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Message
re: A stock recommendation for the money board ... MICROVISION
Posted on 7/23/09 at 10:26 pm to Chicken
Posted on 7/23/09 at 10:26 pm to Chicken
I'm obviously not a "pumper" (check my join date, post count, and money board post history) ... I'm just a regular ole LSU fan that knows about a company/stock that I thought others might be interested in. I think an occasional thread about a specific investment on here is a great idea and will provide for a great read if nothing else. If you read the OP, you'd see I acknowledged the difference between my post and others in the past that were deleted. The reason for doing that was in the other threads people just spouted off an idea without providing a decent amount of reasoning behind the investment thesis. It's a pretty black and white difference between my post and something a "pumper" would do.
I think you have enough saavy users on the money board to route out any folks that come on here for the wrong reasons.
I think you have enough saavy users on the money board to route out any folks that come on here for the wrong reasons.
This post was edited on 7/23/09 at 10:33 pm
Posted on 7/23/09 at 10:35 pm to Zilla
wow .... sometimes I wonder if the owners here realize why this site has value and where it comes from ...
I'm sure the folks that were involved in this 81 reply thread are glad their conversation has been forced to be over ..... check out the # of replies on all the other money board threads .... way to go
This post was edited on 7/23/09 at 10:37 pm
Posted on 7/23/09 at 11:37 pm to Zilla
Glad you guys are making money on a temporary buzz, but Texas Instruments has been on this for quite some time. The Optoma Pico projector has already been on the market for a while, and TI is making contracts with tons of manufacturers of small devices around the world.
There is no denying that there will be room for competition, but TI has a lot of muscle and dollars to throw around and they have been in the projector biz for quite a while. At the recent Infocomm 2009 (the largest trade show in the world for audio-visual performance products), TI introduced partnerships with Coretronic (largest DLP projector OEM manufacturer in the world) with Luminous Devices LINK In addition LG Electronics and Luminous are introducing new pocket projectors using LED technology (cheaper to produce, much longer battery life) LINK
Additional news: LINK LINK LINK LINK LINK
None of these companies are Venture Capital companies like Microvision. They have big bucks and the key business relationships in place. Sorry to throw water on your parade, but I don't believe that this is an opportunity that comes around "once in a lifetime".
There is no denying that there will be room for competition, but TI has a lot of muscle and dollars to throw around and they have been in the projector biz for quite a while. At the recent Infocomm 2009 (the largest trade show in the world for audio-visual performance products), TI introduced partnerships with Coretronic (largest DLP projector OEM manufacturer in the world) with Luminous Devices LINK In addition LG Electronics and Luminous are introducing new pocket projectors using LED technology (cheaper to produce, much longer battery life) LINK
Additional news: LINK LINK LINK LINK LINK
None of these companies are Venture Capital companies like Microvision. They have big bucks and the key business relationships in place. Sorry to throw water on your parade, but I don't believe that this is an opportunity that comes around "once in a lifetime".
This post was edited on 7/23/09 at 11:53 pm
Posted on 7/24/09 at 9:44 am to Proejo
the optoma is a POS ... have you read the reviews ? it's basically so bad it's unusable ... the TI product is very limited in comparison to MVIS ... if you are apple or the like, you will not be going with a TI product ...sorry to rain on your hometown parade...if you want some links trashing the optoma or touting the technical differences between MVIS and TI projector I can provide them...
Posted on 7/24/09 at 9:48 am to threesheets
your blog came across on my microvision google alert ... nice :
Posted on 7/24/09 at 7:20 pm to Zilla
quote:hey numbnuts, don't get your thong in a wad because you can't follow the rules that have long been understood on this board.
wow .... sometimes I wonder if the owners here realize why this site has value and where it comes from
Posted on 7/24/09 at 8:37 pm to Zilla
Zilla, I nomally srug off stock recmmendations from message boards but your analysis was compelling enough for me to check out MVIS's products. Needless to say I was impressed. I see these laser projectors as an option on every iPhone, blackberry, laptop, etc. I bought 10 lots @ 3.15 and will probably by another 10 on a slight pull back.

Posted on 7/24/09 at 9:26 pm to Chicken
Hey CHICKEN, yea I have been a part of those conversations.... the ones that mentioned what should be required if someone wants to discuss a specific investment ....
