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Open and Objective Discussion about the strengths and needs of this defense
Posted on 10/29/12 at 2:58 pm
Posted on 10/29/12 at 2:58 pm
So how about instead of useless "lets get rid of everyone threads", why don't we actually discuss what this defense is good at and what positions you think need the most addressing come offseason.
This defense has been pretty bad against the pass lately. WRs and TEs run free in our secondary for huge gains without a defender within 5 yards. Greer is really only the consistent guy back there and that isn't saying much. I'm not giving up in Robinson just yet; you can see there's talent but he's also had some pretty horrendous plays. Neither White nor Patrick are the answer IMO. Porter wanted too much money and that was the right decision, but we haven't truly found a replacement.
Deduction - huge need at CB.
Honestly, this defense has been pretty good against runs up the middle. This was pretty evident after last night when McGehee and the other back were slashing to the outside for 10 yards nearly every run. Cutback runs have been a successful staple against this defense for a few years now.
- deduction - huge need at OLB.
This isn't a "I'm giving up on the season" thread. Honestly no matter how the rest of the season plays out these are our 2 biggest needs IMO.
This defense has been pretty bad against the pass lately. WRs and TEs run free in our secondary for huge gains without a defender within 5 yards. Greer is really only the consistent guy back there and that isn't saying much. I'm not giving up in Robinson just yet; you can see there's talent but he's also had some pretty horrendous plays. Neither White nor Patrick are the answer IMO. Porter wanted too much money and that was the right decision, but we haven't truly found a replacement.
Deduction - huge need at CB.
Honestly, this defense has been pretty good against runs up the middle. This was pretty evident after last night when McGehee and the other back were slashing to the outside for 10 yards nearly every run. Cutback runs have been a successful staple against this defense for a few years now.
- deduction - huge need at OLB.
This isn't a "I'm giving up on the season" thread. Honestly no matter how the rest of the season plays out these are our 2 biggest needs IMO.
9
Posted on 10/29/12 at 2:59 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
I recognize pass rusher is also a pretty big need, but I don't think as much as the above listed. Also, I don't think well be picking high enough to get someone worthy of our first pick.
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:06 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
I'm a believer that if our front four gets more pressure then our secondary immediately becomes more servicable.
I think Dline is where we need to start first in the offseason.
Spags needs to put his finger prints on our draft IMO.
I think Dline is where we need to start first in the offseason.
Spags needs to put his finger prints on our draft IMO.
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:07 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
Strengths of the D:
-persistent in legal battles
-Jenkins doesn't give up on a play
-Harper's neck circumference is 1.5x larger than any other other safety in the league; grey:black ratio of hair color also above average
-Curtis Lofton
Weaknesses:
-everything else
-persistent in legal battles
-Jenkins doesn't give up on a play
-Harper's neck circumference is 1.5x larger than any other other safety in the league; grey:black ratio of hair color also above average
-Curtis Lofton
Weaknesses:
-everything else
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:11 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
Spags D starts with pressure from the front 4.
Jordan Hicks are keepers. The rest, meh. I might have missed a couple but those two keep
LB's- Lofton keeper. The rest, meh. Vilma looked lost at will
CB's- None look good w/o pressure. Greer/Jenkins keepers, Patrick and Robinson I don't think you can give up on yet
so maybe 5-6 keepers, need alot over there. Again start with the line, have to get pressure from there and stop the run.
It just feels overwhelming, like it cannot be fixed. It can but that's alot of players that ain't worth keeping
Jordan Hicks are keepers. The rest, meh. I might have missed a couple but those two keep
LB's- Lofton keeper. The rest, meh. Vilma looked lost at will
CB's- None look good w/o pressure. Greer/Jenkins keepers, Patrick and Robinson I don't think you can give up on yet
so maybe 5-6 keepers, need alot over there. Again start with the line, have to get pressure from there and stop the run.
It just feels overwhelming, like it cannot be fixed. It can but that's alot of players that ain't worth keeping
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:17 pm to stapuffmarshy
Hicks and Jordan will be great.
Bunkley is good for stopping the run.
We saw what happened last night when he wasn't around.
What we really need is a DE or two that can really disrupt the offense.
I don't know where to go from there.
OLB or CB?
Bunkley is good for stopping the run.
We saw what happened last night when he wasn't around.
What we really need is a DE or two that can really disrupt the offense.
I don't know where to go from there.
OLB or CB?
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:26 pm to Hoodoo Man
Texans completely revamped their defense in one offseason 2010-2011. It can be done.
