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Started By
Message
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:14 pm to lsuroadie
quote:
Yea ahhhhh.. I'm not an expert on LE, but I do know when a cop tells you to do something, you freaking do it. You can work out all the violations, poor attitudes, offending people later.
There seems to be a general lack of respect for police these days.
When you see shite like this, it's not too hard to wonder why. Wearing a badge is not carte blanche to assault people disproportionally to their perceived resistance.
quote:
There's alot of thuggish behavior and wrongful actions by police, don't get me wrong, but I have no problem with this. You want the cop to do a medical background on the guy before he arrests him?
Nah, I'd be good if he took his arm off of his neck when 4 other cops had the guy subdued on the ground and were in the process of handcuffing him.
quote:
The arrestee put himself in this situation, not the cop...just like Michael Brown
Not immediately capitulating doesn't give a police officer a right to kill you.
I'm still flabbergasted some are taking the side of the cop here.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:15 pm to the808bass
Your hurling insults does nothing for your argument.
quote:if by self serving you mean critical thinking and delving I to the subtleties and semantics of the case then yes. I wanted people to look at the link I provided and maybe learn something new.
as self-serving and ridiculous as I've seen here.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:15 pm to RedStickBR
im not screaming murder
A reasonable argument can be made
Generally in the book of fox mulder, if you assault someone and they die as a result of your actions
You're a murdering murderer
Same reason people call drunk drivers murderers...what did you expect when you were crushing his neck and he was telling you he couldn't breathe
What did you expect when you drank a 1/5 and got behind the wheel
Manslaughter was a slam dunk here.
A reasonable argument can be made
Generally in the book of fox mulder, if you assault someone and they die as a result of your actions
You're a murdering murderer
Same reason people call drunk drivers murderers...what did you expect when you were crushing his neck and he was telling you he couldn't breathe
What did you expect when you drank a 1/5 and got behind the wheel
Manslaughter was a slam dunk here.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:15 pm to meauxjeaux2
I don't know what the policy is, but that was excessive force.
I find it interesting that a NYC jury failed to indict. I would like to see what information/evidence they were given.
But, that was excessive force. The guy should not have resisted arrest, but that wrong action on his part should not have resulted in his death.
I find it interesting that a NYC jury failed to indict. I would like to see what information/evidence they were given.
But, that was excessive force. The guy should not have resisted arrest, but that wrong action on his part should not have resulted in his death.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:16 pm to meauxjeaux2
quote:
holy shite. You responded directly to me.
You've been on TD far too long to not have figured this out by now. Go back and read that post buddy, it was clearly to Fox Mulder. You're just having all types of trouble today, arent you?
This post was edited on 12/3/14 at 10:23 pm
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:17 pm to onmymedicalgrind
Homocide wasn't the OPs question. The OP is trying to determine if NYPD policy was violated by use of a choke hold. This is because some have claimed that using it in violation shows negligence which should have led to charges.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:21 pm to DelU249
Manslaughter may have been a slam dunk. But when the rioting masses, most of which aren't trained in the law, exert public pressure on a prosecutor to bring a murder charge when murder isn't present, it presents a perfect opportunity for a wily (to use boosie's word) prosecutor to bring a murder charge whilst knowing it will never stick, all while saving face along the way.
We heard similar things re: the Trayvon case. The fact is, we've got so many emotional nitwits running around screaming to bring charges they themselves know nothing about that we've likely overcharged numerous folks now in these cases who very likely could have been found guilty of lesser charges.
We heard similar things re: the Trayvon case. The fact is, we've got so many emotional nitwits running around screaming to bring charges they themselves know nothing about that we've likely overcharged numerous folks now in these cases who very likely could have been found guilty of lesser charges.
This post was edited on 12/3/14 at 10:22 pm
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:21 pm to C
Ding ding ding,we have a winner here folks.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:21 pm to meauxjeaux2
quote:
Your hurling insults does nothing for your argument. quote: as self-serving and ridiculous as I've seen here. if by self serving you mean critical thinking and delving I to the subtleties and semantics of the case then yes. I wanted people to look at the link I provided and maybe learn something new.
Naw. You were on your cop forums discussing with a bunch of other cops how it's not really a chokehold. It doesn't matter. Call it a fluffy pink bunny hold. It killed him. Dead. What it's called and whether or not it is allowed by the police policy is irrelevant. It is an improper use of force especially with respect to this individual situation. And it was the proximate cause of the death of a non-violent offender of a minor tax statute. If you're ok with that, you're part of the problem.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:21 pm to boosiebadazz
quote:
not immediately capitulating doesnt give the cop the right to kill him
I'm sure his intent was to kill him? Cmon man...
