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re: Current list of LSU's early entrants to NFL Draft.... (UPDATED OP)
Posted on 1/6/14 at 11:31 am to PropofoLSU
Posted on 1/6/14 at 11:31 am to PropofoLSU
quote:It's also pretty clear that you have lost control of actually making this overused joke funny.
Is pretty obvious Les has lost control of putting kids into the league.
0
Posted on 1/6/14 at 11:40 am to PurpleAndGold86
quote:
Production is not a gauge of draft projections. It isn't a hard concept.
Exactly. What college QB has accomplished more than AJ McCarron? Why is the 8th ranked QB and a 3rd round projection?
Teddy Bridgewater Louisville
Johnny Manziel Texas A&M
Blake Bortles UCF
Derek Carr Fresno State
Brett Smith Wyoming
David Fales San Jose State
Zach Mettenberger LSU
A.J. McCarron Alabama
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:24 pm to Sal Minella
Let's get back to the LSU Eleven from last year....
Barkevious Mingo - 1st round 6th overall, 4yrs, $4.1M average salary, incl $10M+ (!!) signing bonus
Eric Reid - 1st round 18th overall, 4yrs, $2.1M average salary, incl $4.5M signing bonus
Kevin Minter, linebacker - 2nd round, 4yrs, $1.1M average salary, incl $1.6M signing bonus
Bennie Logan, defensive tackle - 3rd round, 4 yrs, $758K average salary, incl $684K signing bonus
Sam Montgomery, defensive end - 3rd round, 4 yrs, $666K average salary, incl $506K signing bonus -- CUT
Tharold Simon, cornerback - 5th round, 4 yrs, $591K avarage salary, incl $207K signing bonus
Spencer Ware, running back - 6th round, 4 yrs, $564K average salary, incl $97K signing bonus
Chris Faulk, offensive tackle - UNDRAFTED, 3 yrs, $498K average salary, incl $10K signing bonus -- NON-FOOTBALL INJURY, FORFEITS 2013 SALARY
Michael Ford, running back - UNDRAFTED, 3 yrs, $496K average salary, incl $3500 signing bonus
Brad Wing, punter - UNDRAFTED, UNSIGNED
Dismissed from team, may not have had the opportunity to return to LSU in 2013....
Tyrann Mathieu, cornerback - 3rd round, 4 yrs, $763K average salary, incl $265K signing bonus
So, let's compare an undrafted/6th rounder to a 3rd rounder, since many claim there isn't much difference now under the new CBA....
Average salary is about 45-55% higher for the 3rd rounder vs 6th/undrafted guy.
Where it REALLY makes a difference is in signing bonus -- 3rd rounds get $500K-700K, whereas the other get $0-$100K.
Given the short-term nature of an NFL career, and the violence, one could argue you should not consider going pro early unless you have a good chance to go in 3rd round or higher. (see Chris Faulk or Brad Wing as this year's examples)
Also, look at high 2nd rounder (Minter) and lower 1st round (Reid). HUGE differences in signing bonuses, and overall pay. Not to mention, Eric Reid, if he pans out, will be highly desired by San Fran in year 5 and San Fran would have to pay him a 5th year salary that is the average of the third to 25th highest-paid players in the NFL at their respective positions.
Big Sam flamed out. If he would have had a chance to improve his stock just by 1 round, he could have doubled his signing bonus.
Summary:
The numbers indicate significant reward for being a 2nd or 3rd rounder versus 6th/undrafted.
The numbers indicate significant reward for being lower 1st round versus high 2nd round.
The numbers indicate significant reward for being a top 10 overall pick versus lower 1st round pick.
My problem is that LSU seems to not do a very good job of communicating this kind of real data to our players. It is a bigger issue at LSU than anywhere else.