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:28 pm to Hoodoo Man
Everyone keeps saying how great Jordan will be. I hope you guys mean at DT right? At DE he is a horrible pass rusher.
I also see people talking about Jenkins as a keeper. Why exactly would anyone say this? The guy is a talented athlete, but he is always out of position or late getting over to a wr. This has been the case his entire short career so far. Our safeties in general seem to never be where they are supposed to be.
I also see people talking about Jenkins as a keeper. Why exactly would anyone say this? The guy is a talented athlete, but he is always out of position or late getting over to a wr. This has been the case his entire short career so far. Our safeties in general seem to never be where they are supposed to be.
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:37 pm to landrywasbeast30
quote:
Our safeties in general seem to never be where they are supposed to be.
Is this a product of player skill or coaching?
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:46 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
Strength: Hicks
Needs: Everywhere else
Needs: Everywhere else
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:50 pm to Sir Saint
Jenkins' skill is that he's a pretty good tackler. He's frequently out of position but he seems to always make the tackle if be gets ahold of someone. That's somewhat rare for a defensive back these days.
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:52 pm to landrywasbeast30
quote:
At DE he is a horrible pass rusher
There's more to playing DE than just getting sacks
Posted on 10/29/12 at 3:57 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
A pass rush immediately makes the secondary look better. It doesn't matter if it's an olb, de, or dt. We just need someone that can rush the passer. Before the season started I had hoped that Martez could develop into that guy, but I'm not sure now. There has to be some reason he hasn't gotten onto the field more. Pass rushers are also extremely hard to find outside of the very top of the draft. If that's where we are at the end of the year then that's what we should target.
Posted on 10/29/12 at 4:07 pm to Mouth
quote:
I'm a believer that if our front four gets more pressure then our secondary immediately becomes more servicable.
I think Dline is where we need to start first in the offseason.
Spags needs to put his finger prints on our draft IMO.
I'll go with this answer
Posted on 10/29/12 at 4:19 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
quote:
this defense has been pretty good against runs up the middle.
lol wut?
quote:
Open and Objective Discussion about the strengths and needs of this defense
There are two really good players on this defense. Lofton is very good and Greer is a good cornerback.
There are some average players on this defense. Jordan is a starting caliber DE. Hicks and Gallett look like good talent to build around. Bunkley is ok. Harper and Jenkins I think would be ok if there was some pass rush.
There are some below par players on this team as well. Shanle and Herron make me want to puke. Ellis is bad. Patrick Robinson has issues as does Corey White.
Will Smith falls between average and below par.
This isn't something that can be done over the next year. It's going to take a committment to draft highly rated defensive players over a period of years and bring in better position coaches, a la Mike Singletary or someone like that.
As for Spags: I think Gregg Williams is a hell of a defensive coordinator. I think Williams > Spags. I'm not saying fire Spags, but I don't think he has much to work with. That being said, I'd expect something, anything, anything at all compared to what we have. Sell out to stop the run or sell out and blitz the passer or something. The players we have are bad. But they aren't as bad as what we are seeing on the field. Some of that has to fall on Spags.
Posted on 10/29/12 at 4:27 pm to Brettesaurus Rex
DE's and safeties in draft. (o-line is about the only off. position I would draft)
OLB's via free agency and trades.
OLB's via free agency and trades.
Posted on 10/29/12 at 4:31 pm to goatmilker
quote:
DE's and safeties in draft.
There are actually a few decent safties in free agency this year.
Posted on 10/29/12 at 4:55 pm to Suntiger
If we pick top 5 I say go after one of the premier pass rushers. If not I take someone like Millner in the first and Sean Porter in the 2nd
Posted on 10/29/12 at 5:00 pm to landrywasbeast30
quote:
Everyone keeps saying how great Jordan will be. I hope you guys mean at DT right? At DE he is a horrible pass rusher.
I love people that don't understand football.
THE TV SAID HE CAN'T RUSH THE PASSER! WHY IS HE PLAYING DEFENSIVE END??!?!!?!???!?!
Posted on 10/29/12 at 7:25 pm to BarbeTiger
What a horrible way to defend the guy. More than any other position on the field, it's the DE's job to put pressure on the qb. Smith and Jordan aren't coming close to the qb. That's the biggest problem on the team. If they wanted a guy who was good against the run but couldn't get to the qb, why didn't they just keep Alex Brown? IF you want a DE who holds up against the run, switch to a 3-4 defense.
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