I think the last comment you had on the subject was simply a question on whether we wanted stock tips :
LINK
have you even read the feedback from my post in this thread..... it's like you don't want this site to expand from the "OT"
.... now you are calling posters like myself "numbnuts" ... thats a great way to attract new posters that add value and drive traffic to your site...once again, way to go
I think the last comment you had on the subject was simply a question on whether we wanted stock tips :
quote:
Do we really want to have stock tips on this board? Seems like a really bad idea...
LINK
have you even read the feedback from my post in this thread..... it's like you don't want this site to expand from the "OT"
This post was edited on 7/24/09 at 9:41 pm
Posted on 7/24/09 at 9:40 pm to Zilla
I called you a numbnut because you are being a numbnut. We all agreed early on that this board would not be used to pump up stocks, which is EXACTLY what you are doing. Again, pull your thong out your butt and move on.
Posted on 7/24/09 at 9:57 pm to Chicken
quote:
this board would not be used to pump up stocks, which is EXACTLY what you are doing.
dude....how can you say that ? you are implying that my intentions are to manipulate the stock price by posting positive information (regardless of truth) so that tigerdroppings.com money board users will buy so many shares the price will go up ???
I'm obviously really excited about this company/opportunity and I like the idea of letting others in on it.... I really put a lot of effort into sharing the information in an appropriate manner, and by the sounds of things, a lot of your users (who post a lot more in the money board than yo do) agree :
quote:
But thanks for the introduction to MVIS. It looks intriguing.
quote:
I might look into this.
quote:
this is a really cool product!! if you believe in the company and the product and where its going, it doesnt matter the cost right now. i just thought of that myself btw fwiw. im young and i have some monies right now set aside for investing and im looking for a bunch of high risk/high reward stocks. this seems like low risk/high reward. i can see people doing presentations, watching movies, and showing their friends a video on youtube. how many times has a friend of yours tried to show you something on their phone and its always 4 people huddled around a phone and someone always has bad breath. this solves it. what a cool product
quote:
Frankly, I appreciate you bringing the company to my attention. It has an interesting product and story. Without your post, I may never have heard of it before it got "discovered."
quote:
MVIS is off to the races this morning....up almost 5% as of now. Not bad.
quote:
You're about to break out here Zilla IMO:
quote:
I'm buying in this one if it breaks resistance or at the next bounce off support. Got yourself a winner here I say. Thanks for the tip.
quote:
Thanks for all that Zilla.
quote:
Looking like a breakout! Good call Zilla.
quote:
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quote:
Ok, thanks for the explanation!
quote:
Zilla, I nomally srug off stock recmmendations from message boards but your analysis was compelling enough for me to check out MVIS's products. Needless to say I was impressed. I see these laser projectors as an option on every iPhone, blackberry, laptop, etc. I bought 10 lots @ 3.15 and will probably by another 10 on a slight pull back.
This post was edited on 7/24/09 at 9:59 pm
Posted on 7/25/09 at 3:18 am to Zilla
So I'm never a big fan of a research report that claims a stock is down due to "market volatility and manipulation" especially when the company in question has negative $300M FCF. By the company's own admissions in their financial statements: they lack the financial and technical resources to compete, their profits are reliant on other companies to develop technologies that use their product. Plus they're having a hard time getting financing b/c their stock is so low and b/c they make no money. Also, they're considered a penny stock on NASDAQ until price is over $5 (which it hasn't been since 2005?) So until this stock breaks $5 and can be purchased by the big players, you're going to see small volumes moving it a ton. Besides that, their contract revenue for 1st quarter is 78% lower than last year, so if you're going to hold this one, pray for a quick recovery.
The tech sector is not my specialty and I'll admit I didn't take much time reviewing the statements or the products, but the financials look horrible. At least they're keeping costs down. I also don't know anything about day trading, but I'd guess thats the best way to get in this stock. But the first thing I thought of was an acquisition target. They're a very small company with negative cash flow, in a highly technical industry, and is having trouble getting financing.