Barkevious Mingo - 1st round 6th overall, 4yrs, $4.1M average salary, incl $10M+ (!!) signing bonus
Eric Reid - 1st round 18th overall, 4yrs, $2.1M average salary, incl $4.5M signing bonus
Kevin Minter, linebacker - 2nd round, 4yrs, $1.1M average salary, incl $1.6M signing bonus
Bennie Logan, defensive tackle - 3rd round, 4 yrs, $758K average salary, incl $684K signing bonus
Sam Montgomery, defensive end - 3rd round, 4 yrs, $666K average salary, incl $506K signing bonus -- CUT
Tharold Simon, cornerback - 5th round, 4 yrs, $591K avarage salary, incl $207K signing bonus
Spencer Ware, running back - 6th round, 4 yrs, $564K average salary, incl $97K signing bonus
Chris Faulk, offensive tackle - UNDRAFTED, 3 yrs, $498K average salary, incl $10K signing bonus -- NON-FOOTBALL INJURY, FORFEITS 2013 SALARY
Michael Ford, running back - UNDRAFTED, 3 yrs, $496K average salary, incl $3500 signing bonus
Brad Wing, punter - UNDRAFTED, UNSIGNED
Dismissed from team, may not have had the opportunity to return to LSU in 2013....
Tyrann Mathieu, cornerback - 3rd round, 4 yrs, $763K average salary, incl $265K signing bonus
So, let's compare an undrafted/6th rounder to a 3rd rounder, since many claim there isn't much difference now under the new CBA....
Average salary is about 45-55% higher for the 3rd rounder vs 6th/undrafted guy.
Where it REALLY makes a difference is in signing bonus -- 3rd rounds get $500K-700K, whereas the other get $0-$100K.
Given the short-term nature of an NFL career, and the violence, one could argue you should not consider going pro early unless you have a good chance to go in 3rd round or higher. (see Chris Faulk or Brad Wing as this year's examples)
Also, look at high 2nd rounder (Minter) and lower 1st round (Reid). HUGE differences in signing bonuses, and overall pay. Not to mention, Eric Reid, if he pans out, will be highly desired by San Fran in year 5 and San Fran would have to pay him a 5th year salary that is the average of the third to 25th highest-paid players in the NFL at their respective positions.
Big Sam flamed out. If he would have had a chance to improve his stock just by 1 round, he could have doubled his signing bonus.
Summary:
The numbers indicate significant reward for being a 2nd or 3rd rounder versus 6th/undrafted.
The numbers indicate significant reward for being lower 1st round versus high 2nd round.
The numbers indicate significant reward for being a top 10 overall pick versus lower 1st round pick.
My problem is that LSU seems to not do a very good job of communicating this kind of real data to our players. It is a bigger issue at LSU than anywhere else.
This post was edited on 1/6/14 at 12:32 pm
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:28 pm to PropofoLSU
quote:
These dudes come on tiger droppings claiming we hAve a problem because we are sending more people to the pros than any school in the country.....
I could give a shite about tigers in the NFL. But since you make such a compelling argument, we should have alot more to show for it with all these pro's than what we do.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:30 pm to Kracka
The miles butt hurt basher brigade has moved the goal posts from not developing nfl talent to now having too many players leaving for the nfl.
What a bunch of morons.
What a bunch of morons.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:33 pm to Kracka
quote:
we should have alot more to show for it with all these pro's than what we do.
Yes, because having players that can play in the NFL on a college team is directly linked to going undefeated and winning the national Championship every year. Dumbass.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:34 pm to clamdip
quote:
Brad Wing, punter - UNDRAFTED, UNSIGNED
Signed with steelers
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:40 pm to TheDoc
Wing just signed a "Reserved/Futures" contract after the season ended. That doesn't get you much other than a chance to be a camp body and compete.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:42 pm to clamdip
quote:
Brad Wing, punter - UNDRAFTED, UNSIGNED
At least when you post things, get them factually correct.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:44 pm to clamdip
quote:
My problem is that LSU seems to not do a very good job of communicating this kind of real data to our players.
maybe, maybe not. I remember after all those guys declared last yr, Les basically said they laid out the pros and cons of the decisions to the players - including the money. but he also said something to the effect of you're trying to tell kids who haven't had much (if any) money before to put off making a few hundred thousand dollars.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:45 pm to PurpleAndGold86
Brad Wing was a member of no active roster for any team during the 2013 regular season, T or F?
He was cut by Philly in preseason. He was just signed to a "futures" contract by Pittsburgh after the regular season just ended.
He was cut by Philly in preseason. He was just signed to a "futures" contract by Pittsburgh after the regular season just ended.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:46 pm to clamdip
quote:
Brad Wing was a member of no active roster for any team during the 2013 regular season, T or F?
He didn't go unsigned. So you're statement was incorrect. He was most certainly signed. He didn't win the job. That doesn't mean he didn't get signed.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:46 pm to clamdip
quote:
My problem is that LSU seems to not do a very good job of communicating this kind of real data to our players. It is a bigger issue at LSU than anywhere else.
