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re: Roman Harper Suspension

Posted on 4/18/12 at 5:20 pm to
Posted by Hugo Stiglitz
Member since Oct 2010
72937 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 5:20 pm to
quote:

I'll listen to reason. What does he do well? Tackle? No. We saw that all season including the playoff lose. Cover? Uhhhhh.... Rush the passer? 6 sacks. Ok, he's okay at that. He got 3 in one game against a high school line that didn't pick him up. I don't feel like doing it, but I wonder what the number of sacks were on a % of blitzes. I don't remember a sack of his after the midway point of the season. Is he a better blitzer than say Jenkins would be or is it that he was the only option bc we couldn't allow him to be the only guy over the top. Jenkins would be an exceptional blitzer esp out nickel coverage which we couldn't run bc you can't trust Harper to cover or tackle anybody. You know, the definition of a saftey.

I'm just asking. I will listen to all the great plays he made this year and last and the year before. I know he was a huge culprit in the last two playoff losses. I watch every down. I can't remember a great play but I could be wrong.




Posted by KindOfABigDeal
Houston
Member since Jan 2008
448 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 10:40 pm to
I understand the depth issue....its the same with him on the team or off it. We have one starting caliber safety. What you guys don't understand is that he's a defensive back. They're paid to cover people by definition. He can't do it. You get that, he can't do it. Anyone would have had those six sacks had they been put on the line. He's not a DE!

Oh, and I'm still waiting to hear about the great plays he's made. I can name a lot of awful plays (most of which cost us the last two playoff games) but I can't remember a great play. Okay, maybe all those interceptions count for something. Wait...no that's not it. Oh yeah, since he's a great tackler, all those behind the line stops of running plays. No, that's not it either. Oh, yeah, the sacks of Jay Cutler where he literally ran free off the line, no one blocked him, and the line actually got out of his way because they blocked down and misread the blitz.

Last thing, since Spags doesn't blitz and we signed a tackling machine in Lofton, what's Harper going to do? Just answer that because I know you don't have any good plays for me. The best thing Harper did was hit Smith late, which by the way, he was late to roll to that coverage and bail out Greer. Let Smith walk into the endzone.
Posted by Breesus
Unplug
Member since Jan 2010
69549 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 10:45 pm to
quote:

They're paid to cover people by definition.


Technically this isnt the main job of a Strong Safety. think about it. The position may be shifting that way, but as of now it isnt the main job of the SS. HArper almost had more sacks than any DB since they started keepin track of such a thing. He is usually a sure tackler and a big help in the run game. Also a great blitzer. Sounds like a shitty player to me. What SS would you like to replace him with?

And yes, you gave me AIDS and Cancer many many times.
Posted by KindOfABigDeal
Houston
Member since Jan 2008
448 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 10:55 pm to
Safeties are paid to help in coverage and tackle on the back end. Yes, they are involved in the running game as well and especially with our team because we have (had) terrible LBs. But, they are supposed to be in coverage. What kind of safety do you have if you have to hide him on passing downs?

I would move Jenkings to strong (he's a much better tackler than Harper and would create numerous issues for Off much like Woodson does around the LOS) and I'd get a true free with range. As we all should know by now, there isn't much diff in todays NFL with either safety. If you have a safety that can't cover, he gets exposed. He gets picked on and exposed. Just like Harper did against Seattle and just like he did against SF. Hell, we even took him off Davis after the TD in the first quarter only to have the guy miss the fricking tackle on the game losing drive. Oh, and on the last play of the game when my daughter knew who Smith was going to, didn't get over quick enough. He's brutal. I wish you guys could see beyond the pro-bowl bullshite. He's a pro bowler like Roy Williams (DB) was a pro bowler.
Posted by Breesus
Unplug
Member since Jan 2010
69549 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:00 pm to
quote:

What kind of safety do you have if you have to hide him on passing downs?



A strong blitzing run stopping one?

quote:

there isn't much diff in todays NFL with either safety.


Yes there is. And plenty of teams still have a prototypical SS
quote:

my daughter


Pics or GTFO

quote:

I wish you guys could see beyond the pro-bowl bullshite.

Yeah me too. Everyone knows probowl selections arent based on skill or stats.



Posted by Hoodoo Man
Sunshine Pumping most days.
Member since Oct 2011
31637 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:02 pm to
The question is, will Harper be a playmaker back there like Spags needs him to be.

His questionable coverage skills may be a hindrance in that way.

So, you're both right?
Posted by Breesus
Unplug
Member since Jan 2010
69549 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:05 pm to
quote:

His questionable coverage skills may be a hindrance in that way.



I agree with this. I wouldn't mind having another saftey to rotate with him. Some cool packages could be made with Jenkins at strong or nickle if we had another coverage safety.
Posted by Hoodoo Man
Sunshine Pumping most days.
Member since Oct 2011
31637 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:09 pm to
I mean, I believe he was our best sacker when we were super blitz-happy and our front 4 got no pressure.

Now that we'll be blitzing less...well, I hope we can find a role for him.
Posted by KindOfABigDeal
Houston
Member since Jan 2008
448 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:10 pm to
Probowls are NOT based on anything but popularity or, at this point, whoever is willing to show up after the real stars bail.

