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TigersFan64
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4660 posts

The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
In my opinion, this was one of the best documentaries ever. It's totally absorbing and thought-provoking. It made me look at Robert S. McNamara in a new light. The tape recordings of his phone conversations with JFK and LBJ are very interesting and revealing. His thoughts on the Tokyo Fire Raid and the Cuban Missile Crisis are also extremely interesting.

The Fog of War - trailer


Tpayne99
LSU Fan
Da Bayou
Member since Jan 2019
259 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
What do you watch in on?


TigersFan64
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4660 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
I originally saw it in the theatre, then bought a copy of it on DVD.

I think Amazon should have it. Netflix may have it on DVD.
This post was edited on 5/15 at 11:25 pm


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TigersFan64
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4660 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
I found this link to the full film (I think, anyways):

The Fog of War


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vuvuzela
Alabama Fan
Oregon
Member since Jun 2010
8006 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
My favorite documentary. I tell anyone who likes documentaries it's a much watch. May watch again!


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prplhze2000
LSU Fan
Parts Unknown
Member since Jan 2007
41731 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
He can go to hell


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Amadeo
Harvard Fan
Member since Jan 2004
1655 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
Does he explain why they allowed Khrushchev to drag his nuts across their foreheads during the Cuban Missile Crisis?


Arksulli
Arkansas Fan
Fayetteville
Member since Aug 2014
15419 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
I'll give it a watch but I can't help but think its an hour and a half of a drunken McNamara thanking Rumsfeld for replacing him as the worst Secretary of Defense ever.


colorchangintiger
Houston Astros Fan
Dan Carlin
Member since Nov 2005
29737 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
I agree. One of my favorites.


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Dawgirl
Georgia Fan
Member since Oct 2015
2775 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
Saw this when it first came out. Very good documentary for a democrat
This post was edited on 5/16 at 8:49 am


theGarnetWay
South Carolina Fan
Washington, D.C.
Member since Mar 2010
19571 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
Watched it in my Poli 101 class in undergrad. Really good movie but definitely McNamara trying to defend/apologize/justify/protect his own legacy before he died.


TigersFan64
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4660 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
Actually they dragged their nuts across Kruschev's forehead. Kruschev was so discredited at home that he soon was removed from power after the Cuban Missile Crisis. Of course, I realize that right-wing hacks are sorry that JFK prevented a nuclear war.


TigersFan64
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4660 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
I never had any love for McNamara before I saw the film, but after I heard the tape of him telling Kennedy in '63, "We need a way out of Vietnam and this is a way of doing it" I had more respect for him.
This post was edited on 5/16 at 7:46 pm


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TigersFan64
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4660 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
Why "for a Democrat?"



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TigersFan64
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4660 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
Actually, you may be surprised at how sharp McNamara is in the film even though he was 85 at the time. I hope I'm that mentally sharp at 85.


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Amadeo
Harvard Fan
Member since Jan 2004
1655 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
quote:

Actually they dragged their nuts across Kruschev's forehead. Kruschev was so discredited at home that he soon was removed from power after the Cuban Missile Crisis. Of course, I realize that right-wing hacks are sorry that JFK prevented a nuclear war.

Try to follow:

When that invasion failed at the Bay of Pigs in 1961, unfortunately that wasn’t the end of the matter. The CIA proceeded to initiate terrorist attacks and acts of sabotage on the island. Even worse, it entered into a partnership with the Mafia, one of the world’s most criminal organizations, to assassinate Castro.

Needless to say, Castro knew full well that the U.S. military and the CIA had not dropped their obsession with regime change after the fiasco at the Bay of Pigs. He also knew that there was no way that the Cuban army and the Cuban people could possibly defeat U.S. forces in a full-scale U.S. military invasion of Cuba.

So, Castro turned to the Soviet Union for help in deterring another U.S. invasion of Cuba, who then payed a visit to the island, only this time they brought "Luca Brasi" with them and assured President Kennedy that either he cease with any notion of invading Cuba again or the whole southeastern portion of the continent would be evaporated.

So, what were the terms of the deal that JFK entered into with Khrushchev to settle the Cuban Missile Crisis? The first thing Kennedy did was pledge that the United States would not invade Cuba. Thus, in one fell swoop, Kennedy permanently dashed the hopes, dreams, and obsessions of every single person in the Pentagon and the CIA, whose lives were entirely devoted to ridding the world of communism, especially the communist regime 90 miles away from American shores.

He also secretly pledged to Khrushchev that he would remove U.S. nuclear missiles based in Turkey that were aimed at the Soviet Union.

So in conclusion,

Soviet objective: Protect Cuba from US invasion.

Result:
1)Agreement with the Soviet Union that the United States would never invade Cuba without direct provocation.
2)Withdrawal of American nuclear missiles from Turkey and Italy.
3)Creation of a nuclear hotline between the United States and the Soviet Union thus ultimately making this a safer world to live in.

Khrushchev orchestrated some of the finest "nut dragging" of the 20th century and he accomplished this through fear alone. Remember, Castro wanted him to fire his missiles, but Khrushchev said nyet.

I'm sorry that your little President, the "grandfather of all future soyboys" and his little "Irish curse" got played on the world stage, and it's too bad that Curtis LeMay isn't alive to give his opinion on the matter, in which he likened Kennedy's handling of the CMC as worse than the Munich Appeasement.

You need not bother with complaints about length of post, because if that's the case you probably don't have the intellect to follow anyway.

And btw, Khrushchev's removal had nothing to do with the CMC and everything to do with his break with China and the food shortages experienced in the Soviet Union of that decade.

This post was edited on 5/16 at 6:31 pm


navy
Navy Fan
Bannedeville, SC
Member since Sep 2010
23435 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara


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TigersFan64
LSU Fan
Baton Rouge, LA
Member since Oct 2014
4660 posts

re: The Fog of War: Eleven Lessons from the Life of Robert S. McNamara
Try to follow:

Kennedy made Kruschev back down and pull the nuclear missiles out of Cuba without resorting to invading Cuba (something I know that little rightwing hacks like yourself love - war - so long as they aren't part of the shooting, such as Dick Cheney and George W. Bush). In the eyes of the world, Kennedy won and Kruschev lost. Unless you think that getting the nuclear missiles out of Cuba while avoiding WWIII wasn't an accomplishment (I know it's hard for little rightwing hacks like you to give just credit to anyone with a (D) and not an (R) in front of their name). And btw, you are full of crap, the outcome of the Cuban Missile Crisis DID hurt Kruschev politically back home. He was out of office within a year of the CMC. It had nothing to do with your lame claim about "China."

You remind me of that clueless little Marine who at the end of "A Few Good Men" asks, "When do we go back to our unit."
This post was edited on 5/16 at 7:49 pm


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