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re: ATL Thread: Opening Day April 26th, 1995 Giants at Braves
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:01 pm to OBUDan
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:01 pm to OBUDan
quote:
ason Heyward has already racked up a more valuable season than Justice EVER did (2012 based on fWAR). Further, his rookie season was worth nearly as much as Justice's career highs (which came in his mid 20s, an age Heyward is yet to reach).
The frick is this nonsense?
You're telling me you would rather have Heyward of 2012 over 1993 or 1997 David Justice?
WAR is not the end all/be all stat you pseudo sabremetric nerds like to think it is.
3
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:04 pm to OBUDan
quote:
Jason Heyward has already racked up a more valuable season than Justice EVER did (2012 based on fWAR). Further, his rookie season was worth nearly as much as Justice's career highs (which came in his mid 20s, an age Heyward is yet to reach).
Saying you'd take Justice is basically saying, "Oh, I'd take Honus Wagner over Babe Ruth" in 1919, cause "Honus' career averages are better." Just kind of a nonsense thing to say.
no, the question is 1995 Justice vs. 2013 Heyward. I'm going Justice all the way on this one. Heyward has always won the championship trophy for "potential" and he may live up to it, but for now he hasn't.
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:12 pm to Moustache
quote:
You're telling me you would rather have Heyward of 2012 over 1993 or 1997 David Justice?
If I'm interested in total player contributions, yes.
Heyward was worth more last year than Justice ever was to any team he played on. Just because you disagree doesn't make it not so.
This post was edited on 4/12/13 at 12:15 pm
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:13 pm to Moustache
quote:
Heyward has always won the championship trophy for "potential" and he may live up to it, but for now he hasn't.
This is so stupid.
He's 23! 23!
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:20 pm to Moustache
quote:
WAR is not the end all/be all stat you pseudo sabremetric nerds like to think it is.
Also, this is such a lame-o argument. The whole "lives in your mother's basement, doesn't watch baseball" nonsense is so tired and worthless.
Try composing an actual argument.
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:31 pm to OBUDan
quote:
This is so stupid.
He's 23! 23!
And that's why I said he may live up to it. But for now, he gets really lost at the plate. The question is Heyward NOW or Justice in 1995. Not what heyward will become vs. what Justice became.
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:34 pm to Moustache
quote:
The question is Heyward NOW or Justice in 1995.
And the answer is still Heyward.
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:38 pm to OBUDan
quote:
Also, this is such a lame-o argument. The whole "lives in your mother's basement, doesn't watch baseball" nonsense is so tired and worthless.
Try composing an actual argument.
Wasn't even arguing that. I'm just saying you guys feel that WAR (which is a VERY fricking arbitrary stat by the way) means everything.
I think looking at a guy with these slash lines .269/.335/.479 is not in the same stratosphere as a guy with these 329/.418/.596.
So, you're saying Heyward made up for it defensively then. Ok......consider this article LINK
that discusses OF alignment and kind of downplays the importance of defense.
At the end of the day, if given the choice of 2 of these 3 categories, which two would you pick?
Good hitting
Good pitching
Good defense
Most would pick hitting and pitching, as defense is completely secondary. Not to say it isn't helpful, but how you can make the statement that Heyward 2012 has surpassed Justice's best year is beyond me. I guess using a stat, you can tailor it however you wanna tailor it. Maybe defensive ability overrated in your stats.
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:41 pm to OBUDan
quote:
And the answer is still Heyward.
Let's use your stat. I know it's only been a few games, but damn if he isn't very invaluable right now.
WAR------negative number for Heyward thus far. I wonder if Justice was negative for ATL at any point in 1995?
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:42 pm to Moustache
What the hell is going on in this thread?
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:44 pm to RollDatRoll
Dan is owning fools
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:44 pm to lsu31always
DO YOU HAVE AN ADVANCED STAT TO BACK UP THAT STATEMENT?!?!?!
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:51 pm to Caplewood
Why so much animosity in the ATL thread?
Focus our energy on hating the Nats.
Focus our energy on hating the Nats.
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:53 pm to Moustache
quote:
WAR------negative number for Heyward thus far. I wonder if Justice was negative for ATL at any point in 1995?
It's really not worth the effort to check on 35 random PA's from David Justice's 1995 to compare.
It's 35 PAs of what should be 600 some.
No one would argue that he's NOT off to a sluggish start, but 35 PAs is so statistically insignificant it really doesn't mean anything.
I'm guessing Heyward has a big game tonight.
This post was edited on 4/12/13 at 12:56 pm
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:57 pm to lsu31always
quote:
Dan is owning fools
I guess only one stat should be considered when evaluating a player. And one who's formula differs depending on the source.
that and Tris Speaker>Mickey Mantle, Ted Williams, Musial, yas, Honus, and Lou Gehrig.
WAR
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:57 pm to bamafan425
I would let Javy play catcher on this team, he's my all time favorite brave! Was andruw on the 95 team also?
Posted on 4/12/13 at 12:58 pm to FlatTownProdigalSon
Andruw was 96
Posted on 4/12/13 at 1:01 pm to Caplewood
Sure do its called heyward never got served with divorce papers mid game
Posted on 4/12/13 at 1:01 pm to OBUDan
quote:
'm guessing Heyward has a big game tonight.
I hope so and I do think Heyward will become a star better than Justice ever hope of being. But, I guess that's where our philosophy differs. I weight offense a LOT more than i weight defense, especially for a corner OF spot or 1B.
Posted on 4/12/13 at 1:03 pm to OBUDan
quote:
'm guessing Heyward has a big game tonight.
I'm sure he knows it, but he needs to keep his hands more still. He's dropping them bad.
Anyone else feel Heyward stands WAAAAAY too far from the plate more than anyone else they see in MLB?
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