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re: Any of you bitcoin bashers big Taleb fans?
Posted on 6/2/13 at 11:40 am to Vols&Shaft83
Posted on 6/2/13 at 11:40 am to Vols&Shaft83
quote:
I envision you as a cock with ears.
1
Posted on 6/2/13 at 12:00 pm to LSURussian
Precisely
Posted on 6/2/13 at 3:00 pm to TheLankiestLawyer
quote:
Also, what the government will do to choke it off once (if) it takes off. The strengths of the government are in attacking it at the point of exchange and the computing power/cyber trickery to mess with the infrastructure and specific exchanges.
It is a very intriguing idea, though.
This part right here. Bitcoins aren't going to "replace" money because governments won't allow it.
And since governments are going to want their tax revenue in their own currency, you'll never pay able to pay for most major function with bitcoins.
In short, bitcoin is "solving" a problem that doesn't really exist, unless you're in a criminal enterprise. The dollar is pretty stable and has a track record in its various forms going back centuries. It's easily tracked but for most people that's not an issue.
The volatility of bitocoin isn't something to gloat about; it's a problem. How can you make a serious exchange off of something with such pronounced price swings. It's tough to price anything and it's tough to get people to actually part with the coins.
As a technology issue, though, it's quite fascinating.
Posted on 6/2/13 at 6:07 pm to Powerman
quote:
I know very little about bit coins
quote:
You're right. I know dick about investing
Yet you start bitcoins threads on the Money Talk Board.
Posted on 6/2/13 at 6:38 pm to StrangeBrew
You don't have to know anything about investing to know about money.
Posted on 6/2/13 at 6:50 pm to Walking the Earth
quote:
The volatility of bitocoin isn't something to gloat about; it's a problem. How can you make a serious exchange off of something with such pronounced price swings. It's tough to price anything and it's tough to get people to actually part with the coins.
great point. is there a fix? is one even being sought?
Posted on 6/2/13 at 7:17 pm to 90proofprofessional
quote:
great point. is there a fix? is one even being sought?
It's been hovering at about $120 for almost a month now. There has been very little volatility compared to the previous 4 months.
And nothing can be done about it. The more and more it gets used it will naturally gain in value.
Posted on 6/2/13 at 8:50 pm to joshnorris14
But the decentralized nature of it leaves it more open to manipulation by outside attacks.
I target one exchange and cause turmoil and cash in and that exchange is fricked bc they are not linked with other exchanges or some overarching entity that offers protection and insurance from malicious actors.
The same reason some of you think it is revolutionary (the fact that it is decentralized) is the same reason it has an inherent flaw, in my opinion.
I want my currency relatively stable. I just don't see how bit coins get there from where they are now.
I target one exchange and cause turmoil and cash in and that exchange is fricked bc they are not linked with other exchanges or some overarching entity that offers protection and insurance from malicious actors.
The same reason some of you think it is revolutionary (the fact that it is decentralized) is the same reason it has an inherent flaw, in my opinion.
I want my currency relatively stable. I just don't see how bit coins get there from where they are now.
Posted on 6/2/13 at 9:25 pm to TheLankiestLawyer
quote:
I want my currency relatively stable. I just don't see how bit coins get there from where they are now.
Well it can't be totally stable until it "gets there". It's a new currency. The more its adopted the more it will swing. And yes, early on it's going to have problems.
But with the problems come fixes. Eventually bitcoin, or something like it, will take hold.
Posted on 6/2/13 at 9:26 pm to TheLankiestLawyer
quote:
But the decentralized nature of it leaves it more open to manipulation by outside attacks.
This has been incredibly insignificant. Many of the posters play this up like it's a huge deal. Let's put it in perspective, however. YTD, bitcoin has risen in value 700% (based on $15 value estimate at the beginning of the year and a current value of $120).
Sure, the value got up to $266 earlier this year, but then that bubble burst. No big deal. There have been two major bubbles in the history of bitcoin and many smaller ones. And guess what? There will be more of them.
quote:
I target one exchange and cause turmoil and cash in and that exchange is fricked bc they are not linked with other exchanges or some overarching entity that offers protection and insurance from malicious actors.
We are exiting amateur hour and about to enter into the VC phase of bitcoin. There are at least 5, probably more, brand new major exchanges working to come online as I type this. Their biggest holdup is dealing with the regulatory environment.
More feature-rich exchanges will make what you discussed a worry of the past.
quote:
The same reason some of you think it is revolutionary (the fact that it is decentralized) is the same reason it has an inherent flaw, in my opinion.
You're wrong. Not trying to be a dick, but you are, just as most of the bitcoin haters here are wrong.
I've been discussing bitcoin on this site since it was valued at about $12. I have gotten the same arguments against it since then. Over and over again. And yet bitcoin still endures. Bitcoin has grown not only in value since I started discussing it, but also in overall use. Not to mention all the VC money pouring into it.
quote:
I want my currency relatively stable. I just don't see how bit coins get there from where they are now.
They get there by finding a reasonable value. And $120 ain't it.
Stay tuned fellas. You guys will continue to be wrong about it. I will be laughing at you 6 months from now. I will still be laughing at you a year from now, 2 years from now and 5 years from now.
BTW, is anyone going to address the OP?
It's funny because I remember reading threads where the money board geniuses heaped praise on Taleb....now no one wants to own up?