I also have a tough time believing the financials, especially after clicking on the 21st century prosperity "research" report provided. This is as much of a marketing ploy as any I've ever seen. I skimmed through it and already most of his assumptions are wrong. They do have debt (.5B), the burn rate for last quarter was at $9m, not $6m which would give them only 2 quarters left of operating ability considering they have $16m in cash after Q1. Also, the guy that wrote this report, Jon Herring, wrote in Nov 2008 that the "Gold Rush of 2009 could hand you safe gains of 408%" and said if you buy his program ($295) he'll show you how gold could go as high as $20,000. Doesn't seem like a credible source to me.
But then again, I've been wrong before.
The tech sector is not my specialty and I'll admit I didn't take much time reviewing the statements or the products, but the financials look horrible. At least they're keeping costs down. I also don't know anything about day trading, but I'd guess thats the best way to get in this stock. But the first thing I thought of was an acquisition target. They're a very small company with negative cash flow, in a highly technical industry, and is having trouble getting financing.
I also have a tough time believing the financials, especially after clicking on the 21st century prosperity "research" report provided. This is as much of a marketing ploy as any I've ever seen. I skimmed through it and already most of his assumptions are wrong. They do have debt (.5B), the burn rate for last quarter was at $9m, not $6m which would give them only 2 quarters left of operating ability considering they have $16m in cash after Q1. Also, the guy that wrote this report, Jon Herring, wrote in Nov 2008 that the "Gold Rush of 2009 could hand you safe gains of 408%" and said if you buy his program ($295) he'll show you how gold could go as high as $20,000. Doesn't seem like a credible source to me.
But then again, I've been wrong before.
Posted on 7/25/09 at 8:48 am to BostonAdam
I agree with you about the guy who wrote that.... he doesn't come off that great....BUT... the good thing about that report is there are a lot of good facts about the potential of the company if things work out ... I can't find anything wrong with those statements ... you have to put a filter on somewhat when reading reports like that one .... I disagree with you about financing though, simply check their last financing.....NOBODY is going to let this company go away, WAY to much opportunity... I think the CEO is trying to avoid a takeover and there was mention of a poison pill
Posted on 7/25/09 at 1:17 pm to Zilla
quote:
the optoma is a POS ... have you read the reviews ? it's basically so bad it's unusable ... the TI product is very limited in comparison to MVIS ... if you are apple or the like, you will not be going with a TI product ...sorry to rain on your hometown parade...if you want some links trashing the optoma or touting the technical differences between MVIS and TI projector I can provide them...
You are obviously sold on Microvision to the point that you are overly and emotionally connected. Move on and recognize that there is going to be very stiff competition in this emerging market from some very well funded corporations, in particular from Chinese and Taiwanese companies and that Microvision is no sure bet, especially since their technology is simply an iteration of some other company's technology.
Other "home grown" technology for pico projectors:
Syndiant
Other manufacturers:
bTendo
Light Blue Optics
Maradin
Micron
Posted on 7/25/09 at 2:15 pm to Proejo
not at all... in the end, there will be plenty of room for other players in this market, I recognize that ...
do you deny that the optoma is a POS ? it's garbage ....it's been on the market and nobody is buying it... the TI (do you work for TI ?) is decent, but the show really does have more advantages...especially when it comes to embedding ... now, sydiant's story is compelling I will admit, but they have appeared to just make claims so far ...why don't they demo their product ?
I'm not famaliar with bTendo or Maradin, I appreciate the links ... I've read about LBO and Micron, but admittedly, I do need to freshen up on where they stand.
as far as MVIS being an iteration of other's products... I'm not sure what you mean exactly, but I can tell you this...check out Microvision's company when it comes to patent power :
LINK
do you deny that the optoma is a POS ? it's garbage ....it's been on the market and nobody is buying it... the TI (do you work for TI ?) is decent, but the show really does have more advantages...especially when it comes to embedding ... now, sydiant's story is compelling I will admit, but they have appeared to just make claims so far ...why don't they demo their product ?
I'm not famaliar with bTendo or Maradin, I appreciate the links ... I've read about LBO and Micron, but admittedly, I do need to freshen up on where they stand.
as far as MVIS being an iteration of other's products... I'm not sure what you mean exactly, but I can tell you this...check out Microvision's company when it comes to patent power :
LINK
Posted on 7/25/09 at 5:20 pm to Zilla
I don't work for TI, but I do work in close association as an industry consultant with many technology manufacturers from the US, Japan, Korea and China in the technology sector developing HD telepresence, 3D holographic and various forms of digital displays and wireless communications. Many of these companies work with TI in one form or another. My background in this sector spans 17 years.