If 999 out 1000 people survive that arrest with no health repercussions and the one in a thousand dies because of extremely poor health....that's murder?
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:22 pm to C
quote:
Homocide wasn't the OPs question. The OP is trying to determine if NYPD policy was violated by use of a choke hold. This is because some have claimed that using it in violation shows negligence which should have led to charges.
What should have lead to charges was that they killed him.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:23 pm to lsuroadie
quote:
If 999 out 1000 people survive that arrest with no health repercussions and the one in a thousand dies because of extremely poor health....that's murder?
If a drug killed 1 out of a 1000 people who used it, it would be taken off the shelf. A practice like this "hold" has no place in a police repertoire except in places where lethal force is warranted. This case wasn't it.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:24 pm to the808bass
This is negligent homicide aka in some states as manslaughter. Take off the police uniform and just make it a plain street fight and he is indicted 100% of the time and pleads out or is convicted 96% of the time.
If you watch true detective the greatest quote of all time about this is by Rust to a hooker.
Lucy: What's your deal?
Detective Rust Cohle: I don't have "a deal"
Lucy: I mean what do you do? Nevermind, I thought you were gonna bust me.
Detective Rust Cohle: I told you, I'm not interested.
Lucy: Yeah, I know. You're kinda strange, like you might be dangerous.
Detective Rust Cohle: Of course I'm dangerous. I'm police. I can do terrible things to people with impunity.
If you watch true detective the greatest quote of all time about this is by Rust to a hooker.
Lucy: What's your deal?
Detective Rust Cohle: I don't have "a deal"
Lucy: I mean what do you do? Nevermind, I thought you were gonna bust me.
Detective Rust Cohle: I told you, I'm not interested.
Lucy: Yeah, I know. You're kinda strange, like you might be dangerous.
Detective Rust Cohle: Of course I'm dangerous. I'm police. I can do terrible things to people with impunity.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:24 pm to the808bass
quote:
If you're ok with that, you're part of the problem.
Yep. There aren't alot of good cops out there, because I don't think you can be classified as a "good cop" if you continuously defend the bad ones.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:24 pm to the808bass
quote:ok buddy. Whatever you say. It's no surprise you and others have misdirected outrage towards either the individual cop of the department policies. I can't tell either was to tell the truth because your words and thoughts are so clouded with pure ignorance. I'm sorry to say that but you just said you don't care. That makes no sense at all.
it's not really a chokehold. It doesn't matter. Call it a fluffy pink bunny hold. It killed him. Dead. What it's called and whether or not it is allowed by the police policy is irrelevant
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:29 pm to meauxjeaux2
Frick that noise - the cigarette issue is irrelevant. He resisted and therefore brought the actions of law enforcement upon himself. Plain and simple - failure to comply.
I've seen this behavior damn near on a daily basis for the last 15 years as a public school coach/teacher. A certain segment (cough, cough) of our population must learn that actions have consequences.
I've seen this behavior damn near on a daily basis for the last 15 years as a public school coach/teacher. A certain segment (cough, cough) of our population must learn that actions have consequences.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:30 pm to lsuroadie
Let's stay away from legally-significant words like murder. This wasn't murder.
I'm just asking if you see anything (ANYTHING?!?!) wrong with the way the cops handled this?
If so, great, we can move on to what he should have been charged with and why.
If not, then nothing will enrage you and you've pretty much capitulated to our law enforcement overlords, and anything further is just me wasting my time.
I'm just asking if you see anything (ANYTHING?!?!) wrong with the way the cops handled this?
If so, great, we can move on to what he should have been charged with and why.
If not, then nothing will enrage you and you've pretty much capitulated to our law enforcement overlords, and anything further is just me wasting my time.
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:31 pm to meauxjeaux2
I don't care about the semantics of the verbiage used to describe the police officer's "hold." It was a fatal hold. And it was unwarranted.
You watch the video and see a "bad guy" because he's breaking a law and then refusing to follow a cop command. In your neural pathways, you justify whatever happens next because that's the way you've been trained. That's the problem. Officer Pantaleo did the same thing. "Bad guy" = "subdue by any means necessary"
You watch the video and see a "bad guy" because he's breaking a law and then refusing to follow a cop command. In your neural pathways, you justify whatever happens next because that's the way you've been trained. That's the problem. Officer Pantaleo did the same thing. "Bad guy" = "subdue by any means necessary"
Posted on 12/3/14 at 10:32 pm to Coach72
quote:
Coach72
quote:
Member since Dec 2009
quote:
113 posts
Damn Garner got the cop defenders coming out the wood work!
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