Posted on 6/2/13 at 9:38 pm to WikiTiger
quote:
Stay tuned fellas. You guys will continue to be wrong about it. I will be laughing at you 6 months from now. I will still be laughing at you a year from now, 2 years from now and 5 years from now.
Not me.
My position is that bitcoin will not supplant the dollar or even co-exist with it in any meaningful way.
Right now, I'm the one that gets to laugh. We'll see if that changes in six months, a year from now, two years from now or five years from now.
Posted on 6/2/13 at 9:45 pm to WikiTiger
quote:
You're wrong. Not trying to be a dick, but you are, just as most of the bitcoin haters here are wrong.
I've been discussing bitcoin on this site since it was valued at about $12. I have gotten the same arguments against it since then. Over and over again. And yet bitcoin still endures. Bitcoin has grown not only in value since I started discussing it, but also in overall use. Not to mention all the VC money pouring into it.
Your retort did not address my point other than to say "you're wrong" . The amount of time you have been discussing bit coin and the fact that it has lasted 2 or 3 years or whatever is of no consequence to the fact that the decentralized nature of it does leave it open to outside attack. A bunch of individual exchanges are left to deal with malicious actors by themselves. There is no overarching system to protect the infrastructure as a whole. And that is a problem going forward. Maybe the entry of VC money will do something to rectify that, but that remains to be seen. But the fact that nefarious people can perpetrate a DNS attack on an exchange and the people who have their bit coins parked there can see the value decrease by 30-40% is a big deal for the long term viability of bit coins.
I don't know who or what Taleb is so I can't comment on that. I was just commenting on some of the strengths and weaknesses I see in the new currency.
Posted on 6/2/13 at 9:53 pm to TheLankiestLawyer
quote:
Your retort did not address my point other than to say "you're wrong" .
Because, as I suggested, I've heard all this shite before and I'm tired of repeating myself.
First off, bitcoin is 2 things: 1. a currency. It's exchange value is certainly important to its value as a currency. I don't deny that. But you post something so stupid and silly like commenting on its volatility while ignoring that it's up 700% YTD. Excuse me if I don't think your point is relevant.
2. Bitcoin is a transaction network. The exchange value of bitcoin is irrelevant to its use as a transaction network. And it's transaction network is technologically superior to any of the proprietary networks available, and it's much, much cheaper to use.
quote:
the decentralized nature of it does leave it open to outside attack.
Sigh.
No. Not correct at all. Manipulating the exchange rate does not equal attacking bitcoin. And its decentralized nature is exactly what protects it from technical attack. But if you really want to discuss it's technological weaknesses, then I do invite you to read this page: https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Weaknesses
quote:
There is no overarching system to protect the infrastructure as a whole.
Sigh. So wrong.
Exchanges DO NOT EQUAL bitcoin. Why can't you people grasp that?
Posted on 6/2/13 at 10:03 pm to WikiTiger
Is the endgame for Joe and Jane Citizen to use bit coin and it completely replace the dollar? If that is the idea, then the volatility is absolutely pertinent to this discussion. A person is smart, but people are stupid. If you want this thing to to catch on and become ubiquitous, then the volatility and risk that my bit coin can be devalued significantly without me having a chance to cash out is going to have to drop significantly.
The 700% increase in value is great. It is quite obvious that word has gotten out about bit coin to a certain segment of the population. It is my guess that that population is the technologically savvy and the ones who may lean libertarian/anarchist who value bitcoin for non-pecuniary purposes.
I guess it comes down to how widely used and accepted we expect it to be. I just don't see it becoming universal if there is still a significant amount of volatility. Some people have the stomach for that sort of risk. I don't think Joe Citizen and Jane Housewife do.
But reasonable minds can certainly disagree.
The 700% increase in value is great. It is quite obvious that word has gotten out about bit coin to a certain segment of the population. It is my guess that that population is the technologically savvy and the ones who may lean libertarian/anarchist who value bitcoin for non-pecuniary purposes.
I guess it comes down to how widely used and accepted we expect it to be. I just don't see it becoming universal if there is still a significant amount of volatility. Some people have the stomach for that sort of risk. I don't think Joe Citizen and Jane Housewife do.
But reasonable minds can certainly disagree.
This post was edited on 6/2/13 at 10:12 pm
Posted on 6/3/13 at 9:16 am to WikiTiger
quote:
1. a currency.
Wrong. The textbook definition of a currency is that it must widely be accepted for goods and services.
quote:
cur·ren·cy
/'k?r?nse/
Noun
A system of money in general use in a particular country.
The fact or quality of being generally accepted or in use.
It's not generally accepted for anything at this point.
Posted on 6/4/13 at 10:01 am to Powerman
I think the bitcoin technology is very interesting considering the door it opens, the possibilities....However, just don't think bitcoin at this time is a credible alternative to our current money system.
Most of the chatter on here though has to do with clashes of personality at this point and little rational discussion.
Most of the chatter on here though has to do with clashes of personality at this point and little rational discussion.
Posted on 7/7/13 at 10:52 am to gizmoflak
quote:
It ain't going sub $50 this year
Wanna' bet?
BTC was at $125 on June 1 when you made your prediction. Are you standing by it? (It hit $63 yesterday.)
This post was edited on 7/7/13 at 11:22 am
Posted on 7/7/13 at 11:04 am to LSURussian
Damn you Russian, that was mine! I was going to post my purchase to his response.
This post was edited on 7/7/13 at 11:06 am
Posted on 7/7/13 at 11:15 am to ItNeverRains
Sorry. I'll check with you next time....
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