Actually makes sense, some of those guys would never have improved their draft stock. certain positions are not valued. No reason for them to stay and go from a 5th round to a 4th round pick. Only reason to come back would have been sam, get into the top half of the first round and he would have doubled his money.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:47 pm to PurpleAndGold86
Plus if you have this category:
It would probably be more accurate to lump Wing in that category as opposed to try and prove your point about how many players LSU has that leave early for the draft.
quote:
Dismissed from team, may not have had the opportunity to return to LSU in 2013....
It would probably be more accurate to lump Wing in that category as opposed to try and prove your point about how many players LSU has that leave early for the draft.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:48 pm to Salmon
quote:Then you're not much of an LSU fan if you have no problem with players leaving to the detriment of the TEAM. Their careers and financial situations after leaving LSU are not my problem or concern.
I have no problem with kids leaving. It sucks for LSU, but it is their career.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:49 pm to BRAVEHEART
quote:
Then you're not much of an LSU fan if you have no problem with players leaving to the detriment of the TEAM. Their careers and financial situations after leaving LSU are not my problem or concern.
This wins the category for most ironic post of the day. What a piece of shite.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:51 pm to PurpleAndGold86
As if we need more evidence of a shitty fanbase.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:53 pm to dgnx6
The miles butt hurt basher brigade has moved the goal posts from not developing nfl talent to now having too many players leaving for the nfl.
What a bunch of morons.
agreed, OP posts some great info, but "LSU does not communicate well" really? You really think LSU does things so differently in its "communcation" that we lose players more than other teams would/do with similar talent etc?
Come on, really! Sort of like the old "everybody else negative recruits more than us so we need to do more neg recruiting" face it, about the only big difference between LSU and most other BCS schools is we win 80% of our games, most teams do not.
What a bunch of morons.
agreed, OP posts some great info, but "LSU does not communicate well" really? You really think LSU does things so differently in its "communcation" that we lose players more than other teams would/do with similar talent etc?
Come on, really! Sort of like the old "everybody else negative recruits more than us so we need to do more neg recruiting" face it, about the only big difference between LSU and most other BCS schools is we win 80% of our games, most teams do not.
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:57 pm to clamdip
quote:
clamdip
Great research. So could you offer your opinion on whether the following would've significantly improved their draft stock and how they would've done it. You get the benefit of hindsight.
It's the theory of many here that unless one can significantly improve one's draft status that the new CBA has deincentivized trying to stay and move up one or two rounds. It seems to be your theory that a 4 year/$2.2 million contract (Ware) isn't enough incentive to a guy like Ware as a guy with a 4 yr/$3.0 million contact. When you are making $0 and have children, that's ridiculous when there is no realistic chance of making it into the 3rd round. Again only 8 RBs were drafted in the first 4 rounds last year. I don't get how this is so hard to comprehend.
Not to mention the looming spectre of injury. For the record, Marcus Lattimore, 4th round, 4 years, $615,000. He was projecting as a 1st or 2nd round pick LINK
Could you also provide a link to where Faulk forfeits his 2013 salary? Was he cut by the Browns and his rights to him forfeited?
Tharold Simon, cornerback - 5th round, 4 yrs, $591K avarage salary, incl $207K signing bonus
Spencer Ware, running back - 6th round, 4 yrs, $564K average salary, incl $97K signing bonus
Chris Faulk, offensive tackle - UNDRAFTED, 3 yrs, $498K average salary, incl $10K signing bonus -- NON-FOOTBALL INJURY, FORFEITS 2013 SALARY Faulk explains his decision after not getting drafted
Michael Ford, running back - UNDRAFTED, 3 yrs, $496K average salary, incl $3500 signing bonus
Brad Wing, punter - UNDRAFTED, UNSIGNED ETA: No punters were drafted. I'm sure his entry into the draft had less to do with the CBA and more to do with it was time to part ways.
This post was edited on 1/6/14 at 1:01 pm
Posted on 1/6/14 at 12:57 pm to Sal Minella
quote:
Exactly. What college QB has accomplished more than AJ McCarron? Why is the 8th ranked QB and a 3rd round projection?
Accomplished championships? if that's what you mean get over it. NFL don't care. I can post a laundry lists of examples if you'd like.
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