Not to belittle Microvision, because they have come a long way in three years, but they face significant hurdles in cash, engineering and manufacturing prowess, not the least of which is the race by Taiwanese, Japanese, French, Korean and Chinese electronics manufacturers to develop their own versions of MEMS technologies. My reply concerning Microvision standing on the backs of others is that they do not hold the patents on the core medium used in their MEMS and that is the laser itself. Without Corning's lasers, Microvision is nothing if not another "me, too" company. Lasers can be produced by multiples of companies around the world and so it is no small leap to expect that others will develop (and are!) their own versions of MEMS and do so in a manner that is more economical and in collaboration with some giants in the industry. The first of these to land a contract with Nokia, LG, Samsung, Sony, Matsushita, etc.. is going to be the one to get a giant leap ahead of others. DLP is a technology many consumers already associate with and certain manufacturers of professional and consumer devices will certainly take that familiarity into account when making decisions about which competing technology to use.
TI is making significant inroads with existing relationships with Samsung, LG and Matsushita and Coretronic. Samsung has already produced a TI Pico projector, as has Coretronic (Optoma). My inside source at TI's DLP Division in Plano, TX met with me in the last month and showed me a prototype 3G phone from Verizon. He was able to stream videos from Hulu and YouTube and display these on the column by the table in the restaurant that we had in lunch in. It looked pretty good. Good enough to discuss business over lunch, which is what the initial first applications will be targeted at: business users.
My opinion is that Microvision is a company ripe for takeover IF (a very big IF) their MEMS engine is so significantly advanced and cheaper to manufacture than other competing technologies that they can offer value. Otherwise, I, unlike you, cannot see that they have the technology or capital to succeed long term as more than a very small niche company. Their market cap is estimated at only $150 Million and they have a LONG way to go in order to achieve that. Investment in it may in the short run, make a valuable play by banking on the excitement of those who are not as deeply involved in this sector as I am. Timing is everything.
Not to belittle Microvision, because they have come a long way in three years, but they face significant hurdles in cash, engineering and manufacturing prowess, not the least of which is the race by Taiwanese, Japanese, French, Korean and Chinese electronics manufacturers to develop their own versions of MEMS technologies. My reply concerning Microvision standing on the backs of others is that they do not hold the patents on the core medium used in their MEMS and that is the laser itself. Without Corning's lasers, Microvision is nothing if not another "me, too" company. Lasers can be produced by multiples of companies around the world and so it is no small leap to expect that others will develop (and are!) their own versions of MEMS and do so in a manner that is more economical and in collaboration with some giants in the industry. The first of these to land a contract with Nokia, LG, Samsung, Sony, Matsushita, etc.. is going to be the one to get a giant leap ahead of others. DLP is a technology many consumers already associate with and certain manufacturers of professional and consumer devices will certainly take that familiarity into account when making decisions about which competing technology to use.
TI is making significant inroads with existing relationships with Samsung, LG and Matsushita and Coretronic. Samsung has already produced a TI Pico projector, as has Coretronic (Optoma). My inside source at TI's DLP Division in Plano, TX met with me in the last month and showed me a prototype 3G phone from Verizon. He was able to stream videos from Hulu and YouTube and display these on the column by the table in the restaurant that we had in lunch in. It looked pretty good. Good enough to discuss business over lunch, which is what the initial first applications will be targeted at: business users.
My opinion is that Microvision is a company ripe for takeover IF (a very big IF) their MEMS engine is so significantly advanced and cheaper to manufacture than other competing technologies that they can offer value. Otherwise, I, unlike you, cannot see that they have the technology or capital to succeed long term as more than a very small niche company. Their market cap is estimated at only $150 Million and they have a LONG way to go in order to achieve that. Investment in it may in the short run, make a valuable play by banking on the excitement of those who are not as deeply involved in this sector as I am. Timing is everything.
