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re: This SB loss did NOTHING to affect Manning's legacy in a negative way
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:18 pm to slackster
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:18 pm to slackster
quote:That's actually a pretty consistent way of doing it since Bradshaw never played in the Wild Card era. The reason I bring up the idea of counting a bye as a win is because when you get a bye, you advance to the Divisional round because of what you did on the field.
Yeah I've got an issue of counting playoff byes as a win. I remember the thread that Ballcaster did using that methodology, and I disagree. IMO, Peyton gets plenty of credit for his ridiculously good regular seasons, hence the byes, but I don't believe you should count them as a win in the divisional round. Personally, I wouldn't count the wildcard round at all. Start with the divisional round.
2
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:20 pm to ballscaster
Wait, so Peyton fans are counting a bye as a win? 
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:21 pm to ballscaster
quote:I can understand your reasoning, but to me, you don't earn a win by skipping a round. You have to take the field.
That's actually a pretty consistent way of doing it since Bradshaw never played in the Wild Card era. The reason I bring up the idea of counting a bye as a win is because when you get a bye, you advance to the Divisional round because of what you did on the field.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:22 pm to boom roasted
quote:Clever move by Ben Roethlisberger, then. He didn't make the playoffs, so his legacy isn't negatively affected by a playoff loss.
He's also has more losses than anyone. I think this is what everyone is focusing on with regards to his legacy.
You do realize that Manning's 11-12 playoff record is better than, say, Kurt Warners 9-4 playoff record, right?
quote:What's better--struggling in the playoffs 12 times or struggling in the playoffs 4 times?
I do think he struggles in the playoffs.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:24 pm to boom roasted
quote:You take the field 16 times to get that bye.
I can understand your reasoning, but to me, you don't earn a win by skipping a round. You have to take the field.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:25 pm to ballscaster
quote:I don't agree with that. It's not a better record.
You do realize that Manning's 11-12 playoff record is better than, say, Kurt Warners 9-4 playoff record, right?
quote:Making it to the playoffs that many times is quite the achievement and speaks to his ability to dominate in the regular season. It does not speak to his ability in the playoffs, which is what everyone is talking about.
What's better--struggling in the playoffs 12 times or struggling in the playoffs 4 times?
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:25 pm to Korin
quote:Manning and Kaepernick had the same number of playoff wins and losses this year. Which quarterback's team went further?
Wait, so Peyton fans are counting a bye as a win?
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:26 pm to ballscaster
quote:You know exactly what I meant so I'm not going to waste any time explaining it to you.
You take the field 16 times to get that bye.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:27 pm to boom roasted
quote:You're saying, then, that losing in the playoffs is better than not making the playoffs.
I don't agree with that. It's not a better record.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:28 pm to ballscaster
quote:Yes, losing in the playoffs is better than not making the playoffs. Making it to the playoffs is an achievement.
You're saying, then, that losing in the playoffs is better than not making the playoffs.
That doesn't go to what you said. You said 11-12 is a better playoff record than 9-4. Simple math tells you that it's not.
This post was edited on 2/3/14 at 12:30 pm
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:29 pm to boom roasted
quote:
You said 11-12 is a better playoff record than 9-4. Simple math tells you that it's not.
I'd rather be 11-12 in the playoffs then 9-4. That illustrates more success.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:29 pm to boom roasted
quote:Simple math tells you that 9-4 is a higher winning percentage. Simple logic tells you that 11-12 is a better record.
That's not what I'm saying. You said 11-12 is a better playoff record than 9-4. Simple math tells you that it's not.
The worst playoff record you can possibly have is 0-0. 0-1 is better than 0-0.
This post was edited on 2/3/14 at 12:31 pm
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:31 pm to ballscaster
I think you're getting off topic. His legacy, in my opinion, is that he is an outstanding regular season QB that doesn't pull through in the playoffs. I believe his playoff record shows that. He's been to the playoffs a shitload of times but consistently doesn't pull through.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:32 pm to ballscaster
quote:No one denies his regular season prowess. That's what makes the DRAMATIC fall of in his career numbers from regular season vs the postseason such an issue. If you have an A+ QB, you're kind of hoping for that postseason.
You take the field 16 times to get that bye.
The question of choking for ANY player is how does his performance in such situations compare to HIS typical performance.
No-one thinks the 225 hitter hitting career 225 in the postseason is choking but, the career 315 hitter doing so it's another story.
In fact, if the career 225 hitter is career 275 postseason, one might say he "steps up" in the post season while 275 from the typical 315 hitter would be considered disappointing.
Some guys step up. Some don't. Manning doesn't.
This post was edited on 2/3/14 at 12:34 pm
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:34 pm to boom roasted
quote:Yet he's pulled through more than all but five quarterbacks, and that's without me "counting the byes." Two more playoff wins, and he's in the top three. That does not support your opinion that he doesn't pull through in the playoffs.
His legacy, in my opinion, is that he is an outstanding regular season QB that doesn't pull through in the playoffs.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:35 pm to SettleDown
quote:This is factually incorrect. He has too many playoff wins for this to make sense.
Some guys step up. Some don't. Manning doesn't.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:36 pm to ballscaster
quote:He's been to the playoffs as assload of times and has 1 SB. His conversion rate is terrible.
Yet he's pulled through more than all but five quarterbacks, and that's without me "counting the byes." Two more playoff wins, and he's in the top three. That does not support your opinion that he doesn't pull through in the playoffs.
I'm out.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:39 pm to ballscaster
quote:look at HIS career QB numbers in the post season vs regular season. It's as if he has been body snatched. THAT is factually correct.
This is factually incorrect. He has too many playoff wins for this to make sense.
The others in the GOAT discussion have career playoff numbers very similar to their career regular season numbers with Montana being the freak who was body snatched for the better apparently.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 12:43 pm to SettleDown
I have to say this again. I was completely rooting for Peyton last night. But, I was really taken aback by sideline shots of him in the first quarter. The dude looked beaten already after the safety. I couldn't believe it.
Posted on 2/3/14 at 1:39 pm to SettleDown
quote:
Montana being the freak who was body snatched for the better apparently.
And this is why he will always known as the GOAT.
You know what his playoff record is? 16-7 Super bowl record 4-0. That's how you become known as the GOAT not putting up numbers in the regular season. PM is just another era QB that benefited from rule changes and loaded teams.
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