It's fine, I really believe you that you/others feel healthy. As do I. I can google studies to back up pro-vegetarian diets as well, we could go back and forth all day if we cared.

The point is, this isn't a meat vs veg debate... As I said before, anyone that went into a steak thread talking about vegetarianism and dropping links would be seen as a troll. So that's just how I am going to see you in here.

You have your mind made, buddy. But keep in mind others are still trying to find the right fit for them... trial and error helps. We think you're really smart for knowing whatever you know ...congrats

eta: willing to bet you think not eating meat is extreme but don't think eating nothing but meat is extreme

This post was edited on 1/9/17 at 12:54 pm

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Posted by lsu777

Lake Charles

Member since Jan 2004

31811 posts

Posted on 1/9/17 at 1:14 pm to emboslice

man some idiots in this thread and junky is doing work.

A) plant based protein is not complete protein from the amino acid profiles and yes your body can tell the difference.

B) you need a minimum of .8g/protein per pound of KG tissue to support the lean tissue you are carrying, if you want to build more muscle you need more protein.

C) many of yall are saying you feel better on a veggie based diet, well no shite because you are used to eating junk. Cut the processed crap out and look into intermittent fasting, as fasting has tons of health benifits.

D) anybody that switches to a plant based diet, don't come bitching about your hdl to ldl ratio in 6 months.

E) why is it that the people that usually recommend these diets are fat with no muscle?

F) china study is about as useful as the breakfast study. think a little.

now op I sympathize and understand your desire to cut out processed crap and feel better but you are going about it all worng. you are right about the chemicals and processed crap are making you feel bad.

I highly suggest you read the book, it starts with food and look into doing the whole30 diet and do it as intended with at a minimum organic and free range veggies and meat from the grocery store but preferablly from a local farm. I suggest you go onto eatwild.com and find a local farm and hit up local farmers markets. Buy seafood off the boat, catch or kill your own etc. Eat uncured bacon, eggs from free range chickens, free range pork, etc

You should become of the mindset that you want to know where your food is from and get to where you actually believe that quality is much more important than quantity. Also get of the mindset that fat is extremely good for you when it comes from an unprocessed source and the omega 3 vs omega 6 ratio is as nature intended. this will inturn help you feel better as your body becomes less inflamed due to the free radicals being diminsihed and your ratio of fats getting closer to how we need them. (in general we eat way too much omega 6 fats due to the way our normal meats are grain fed or at a minimum grain finished)

Not trying to be mean but most in this thread are giving terrible advice. and if anybody ever sites the china study, do the exact opposite of them. also please remember corralation does not equal causation.

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Posted by Junky

Louisiana

Member since Oct 2005

8423 posts

Posted on 1/9/17 at 7:36 pm to emboslice

All right, let us begin on why you shouldn't be vegetarian or vegan. This is based on biology...not ideology and pixie dust.

The first question I ask is do you have a Rumen?

quote:
The reticulorumen is one of the few organs present in animals in which digestion of cellulose and other recalcitrant carbohydrates can proceed to any appreciable degree

Cellulose

quote:
Cellulose is an important structural component of the primary cell wall of green plants, many forms of algae and the oomycetes.

- Let me answer this for you...you do not have a rumen. You cannot digest the fiber and cellulose the way a ruminant can.

What is a Ruminant?

quote:
"Ruminants are mammals that are able to acquire nutrients from plant-based food by fermenting it in a specialized stomach prior to digestion, principally through microbial actions."

quote:
"One feature of ruminants is their continuously growing teeth. During grazing, the silica content in forage causes abrasion of the teeth. This abrasion is compensated for by continuous tooth growth throughout the ruminant's life, as opposed to humans or other nonruminants, whose teeth stop growing after a particular age. Most ruminants do not have upper incisors; instead, they have a thick dental pad to thoroughly chew plant-based food."

How does the Rumen work?

quote:
"Carbohydrate digestion in the rumen - When food is eaten by the cow, the nutrients are initially in the form of carbohydrates, proteins, and fats…Plant tissue dry matter is about 75% carbohydrate. Microbial fermentation breaks carbohydrates down into simple sugars. The microbes use these sugars as an energy source for the own growth and make end products, which are used by the cow…."end products being fatty acids (acetate) propionate and butyrate. "Rumen microbes ferment all carbohydrates….cell-wall material is digested slowly.

...in a nutshell...

So how are you going to absorb all those nutrients in those plants when a human doesn't even have the hardware to digest it?

Do you worry about your O3 to O6 ratios? you should. (lsu777's point D)... LINK

quote:
Conclusions: The proportions of plasma long-chain n-3 fatty acids were not significantly affected by the duration of adherence to a vegetarian or vegan diet. This finding suggests that when animal foods are wholly excluded from the diet, the endogenous production of EPA and DHA results in low but stable plasma concentrations of these fatty acids.

B12?

quote:
TISSUE VITAMIN B12 deficiency can be due to inadequate intake (as seen in vegans), acquired malabsorption (as seen in pernicious anemia), or various inborn errors of cobalamin (Cbl) metabolism.

B12

quote:
Overall, these results confirm the notion that a vegan diet is deficient in vitamin B(12), which may have an unfavorable effect on CHD risk.

Osteoporosis?

quote:
The findings gathered consistently support the hypothesis that vegans do have lower bone mineral density than their non-vegan counterparts

Vitamin D3

quote:
The lack of food sources high in Vitamin D3 necessitates higher-than-normal UVB exposure to ensure that the body maintains adequate Vitamin D3 levels. Without this critical nutrient, even the most optimal calcium levels will be inadequate in maintaining bone mass.

Let's not even start on cholesterol.

I could list more, and go on and on and on, but you wont read them. Theology has taken over, and I can only open eyes.

As I mentioned towards the top of this post - you do not have the antimony of a cow, nor a gorilla, nor a bison, nor a horse. These animals gut microbes covert the fiber into short chain fatty acids which they use for the majority of their energy intake ...basically.

To which...

quote:
The point is, this isn't a meat vs veg debate... As I said before, anyone that went into a steak thread talking about vegetarianism and dropping links would be seen as a troll. So that's just how I am going to see you in here.

You have no rumen to digest and absorb the Cellulose Fiber that the animals listed earlier do. No hardware to absorb all of the nutrients. So making that case based on biology qualifies me as a troll?