re: 3 presidents have come and gone and he’s still here winning

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Pretty much. Especially comparing it to a 269 sample size B.

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He doesn't know that Belichick coached the Ravens and not the current Browns.

Protip: 117 games is more than 20. A lot more.

"Brady would be a clipboard holder without Belichick!"

You're the one saying we should ignore 117 and focus on 20.

You brought up 20. It's on this very page.

Because the backups have played 20 games. If they had played 117 I would use that number.

I don’t see how that’s relevant. Either way, you’re assuming he’s the same coach today as he was in 2004 and 1997. Coaches improve. Who’s to say that he didn’t change things when he got the New England job?

I’m not making some controversial statement. Tom Brady’s replacements have largely produced when he wasn’t available.

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I don’t see how that’s relevant. Either way, you’re assuming he’s the same coach today as he was in 2004 and 1997. Coaches improve. Who’s to say that he didn’t change things when he got the New England job?

I’m not making some controversial statement. Tom Brady’s replacements have largely produced when he wasn’t available.

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I'm with you on this one. Completely different teams in a completely different era. One would think that the most relevant sample to look at would be the games where the only real difference is the presence or lack of Brady under center.

Eight pages of envy, I love it.

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I don’t see how that’s relevant. Either way, you’re assuming he’s the same coach today as he was in 2004 and 1997. Coaches improve. Who’s to say that he didn’t change things when he got the New England job?

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He went 5-11 in his first year with an All-Pro QB in Drew Bledsoe as his starter. The Patriots were 0-2 in 2001 when Brady got his first start. After Brady took the reins from an injured Bledsoe, they went 12-2 the rest of the way.

One thing changed between 2000 and 2001 and that was the starting QB. Before that switch happened, Belichick was seen by most as just an average coach making his way through the NFL. Now he's seen as the undisputed GOAT.

People love to bring up 2008and 2016 to dispute Brady's GOAT status, but always tend to forget these things in regard to those two seasons:

- In 2008, the Patriots had the worst schedule in the NFL and the weakest of the Bill Belichick-Tom Brady era. Despite this and the return of almost every starter from a team that went 16-0 the year before, the Patriots failed to make the playoffs.

- The Patriots offense that season, which had put up the biggest numbers ever before seen by an NFL offense just one year prior, was pedestrian with Matt Cassel at QB. Cassel threw for less than 3,700 yards with 21 TDs and 11 INTs. Compare that to Tom Brady the year before (4,806 yards with 50 TDs and 8 INTs).

- It can't be re-stated enough that Cassel was at the head of what was virtually the same team that had gone undefeated a year earlier. Despite that, along with the easiest schedule he could have possibly hoped to have seen, he could not get the 2008 New England Patriots into the playoffs.

- In 2016, when Brady was suspended four games, the Patriots struggled to win an upset victory over the Arizona Cardinals to start the year. Problem was...that victory was a paper tiger as the Cardinals were nowhere near the team people thought they were going to be. Arizona went 7-8-1 that season.

- The Patriots then went on to defeat the Dolphins and Texans - two decent teams - though both games were played at home. They then inexplicably were shut out, at home, by the Buffalo Bills of all teams in the last game of Brady's suspension. Brady would go on to light up that same Bills team, on the road, four weeks later.