and then master knowledge of the eye and to fully take care of the eye medically and surgically. The other defines its own expertise year-to-year
------------------------------------------------------------

This!
Posted by Bleeding purple
Athens, Texas
Member since Sep 2007
25348 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:50 pm to
quote:

No. And that's great for them and sucks for ya'll. The difference is they took advantage of the system to better their profession. Nothing's stopping MDs from fighting back the same way except complacency For too long MDs have relied on the idea the world thinks they are the best because they made it through medical school. MDs have no will to fight because the never dreamed they'd have to because they "earned" their way. Well guess what? While ya'll been doing your own thing, the fight's been brought to you. First NPs Now ODs Then what?




There is a lot of logic in this post.

Most physicians have repeatedly been told "just take care of the patients and everything else will work itself out". While this fosters a patient first care model, it is not wise from a business sense in our current landscape. IMHO this is a major flaw in our profession. Couple that philosophy with the facts that the vast majority of medical students are science majors with little to no business background, and there is no additional training in med school and little if any in residency on business models and operation and you have a recipe for ignorant complacency.

quote:

Maybe it's time for you to take this ACA restructuring seriously and better your lobby because apparently it sucks. If we patients are too dumb to understand and need protection, educate us. Start a movement. Fight back. Too many talkers in quitters in this world today. Be a doer and maybe something will be done.



Although much has been written in this thread about motivation (some of it specifically by you)it can be asserted that educated, intelligent, individuals, who have their daily needs met are more likely to make altruistic decisions than those who are struggling to meet their own individual needs. Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs speaks directly about this assertion. When those with out resources are forced to make a decision that may benefits or at a minimum fails to injure society as whole at the cost of losing or blocking resources to themselves as individuals, the choice is often simple. Physicians who have stood and fought the battle of the ACA have been called out as evil, money hungry, overpaid, selfish monsters. Those who try to assert value to care based on a patients individual value to society are similarly deemed monsters. Sadly the fight is dangerous one for physicians regardless of their motives.
Posted by Bleeding purple
Athens, Texas
Member since Sep 2007
25348 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:53 pm to
Taken from my post in another thread:


The problem is as a country, we are straddling the fence on two sides of the issue.

Side one: everyone deserves care regardless of who pays for it

Whenever you show up at the ER, EMTLA requires that you are rendered medical care regardless of financial resources. Medical Malpractice Laws prevent turning out those patients with self induced disease states that require treatment simply because of lack of funding. The often publicized myth that individuals in need of care could not get care in the country prior to the ACA is total and utter bullshite. Considering the increased premiums for those with insurance forced to change, the expensive premiums for those with none before, and the poor reimbursement forcing physicians to not take ACA patients into their practice, the relative ability to get preventative services or specialty non in-patient care has not changed either.

This side of the argument of course tries to limit and control choices of individuals in an effort to control expenditures while maintaining health.

side 2: Everyone has freedom of choice and an individuals choices that don't directly affect others should not be infringed.

This side of the argument basically believes your healthcare is your responsibility. It empowers the individual through free choice allowing each person to refuse or accept risk and then ultimately benefit or suffer from the consequences. Admittedly this restricts care for those who have little control about their environment or how they arrived there(children, the disabled, the elderly). This side is believed by some to improve society as whole over time as the weak are self eliminated and the strong prosper. The witnessing of the process may actually alter choices of other individuals increasing the overall health of the whole.






The real issue, which I am by no means limiting to pot legalization, is as a society we seem to want to do both. We can't. There are simply not enough recourses to provide totalitarian care (side 1) for those who choose self destructive high risk activities (side 2)Sadly the good hearted Americans who are supporters of side one, often holding to the belief that no one should be allowed to judge who does and does not deserve healthcare, frequently fail to realize that refusing to make a decision for an individual is by default making a decision for the whole. Simply put resources are spread thinner, persons with self abusive habits are kept alive longer, financial return to the community is lower and there is less available for everyone to share.


Personally I am proponent of side two. However, as long as we are stuck providing care based on side one beliefs, we must sadly continue to limit side two freedoms in an effort to keep the ship aright.
Posted by 90proofprofessional
Member since Mar 2004
24445 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 12:54 pm to
quote:

The difference is they took advantage of the system to better their profession. Nothing's stopping MDs from fighting back the same way except complacency

their complacency is pretty understandable

their control, which btw was given by the same body that just weakened it a bit, has been long-standing
Posted by theunknownknight
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2005
60243 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 1:35 pm to
quote:

An MD Ophthalmologist is a full spectrum physician for the eye. How can you take turf that's by training already yours?


You lack imagination. I work with implementing public health care systems and I can see some ways.
Posted by Statestreet
Gueydan
Member since Sep 2008
13890 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 1:50 pm to
quote:

Heitmeier is a douche.


He comes across as unethical with a big time conflict of interest. And all of his other politician buds have his back- sickening. What a joke for the healthcare of our state.
Posted by Traffic Circle
Down the Rabbit Hole
Member since Nov 2013
4890 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 1:53 pm to
I am totally confused by this whole thing. But I love to chime in, and I really like to read this thread! What I think is certainly not meritorious.

I guess the answer lies in public policy vs. what's best for any particular profession.
Posted by LSUregit
Member since Dec 2013
1663 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 1:55 pm to
I've only read the last few pages of this, but I'm Ortho-spine.

So should Chiropractors be allowed to perform spinal fusion/decompression/instrumentation surgeries?

I think not!!
Posted by Traffic Circle
Down the Rabbit Hole
Member since Nov 2013
4890 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 1:57 pm to
Well, a few pages back, this was posted.

There is such a thing as a Chiropractic Proctologist that can perform surgery.

LINK
Posted by LSUregit
Member since Dec 2013
1663 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 2:01 pm to
So he can screw up your back then give you anal in the same procedure? What a joke
Posted by Traffic Circle
Down the Rabbit Hole
Member since Nov 2013
4890 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 2:02 pm to
Not sure what the scope of practice is but a Chiropractic Surgeon seems a bit off the path.
Posted by theunknownknight
Baton Rouge
Member since Sep 2005
60243 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 2:07 pm to
quote:

I've only read the last few pages of this, but I'm Ortho-spine.

So should Chiropractors be allowed to perform spinal fusion/decompression/instrumentation surgeries?

I think not!!!


Exhibit A of complacency.

Maybe not TODAY. But imagine a world 25 years from now that would make certain spinal surgeries a cake walk.

Imagine that world.

Because it's coming.

Posted by Traffic Circle
Down the Rabbit Hole
Member since Nov 2013
4890 posts
Posted on 5/22/14 at 2:10 pm to
quote:

Maybe not TODAY. But imagine a world 25 years from now that would make certain spinal surgeries a cake walk.


Aren't doctors the ones that used to use leeches? And masturbate women to cure illnesses?
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