Your definition of a safety sounds eerily similiar to my def of a linebacker or Def End.

And yes there are teams who still think like you and Greggie pooh....those teams are called BAD. Those defenses suck arse.
Posted by KindOfABigDeal
Houston
Member since Jan 2008
448 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:13 pm to
quote:

I agree with this. I wouldn't mind having another saftey to rotate with him. Some cool packages could be made with Jenkins at strong or nickle if we had another coverage safety.



Glad to see you coming around to what I've been saying. But here's the deal, it doesn't have to be a gimmick or a package, it can actually be your defense if they get a real safety.
Posted by Hoodoo Man
Sunshine Pumping most days.
Member since Oct 2011
31637 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:15 pm to
quote:

Glad to see you coming around to what I've been saying.

Technically, he came around to what I was saying.

Try not being smug about it.
Posted by Breesus
Unplug
Member since Jan 2010
69549 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:16 pm to
quote:

Your definition of a safety sounds eerily similiar to my def of a linebacker or Def End.



You have pass rushing LB and run stopping LBs. You have pass rushing DE's and run stopping DE's. Why cant you have pass defending and run stopping Safteys? There is definitely still a place and a use for Harper on this team. I dont see why you hate the guy so much. He isnt anywhere near the bottom tier of safteys in the league

Posted by Hugo Stiglitz
Member since Oct 2010
72937 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:18 pm to
Eric Weddle
Laron Landry
Donte Whitner
Bernard Pollard

All say hi

You clearly don't understand the enforcer role of the SS and the importance it brings to a defense.
Posted by KindOfABigDeal
Houston
Member since Jan 2008
448 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:20 pm to
I don't hate him. I don't know him. He seems like a good guy. I have good friends who are awful at their jobs. I love hanging out with them. Harper is just not good at his job. But I'm happy for him that he got paid. Hopefully he takes care of the money and helps Greggie out now that he doesn't have a job. After all, it was Greggie who got him paid.
Posted by KindOfABigDeal
Houston
Member since Jan 2008
448 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:26 pm to
quote:

Eric Weddle, Laron Landry, Bernard Pollard, Donte Whitner


The commonality is that all of them have been a major part of awful defenses. Weddle though can actually cover a little, he's not very good, but he's serviceable. Landry is bad, Bernard Pollard has been cut from every team he's played for. He was the main culprit for the Texans having a historically bad defense against the pass two years ago. He barely plays in Baltimore. Whitner was garbage in Buffalo, but was decent this year in SF bc of the other freaks on that def. Believe me, if you pay attention, you know Whitner wasn't even the best safety on his team. You're actually making my point, so thanks.
Posted by Hugo Stiglitz
Member since Oct 2010
72937 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:39 pm to
quote:

Weddle though can actually cover a little, he's not very good, but he's serviceable.

He's one of the best in the business.
quote:

Landry is bad,

troll on hommie, he's been hampered by injury but he is far from bad
quote:

Bernard Pollard has been cut from every team he's played for. He was the main culprit for the Texans having a historically bad defense against the pass two years ago. He barely plays in Baltimore

Okay, now you've proved you don't know shite. Pollard earned the starting job on the Ravens D, after a few games, where he started 15 games in 2011 and played in 18.
quote:

Whitner was garbage in Buffalo, but was decent this year in SF

Whitner was solid in buffalo, in fact he was one of their defense's bright spots.

I wonder who you consider the elite SS in the NFL?

Posted by KindOfABigDeal
Houston
Member since Jan 2008
448 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:39 pm to
quote:

Try not being smug about it


Hoodoo Man- I'm not being smug. Read it like someone is smiling with joking type banter. I'm not on here to stir shite up like some assholes. I'm just giving you my opinion. I could care less if anyone agrees or disagrees. I'm not worked up nor will I ever be. These clowns on here that talk tough behind a computer are a joke. There is nothing on here I wouldn't say to anyone's face and I'm usually in a joking type mood. Take that for what its worth
Posted by LooseCannon22282
South Alabama Fan
Member since May 2008
36004 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:42 pm to
quote:

Weddle though can actually cover a little, he's not very good, but he's serviceable.


the guy had 7 INT's last year
Posted by KindOfABigDeal
Houston
Member since Jan 2008
448 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:46 pm to
What are you basing any of this on? Weddle is average, Landry can't cover you and is always hurt. Like I said, Pollard was cut by the worst pass defense in NFL history. And if Whitner was any good, he'd still be in Buffalo. He was a high first round pick and they let him go. No one does that unless his price is ridiculous.

So again, what is this based on? you heard someone on ESPN say they were good? I watch the games, these guys suck. And for the record, I graduated from LSU. I love LSU. Landry was great at LSU. He's awful in the league. No troll, that's stupid shite.
Posted by Hugo Stiglitz
Member since Oct 2010
72937 posts
Posted on 4/18/12 at 11:51 pm to
You still haven't answered my question of who you consider the elite SS in the NFL, and you don't have to say Polomalu.
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