Posted on 7/25/09 at 5:40 pm to Proejo
wow.... awesome... I could tell you were involved somehow.... I really appreciate you sharing your comments... LSU alum ? Did you have to focus the DLP phone ?
thats a great point
what are your thoughts on the latest financing :
LINK
quote:
Lasers can be produced by multiples of companies around the world and so it is no small leap to expect that others will develop (and are!) their own versions of MEMS and do so in a manner that is more economical and in collaboration with some giants in the industry.
thats a great point
what are your thoughts on the latest financing :
LINK
This post was edited on 7/25/09 at 5:45 pm
Posted on 7/25/09 at 6:19 pm to Zilla
In 2004, when a 2000 lumen XGA video projector was selling to dealers at a wholesale, delivered price point of approximately $2000, I knew that in five years that would be at $500 - $600. In fact, most AV integration firms that used to sell projectors as the most profitable component of a solution today make a very small margin of a few points, if that, on projectors, settling instead to make profits by designing and installing complicated control and distribution systems.
In order to achieve market conditions where the pico projector will be imbedded in consumer devices and sell the tens of millions of units that are forecast, the price point of the imbedded devices will need to be in the $20 - $30 range. With the amount of funding Microvision has used and the amount of investment recently made, before Microvision can achieve profitability they will have to make some serious contracts, both in the supply side and in the manufacturing side. I believe that Syndiant may beat them to market with a better technology through relationships they have to produce their silicon technology. Unfortunately, they are a privately held firm. If they ever make a play to offer an IPO I would jump on it in a heartbeat.
*edit: come to think of it, no, I do not recall having to focus it.
In order to achieve market conditions where the pico projector will be imbedded in consumer devices and sell the tens of millions of units that are forecast, the price point of the imbedded devices will need to be in the $20 - $30 range. With the amount of funding Microvision has used and the amount of investment recently made, before Microvision can achieve profitability they will have to make some serious contracts, both in the supply side and in the manufacturing side. I believe that Syndiant may beat them to market with a better technology through relationships they have to produce their silicon technology. Unfortunately, they are a privately held firm. If they ever make a play to offer an IPO I would jump on it in a heartbeat.
*edit: come to think of it, no, I do not recall having to focus it.
This post was edited on 7/25/09 at 6:22 pm
Posted on 7/25/09 at 6:56 pm to Proejo
Do you mind elaborating on why you think Syndiant will beat them to market ?? Thanks again
Posted on 7/25/09 at 7:34 pm to Zilla
Without belaboring the details, the executive management team all come from within the industry with key business and consumer electronics industry relationships already in place. They are a fabless semiconductor company, with a manufacturing contract with a major semiconductor fabricator who has a well-established and reliable supply chain with more than 15 years of experience in LCOS assembly (consider the supply chain issues that Microvision has had with green lasers, as an example of problems Syndiant wouldn't have). Not only is their technology higher rez NOW, it is very scalable and they have the ability to quickly increase rez by reducing pixel size. Also, they can take advantage of LED technology instead of laser [where gov't regs will keep display brightness limited], while LED can continue to improve in light output. This is going to be EXTREMELY important when it comes to imbedding the technology in business laptops or other portable business use devices and digital signage.
Also, they are fully supported by several financial support and development groups, not venture capitalists, [who can yank funding and support at the first sign of problems]. This includes a recent $3.5M investment by the State of Texas Emerging Technology Fund.
*edit: what I'm telling you here represents reasons why the money board isn't a place to shill a stock. While Microvision has some serious support, there are numerous examples that abound of similar companies that had great technologies and a boundless future that ultimately failed. It's cool to discuss companies and technologies, but as for investing in stocks, it's caveat emptor. There are numerous companies and investor groups watching this sector closely and there are always 10 times more failures than successes. I hope you and others who purchased off your enthusiasm make tons of profits on your sale of stock but I am hedging my bet at this time.
Also, they are fully supported by several financial support and development groups, not venture capitalists, [who can yank funding and support at the first sign of problems]. This includes a recent $3.5M investment by the State of Texas Emerging Technology Fund.
*edit: what I'm telling you here represents reasons why the money board isn't a place to shill a stock. While Microvision has some serious support, there are numerous examples that abound of similar companies that had great technologies and a boundless future that ultimately failed. It's cool to discuss companies and technologies, but as for investing in stocks, it's caveat emptor. There are numerous companies and investor groups watching this sector closely and there are always 10 times more failures than successes. I hope you and others who purchased off your enthusiasm make tons of profits on your sale of stock but I am hedging my bet at this time.
This post was edited on 7/25/09 at 7:53 pm
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